Discussion of Bills that remove the Per Country Limits - H.R.3012, H,R. 213

[jackbrown_890]

Yesterday I sat for 8 hours to find what is behind Schmuer's bill. I didnt see him addressing , not even his face shown in the tv for the entire day. Then where the hell did he introduce the bill?

Yesterday's debate was revolving around Balanced Budget amendment and nothing else. ( Grassley gave me his attendence :-))

I also watched C-span for hours, my roommate told me i am crazy..he was like, who watches C-span in this country? anyways,


Right now i will support the bill. It seems like first E-3 visas were for Australians and had not much to do with H1b..i would like to see they do not change H1b numbers.
Seems like Irish community is actually not opposing 3012 or similar bill, they just want to include their own provisions in any of these bills. So in the end i will support this bill too.

looking at this new bill/ in one way 3012 is dead but on the other hand 1983 includes everything 3012 had plus E-3 for Irish, so not totally dead yet. (official text is not out yet)

[immitime]

I also watched C-span for hours, my roommate told me i am crazy..he was like, who watches C-span in this country? anyways,


Right now i will support the bill. It seems like first E-3 visas were for Australians and had not much to do with H1b..i would like to see they do not change H1b numbers.
Seems like Irish community is actually not opposing 3012 or similar bill, they just want to include their own provisions in any of these bills. So in the end i will support this bill too.

looking at this new bill/ in one way 3012 is dead but on the other hand 1983 includes everything 3012 had plus E-3 for Irish, so not totally dead yet. (official text is not out yet)

Country quota will be eliminated at any cost I think, see any senator introducing any bill have the elimination of country quota provision in it. So they are so sure that "elimination of per country quota" + along with their interests will move in House and Senate.

HR 3012 already passed The house, this S.1983 bill definitely have to go to House for passage of E-3 Visa allocation of Irish and a pinch of Illegal amnesty in it. Wait for the drama to unveil completely. It is like Elections days here for rest of this year! All the interest groups are trying to add their wish aolng with "country quota elimination" Politricks! Finally elimination of country quota should come out as winner.

[imdeng]

Man - this is messed up! We are looking for fairness - FIFO - and here people are trying to add amendments for special groups!! Why on earth would Irish need a special visa - for that matter - why do Australians have the special E-3 visa? Dealing with politics and politicians is so frustrating. I used to be mad at all the stupid politicians in India - things are better in US - there is no blatant corruption - but there still is so much chaos behind the curtain. This is so awful and sad.

[imdeng]

What do the Irish gain by E-3 visa? H1B is now not oversubscribed - they can very well work in US on H1B. E-3 happens to be a non-immigration-intent visa as well - I fail to see the benefit. Singapore/Chile that has a 6K block reserved in the H1B quota for them have a much better deal.

What is their argument regarding why an Irish E-3 visa (as opposed to an E-3 visa available to anybody) be better for the US economy? I don't think anybody can make this case effectively. If there is any common sense among the politicians, this amendment should fail. It is indicative of the "race preference" that an Irish E-3 visa has support of at least some Senators while a similar E-3 visa for any non-Western-Europe will be dead on arrival.

[gcq]

What do the Irish gain by E-3 visa? H1B is now not oversubscribed - they can very well work in US on H1B. E-3 happens to be a non-immigration-intent visa as well - I fail to see the benefit. Singapore/Chile that has a 6K block reserved in the H1B quota for them have a much better deal.

What is their argument regarding why an Irish E-3 visa (as opposed to an E-3 visa available to anybody) be better for the US economy? I don't think anybody can make this case effectively. If there is any common sense among the politicians, this amendment should fail. It is indicative of the "race preference" that an Irish E-3 visa has support of at least some Senators while a similar E-3 visa for any non-Western-Europe will be dead on arrival.

The difference between reserved H1B and E3-Irish ? Amnesty.
Irish lobby is targeting amnesty for Irish by this bill. Clearly it will face huge hurdles in house. Irish lobby is powerful so Schumer cannot ignore their request. So he introduced the bill knowing it won't make any traction in house.

[imdeng]

There can't be too many Irish illegals in this country - right? There isn't a border for them to cross and come. Ireland is doing pretty well and they are in EU - Irish citizens can go and work in any country in the EU. Makes no sense for many illegal Irish citizens to be in US.

The difference between reserved H1B and E3-Irish ? Amnesty.
Irish lobby is targeting amnesty for Irish by this bill. Clearly it will face huge hurdles in house. Irish lobby is powerful so Schumer cannot ignore their request. So he introduced the bill knowing it won't make any traction in house.

[gcq]

There can't be too many Irish illegals in this country - right? There isn't a border for them to cross and come. Ireland is doing pretty well and they are in EU - Irish citizens can go and work in any country in the EU. Makes no sense for many illegal Irish citizens to be in US.

Many europeans including british do immigrate to US. I have heard from brits that UK is not that good. Europeans come to US through Visa waiver program and stay back. That is how they become illegals.

[immitime]

There can't be too many Irish illegals in this country - right? There isn't a border for them to cross and come. Ireland is doing pretty well and they are in EU - Irish citizens can go and work in any country in the EU. Makes no sense for many illegal Irish citizens to be in US.

So now there are four different bills which includes the elimination of per country quota.

S1983--------> Irish E3 visas includes the same provision of 3012 -----dog seen a fire hydrant to have his mark!
Agree Act-----> the provisions of HR3012/S1857 ------another fire hydrant case
HR3012----->Grassley has put a hold on this bill.---I guess due to political reason
S1857-------> is the Senate version of the 3012 bill -----Helping HR 3012 to become law Exact Photostat copy.

Wiat and See how many more bills to come with differnt interests! but ultimately the common factor will become LAW, that is the Political Science!

[imdeng]

Agree that S1983 is a fire hydrant case - but not AGREE Act. AGREE has a lot of other stuff which are meaningful by themselves other than the HR-3012 component.

So now there are four different bills which includes the elimination of per country quota.

S1983--------> Irish E3 visas includes the same provision of 3012 -----dog seen a fire hydrant to have his mark!
Agree Act-----> the provisions of HR3012/S1857 ------another fire hydrant case
HR3012----->Grassley has put a hold on this bill.---I guess due to political reason
S1857-------> is the Senate version of the 3012 bill -----Helping HR 3012 to become law Exact Photostat copy.

Wiat and See how many more bills to come with differnt interests! but ultimately the common factor will become LAW, that is the Political Science!

[codesmith]

Just wanted to update Q members.
I'll remove this post at the end of day.

From : http://immigration-law.com/
12/14/2011: Three Most Powerful Democrats Introduced in Senate Compromised Employment-Based/Family-Based Immigration Bill

Sen Chuck Schumer of New York, co-sponsored Sen. Dick Durbin of Illinois and Sen. Leahy of Vermont, introduced yesterday S.1983 to eliminate the per-country numerical limitation for employment-based immigrants, to increase the per-country numerical limitation for family-sponsored immigrants, and for other reform. Obviously other reform includes relief of Irish which we discussed during last few days. It thus appears that this bill could be a bill to compromise H.R. 3012 and Irish relief. Read on. It thus appears that rather than introducing Irish relief bill, he added Irish E-3 visa and illegal Irish relief provision to H.R. 3012 which the House passes. Full text has yet to be made available. Stay tuned.

[nayekal]

Just wanted to update Q members.
I'll remove this post at the end of day.

From : http://immigration-law.com/
12/14/2011: Three Most Powerful Democrats Introduced in Senate Compromised Employment-Based/Family-Based Immigration Bill

Sen Chuck Schumer of New York, co-sponsored Sen. Dick Durbin of Illinois and Sen. Leahy of Vermont, introduced yesterday S.1983 to eliminate the per-country numerical limitation for employment-based immigrants, to increase the per-country numerical limitation for family-sponsored immigrants, and for other reform. Obviously other reform includes relief of Irish which we discussed during last few days. It thus appears that this bill could be a bill to compromise H.R. 3012 and Irish relief. Read on. It thus appears that rather than introducing Irish relief bill, he added Irish E-3 visa and illegal Irish relief provision to H.R. 3012 which the House passes. Full text has yet to be made available. Stay tuned.

It is confusing to see that a new bill S.1983, which is similar to HR 3012 with regards to the content except adding Irish relief package. But it doesn't say any thing about the hold placed on HR 3012, by Senator Grassley, whether it was removed or not.

Gurus, Does any know how it works right now? Does it have to go through house or senate first. Looks like this is a new bill, so it should go through house first and then to senate. In case if the provision is added to HR 3012, then I think, it will go to house once again.

[jackbrown_890]

at this time any legislative action would be a great help..
i checked judiciary committee's next meeting on 15th,, none of these bills r on d list.
so lets hope one would show up in d next meeting,,,hopefully on 23rd.

[jackbrown_890]

also, there is a chance 1983 may move in the house judiciary since leahy is a co-sponsor and he is chair of Senate Judiciary...and i would like to see Mike Lee co-sponsor it. but because of E-3 Mike lee or any other republican may back down,,..but lets hope schumer will be able to convince few republicans to co-sponsor this bill,

[immitime]

also, there is a chance 1983 may move in the house judiciary since leahy is a co-sponsor and he is chair of Senate Judiciary...and i would like to see Mike Lee co-sponsor it. but because of E-3 Mike lee or any other republican may back down,,..but lets hope schumer will be able to convince few republicans to co-sponsor this bill,

Now, this is like saying to remove per country quota, we need to wait for the E-3 Visa allocation for Irish [i}Legals. for each "Fire Hydrant" bill this can happen. But one thing is sure The support for 3012 is strong and stable and it continues, on one senators whims and fancies to hold multiple bills on his interest. But that is politics. Hope grassley changes his mind soon.

More over RTE reports 1983 is an amendment with H.R.3012.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Sen...135569518.html

[immitime]

also, there is a chance 1983 may move in the house judiciary since leahy is a co-sponsor and he is chair of Senate Judiciary...and i would like to see Mike Lee co-sponsor it. but because of E-3 Mike lee or any other republican may back down,,..but lets hope schumer will be able to convince few republicans to co-sponsor this bill,

You are right Jackbrown.

http://irishecho.com/?p=68441

See what immigration-law have to say below. h

ttp://www.immigration-law.com/

12/14/2011: Irish Community - A Big Comrade to H.R. 3012

This site reported, immediately after the passage of H.R. 3012 in the House, Irish move to amend H.R. 3012 because they saw it a fantastic opportunity to get their immigration agenda through the Congress. Why? Because it was unprecedent that a bill had passed in the House 389 to 15 majority yeas. This site thus reported the Irish move will turn out to be an asset for the H.R. 3012 sponsors to tackle the opposition in the Senate. At the end of the day, H.R. 3012 may not survive itself but the substance and goals of H.R. 3012 had a chance to survive in different forms as seen in Sen. Chuck Schumer's S. 1983. Senator Schumer, a big veteran legislator, skillfully handled the matter by bypassing H.R. 3012 or its companion bill, S. 1857 and introducing it as a separate bill, S. 1983. Look who is cosponsoring S. 1983, Senator Dick Durbin!! The pal of Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa in piecemeal employment-based immigration opposition! Click here to see how hard the Irish community is lobbying for the bill. What an astonishing and unanticipated big ally for the H.R. 3012!

[feedmyback]

12/14/2011: Irish Community - A Big Comrade to H.R. 3012 (Courtesy: Oh Law Firm)

This site reported, immediately after the passage of H.R. 3012 in the House, Irish move to amend H.R. 3012 because they saw it a fantastic opportunity to get their immigration agenda through the Congress. Why? Because it was unprecedent that a bill had passed in the House 389 to 15 majority yeas. This site thus reported the Irish move will turn out to be an asset for the H.R. 3012 sponsors to tackle the opposition in the Senate. At the end of the day, H.R. 3012 may not survive itself but the substance and goals of H.R. 3012 had a chance to survive in different forms as seen in Sen. Chuck Schumer's S. 1983. Senator Schumer, a big veteran legislator, skillfully handled the matter by bypassing H.R. 3012 or its companion bill, S. 1857 and introducing it as a separate bill, S. 1983. Look who is cosponsoring S. 1983, Senator Dick Durbin!! The pal of Senator Chuck Grassley of Iowa in piecemeal employment-based immigration opposition! Click here to see how hard the Irish community is lobbying for the bill. What an astonishing and unanticipated big ally for the H.R. 3012!

Now, this is like saying to remove per country quota, we need to wait for the E-3 Visa allocation for Irish [i}Legals. for each "Fire Hydrant" bill this can happen. But one thing is sure The support for 3012 is strong and stable and it continues, on one senators whims and fancies to hold multiple bills on his interest. But that is politics. Hope grassley changes his mind soon.

More over RTE reports 1983 is an amendment with H.R.3012.

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Sen...135569518.html

[mesan123]

Will all these new bills and addition of irish peice to HR 3012...what r the chances of any of this bill becoming law next few months

[imdeng]

Any activity is better than no activity. There are several paths for HR-3012 open still. AGREE Act is getting co-sponsors. We need a vote held in Senate on any of the related bills - does not matter which one.
The vibe I am getting is that HR-3012 is not dead, far from it - it has so much life that it is attracting all the hanger-ons that want to ride its coat-tails (also referred to as dog-hydrant effect in this forum :-). All this activity will sooner or later result in some kind of vote and resolution. Although it does not seem like it will happen very soon.

Will all these new bills and addition of irish peice to HR 3012...what r the chances of any of this bill becoming law next few months

[mesan123]

Thnx for ur reply imdeng....the reason is...with this it looks like 50% chances for the bill to pass senate in next couple of months...if additions done then it need to pass house again....with all this in mind.....will there be any more movement in EB2I/C? i know CO mentioned there may be.....but if the HR 3012 bill( or) any bill per say doesnt progress any further will not CO maintain the same date for a month or 2 before he makes a decision to move further or retrogress...

is the current date movement not enough incase any of immigration bill is passed in next 3 months or so....

kanmani behen you can tell ur opinion....u also follow the bill more ....

[Kanmani]

Mesan

The passing of HR 3012 in the house spilled no impact over the advancement of EB2 PDs in January 2012 visa bulletin . This is purely my opinion .

The bill was already on objection when the Jan bulletin got released, moreover DoS knew nothing is certain until it becomes law. So if they find the inventory is still insufficient, they would certainly move the dates irrespective of where 3012 hangs.

[jackbrown_890]

I hope congress reaches to some deal on payroll tax cut soon.. that is consuming everyone's time. as soon as that deal has reached we may see some movement on other bills. also it will be interesting to see tonight's GOP debate and see if anyone brings up immigration issue,specially high-skilled immigration..

[qesehmk]

guys ... this is my 2 cents for these additions about Irish quota and other bills.

Typically these are indicative of people who are opposed to the original bill but they don't necessarily want to take an anti stance.

Introduction of a paraller bill is meant to generate controversy to kill the original bill. Here is an example: when the original non-discrimination bill was introduced in US senate - it only included non-discrimination on the base of race, religion, age and nationality. It didn't include gender then. The southern democrats (i.e. today's republicans) were opposed to this kind of bill in their true fashion. So some wise guy introduced gender in order to turn southern men against this bill. Fortunately this had opposite effect and the bill became what it is today (i.e. made it illegal to discriminate based on age, nationality, race, religion and sex).

So coming back to HR3012 and what schumer is proposing about Irish quota and this and that - is exactly in the same league as the example mentioned above. So folks - make a note of this in your mind. HR3012 still has a good chance. But Schumer clearly is not a friend of EB-IC people.

Will all these new bills and addition of irish peice to HR 3012...what r the chances of any of this bill becoming law next few months

[imdeng]

I agree.

This process clearly illustrates that when we become GC/Citizens, we must be politically active via our money. Contribute to Senators/Congressman who takes your side on the issues. I wish people waiting for GCs could contribute too - then there will be a better recognition of our voice since politicians will be competing for our money.

Schumer clearly is not a friend of EB-IC people.

[essenel]

So, according to the Washington Post, lawmakers are getting ready to introduce the "BRAIN ACT" to retain high skilled immigrants.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/...iGwO_blog.html

I made the mistake of reading some of the comments. I won't be making that mistake again. There were some very upsetting comments including one by a "Wakjob5" listing hundreds of companies that were "ruined or almost ruined by imported Indian labor" blaming it for bankruptcies, software failures and what not!! I hope someone sets him straight I know that it is best ignored, but this one really got under my skin.

[Jonty Rhodes]

Boy, this is some seriously messed up translation.

But the moral of the story from this Chinese article is that,

1. Grassley wants to attach the H1B and L1 amendments to the bill.
[I think most of us will find nothing new in this because H1B and L1 visa issue is Grassley's hobby-horse which he has been riding for too long and wants to attach this horse to every vehicle (immigration bills in this case)]

and

2. The immigration lawyers suggest that senate may pass this bill by the end of the year (again may be may be not, who knows but I think this is unlikely or at least less likely so take it as you want it)

I hope qblogfan can at lest help Google translation service to do a better job next time.

http://translate.google.com/translat...instance%3Dm3b