Career Related Discussion

[iatiam]

Today, after taking cues from Q's advise, I have decided to change my job. My PD is Aug 2009 and I don't see how I can work in my present company for the next 2-3 years sacrificing my career. I don't have I-140 receipt with me. Will that be a issue when I port my PD?

[nishant2200]

qblogfan used FOIA to successfully obtain proof of 140 approval, and found out his EB category also for sure from that. You can message him.

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/usc...0045f3d6a1RCRD

Today, after taking cues from Q's advise, I have decided to change my job. My PD is Aug 2009 and I don't see how I can work in my present company for the next 2-3 years sacrificing my career. I don't have I-140 receipt with me. Will that be a issue when I port my PD?

[gcq]

Today, after taking cues from Q's advise, I have decided to change my job. My PD is Aug 2009 and I don't see how I can work in my present company for the next 2-3 years sacrificing my career. I don't have I-140 receipt with me. Will that be a issue when I port my PD?

Have seen lawyers advising that an a printout of the I140 status from USCIS cris site https://egov.uscis.gov/cris/logon.do is enough. If you have I-140 receipt no: apply for an FOIA for I-140 approval notice. You can even get your PERM documents through FOIA.

[dec2007]

Today, after taking cues from Q's advise, I have decided to change my job. My PD is Aug 2009 and I don't see how I can work in my present company for the next 2-3 years sacrificing my career. I don't have I-140 receipt with me. Will that be a issue when I port my PD?

kudos..i would do the same...career > gc, considering pd of mid 2009.

[iatiam]

kudos..i would do the same...career > gc, considering pd of mid 2009.

Thanks Dec2007. While I wish I were "Dec 2007", I am glad that your ticket to freedom is one VB away.

BTW its funny that some sort of slavery always existed in the US. Now they just call it H1B.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indentured_servant

[Feb262009]

This is my first post. Although following this blog for few months.

Congrats everyone who became current in Dec.

My PD is Feb 26 2009. I guess my PD will be current in 2013. But my husband H1b max out in july 2012 and has no GC going on. considering his career, He doesn't want to go to H4 status for more than few months. I feel "my PD is close but still far". I pray everyday my PD gets in before his H1B is over, to avoid family separation.

[imdeng]

Sportsfan - I don't know what to say. First of all, we will all miss you - you have been an enthusiastic voice around here and other forums. Second, Congratulations on your wife's career progression. Its a bummer that you will not be filing 485 right now - as it was apparent how excited and happy you were to become current. I hope it all works out for you and you get the best of both worlds (India, US). Best of luck buddy.

Just an update for my friends:

Seems like we won't be filing our AoS any time soon. Incredible! My wife just today got a big jump in her group and she wants to stick it out (she is presently working in India and I will join her soon). You guys can count 2 less 485 numbers from the 2008 demand and hope for at least some of the 2009 people to be taken in this buildup.

We may come back here in the future and recapture our 2008 PD, but we are definitely not filing next month.

Good luck to all. Hope this news turns out true and hope we see a further movement in February bulletin. Let's go CO. You can give EADs for 2 years...take as many people as possible.

[ontheedge]

Just an update for my friends:

Seems like we won't be filing our AoS any time soon. Incredible! My wife just today got a big jump in her group and she wants to stick it out (she is presently working in India and I will join her soon). You guys can count 2 less 485 numbers from the 2008 demand and hope for at least some of the 2009 people to be taken in this buildup.

We may come back here in the future and recapture our 2008 PD, but we are definitely not filing next month.

Good luck to all. Hope this news turns out true and hope we see a further movement in February bulletin. Let's go CO. You can give EADs for 2 years...take as many people as possible.

Wow, life does throw curveballs at times. You become current the same day your wife gets a huge promotion..! One cant make this stuff up. Congratulations and kudos to you for acknowledging the importance of your wife's career.

[shashinehal]

Hello Friends,
I am new to this forum (and also I have a very little knowledge of GC Process).

I am in the following situation. Please share your valuable suggestions.

I came to the USA on H1B during Oct 2007. My first employer has applied my GC in EB3 category and my priority date is 06/16/2010. I recently changed my employer (3 months back), and I got 3 years of extension, because my I-140 was approved (at my previous employer). My current employer has started the PERM process and he will file my PERM under EB2 Category pretty soon. But I got a very good job offer (Full Time) from my current client company. My client company promised that they will start the GC as soon as possible (and I hope that they will apply in EB2 Category). While I am about to accept the full time employment with the client, I saw a big movement in EB2 category, yesterday.

Now I am in dilemma, whether to accept the client position, because my current employer has already started the GC in EB2 and if my PD (06/16/2010) becomes current in less than 6 months, then I prefer to stay back with my current employer. Any predictions of getting my PD Current in near future?

On a different note, if my client company applies for my H1B Transfer, will I get my 3 years of extension?

Thanks in advance!!

Do not make that mistake by moving. The flexibility we have with small consulting companies are not same with bigger clients / MNC's.
Couple of things you need to check
1) R u sure the job description which you are being offered says Bachelors + 5 yrs requirement ?
2) Are they willing to start your GC on day one without any delays ?
3) Big companies , wont start GC process to help one to get GC, they start GC when your H1 is getting expired in 18-20 months.
4) Prevailing wage + labor takes approx 6-8 months, r u sure you want to wait for the same ?
5) Not all MNC's apply I-140 in premium.

I would prefer to wait for current company to apply on Eb2, take GC and then move anywhere. 1-2 yrs wont make big difference in career.

Note: The package and position you get when you have h1 and GC is big difference

[suninphx]

Guys you have actually described the methodology for the porting calculation. Porting really picked pace after Sep 2009 when clinical approvals started for the first time. In Sep 2009 the entire chunk of Eb2 I/C for 2004 were approved and EB3 became unavailable. So really yes after we cross Sep 2009 we should be deducting 3K from the perm figures assuming the transformation ratio of 1. Since we have not hit this time yet it is really not a factor till 01-JAN-2009. So now if really lesser number of 485's are filed than what comes by the transformation ratio of 1 it can be attributed to demand destruction as people did not have the cushion of EAD / AP. On another note the market was bad for the financial sector, IT was slightly better, definitely not good, 75% of EB2 I is probably IT.

Market may not be as bad for IT. But many people had to change the jobs with many loosing the priority dates (as I140 was not filed) and there were some who decided to return back home for steady career than uncertanity. (I know this factor is always there but I am sure this thought process accelerated during that time).

Also,whats your thought process for arriving 75% of EB2 are IT? Is it from PERM data analysis?

[TeddyKoochu]

Market may not be as bad for IT. But many people had to change the jobs with many loosing the priority dates (as I140 was not filed) and there were some who decided to return back home for steady career than uncertanity. (I know this factor is always there but I am sure this thought process accelerated during that time).

Also,whats your though process for arriving 75% of EB2 are IT? Is it from PERM data analysis?

My point was porting is definitely not a factor in this zone. If lesser number of 485's has really been received then it can be attributed solely to demand destruction. You make a valid point many people who filed perm in 2008 saw cases going into audit, many people may have been in the 6th year of H1 and possibly could not extend it or for many the 1-2 year wait for perm was just too long, so even if the perms finally got approved they were kind of redundant. 75% EB2 - I being IT is just my own guess / gut feel no calculations / numbers to that that’s what I indicated in my post, apologies for not being clearer.
On another note when CO decided the Jan bulletin only the NOV filers PD till 01-NOV-2007 should really have been truly visible to him, the Dec filing was just picking up till that time. The Nov filing is truly restricted to 2007 at that point of time perm was quite normal, even for Dec filers till Mar 15 29008 perm situation was normal it just became worse from Mid 2008. So I guess either there was definite demand destruction, lesser numbers coming based on what they expected (We do not know what was their expectation) or just discretion or a mix of all. However whatever happened is very good for everyone in 2008 it gives people to file for EAD / AP. In fact the wait time for the PWMB's to file for EAD / AP was as much as 4.5 years now it’s down to 2 years if someone has a PD of say Dec 2008 in theory this itself is a great positive from the whole situation.

[Spectator]

Spec, one thing if you could clarify.
The way you lay out TF and DD, they can't be multiplied to get OR.
The DD you have is additive with ii in your TF. Basically an approved PERM will not convert to I-485 either because I-140 is denied or I-485 is denied or multiple PERM or job loss. Wouldn't it be better to lay out in the following way
Transformation Factor
(i) EB2%
(ii) % of Approved PERMs requiring a visa number = 1-(I140 denial rate + DD). Also the initial discussions with Teddy were assuming DD to be the terminology for cumulative effect of I-140 denial rate and multiple PERMs and job abandonment, but your terminology of calling the latter two unknowns as DD and keeping I140 denial rate separate seems better. That is the way many people think of demand destruction (i.e. not incorporating I140 denial rate in it).
(iii) Dependent ratio

Everything i have learnt is from this forum and your and other people's numbers, so feel free to disagree .


Also one question i had was that the I-140 denial rate of 80% is really the rejection rate and does not include other effects.

GhostWriter,

Thanks for your feedback.

I think of the TF as giving the possible. If the I-140 is denied, then the process is over. There is no possibility of applying for AOS and the PD has been lost. For me, that is a big distinction.

DD on the other hand is wastage of the possible due to subsequent events. That may be a job change and new PERM/I-140, or it might be abandonment of the process altogether.

If DD also includes the I-140 denial rate, it is two factors at entirely different points in the process.

IMO, since DD is only a reduction of TF, it is cumulative. If the TF gave a figure of 1 (i.e. 1 PERM results in 1 EB2 I-485), then a DD of 40% would give an OR of 0.6 [1 * (100% - 40%)= 0.6]. That seems to correctly reflect that subsequent circumstances reduced the number of posible I-485 by 40%.

Similarly, if the TF was higher, then OR is slightly higher, but the reduction due to DD is the same % e.g. if TF=1.1, DD=40% then OR = 1.1 * (100% - 40%) = 0.66 (0.66 / 1.1 = 0.6)

This means DD can be applied independently of different TF assumptions.

I hope that helps you understand my thinking. Possibly it is contrary to other people's thoughts, but it is how I have always looked at it and therefore difficult to change in my own mind.

The OR could be the ratio between the number produced with no I-140 denials after PERM and the final number. In the above example, where TF=1.1, DD=40% then TF(2) with no I-140 denials would become 1.375. OR would become 0.66 / 1.375 = 0.48 In that case, I would introduce the I-140 Denial Rate between the new TF and DD, but I would not incorporate it in DD itself, for the reasons I outlined above.

[GhostWriter]

Thanks for the clarification Spec. I understand your point now.
Also the two approaches are equivalent.
So lets say we have 100 EB2-IC approved PERMs. Assume that 20% I-140s get denied and 15% is demand destruction (job abandonment, multiple PERMs etc.).
No. of I485s can be calculated in two ways (simple set theory)
1. 100[1 - (0.2 + 0.15 - 0.2*0.15)] = 100[1-.32] = 68 (This is what i had suggested except i ignored the intersection term. There would be 3 people whose I140 would be denied and they would lose jobs, so the union of I140 denied and job abandoned is 20 + 15 - 3 = 32).
2. 100 * 0.8 * 0.85 = 68 (This is what you have and automatically takes care of the intersection. So a person will only reach I-485 if his I-140 is approved AND he doesn't abandon.)

So to simplyfy and not cause confusion I agree with what you laid out. The only thing is that the terminology between what you mentioned and Teddy's post on page 1 is different. There are four factors we are incorporating, the order does not matter since its simple multiplication.
1. % EB2
2. Approval rate at I-140
3. Dependent ratio
4. Demand destruction (Multiple PERM, Job loss etc).

You are calling the product of first three as TF, 4th as DD and product of all four as OR.

Teddy has the product of second and fourth combined labeled as Demand destruction. I think it would help if we agree on one definition and add it to the list of acronyms and refer it in a consistent way.

Overall i think we all understand the four factors and the calculations are similar.

GhostWriter,

Thanks for your feedback.

I think of the TF as giving the possible. If the I-140 is denied, then the process is over. There is no possibility of applying for AOS and the PD has been lost. For me, that is a big distinction.

DD on the other hand is wastage of the possible due to subsequent events. That may be a job change and new PERM/I-140, or it might be abandonment of the process altogether.

If DD also includes the I-140 denial rate, it is two factors at entirely different points in the process.

IMO, since DD is only a reduction of TF, it is cumulative. If the TF gave a figure of 1 (i.e. 1 PERM results in 1 EB2 I-485), then a DD of 40% would give an OR of 0.6 [1 * (100% - 40%)= 0.6]. That seems to correctly reflect that subsequent circumstances reduced the number of posible I-485 by 40%.

Similarly, if the TF was higher, then OR is slightly higher, but the reduction due to DD is the same % e.g. if TF=1.1, DD=40% then OR = 1.1 * (100% - 40%) = 0.66 (0.66 / 1.1 = 0.6)

This means DD can be applied independently of different TF assumptions.

I hope that helps you understand my thinking. Possibly it is contrary to other people's thoughts, but it is how I have always looked at it and therefore difficult to change in my own mind.

The OR could be the ratio between the number produced with no I-140 denials after PERM and the final number. In the above example, where TF=1.1, DD=40% then TF(2) with no I-140 denials would become 1.375. OR would become 0.66 / 1.375 = 0.48 In that case, I would introduce the I-140 Denial Rate between the new TF and DD, but I would not incorporate it in DD itself, for the reasons I outlined above.

[suninphx]

Thanks Kanmani,
I think its a good idea to come up with large sample, I know about 8-10 guys who filed after Jan 2008 and all are primary applicants and filed with one perm.

The percentage of multiple perms in a family may be 15 to 20%, since it was little difficult after 2008 to file for H1. So I don't think there would be more than 20% multiple perms from a single family.
The other category of multiple perms after 2008 may not be high.

Multiple PERMS can be from two sources. a) both husband and wife filing separate PERM b) One of primary applicant had to file more than 1 PERM becuase job change etc.

On side note its interesting to know that you have 8 friends with PD 2008. I know 1-2 (friends of friends) with 2008 PD. Most of my friends are either 2007 or direct 2009 and onwards. Same scenario at my workplace too. It may be conincidenace but thats one of the factors driving my assumptions.

[codesmith]

Multiple PERMS can be from two sources. a) both husband and wife filing separate PERM b) One of primary applicant had to file more than 1 PERM becuase job change etc.....
.

Sun, in my opinion the % of both working husband and wife of IND-H1 family may be 25 to 30% and the chances of both of them filing for perm is about 85-90%. And considering the 2008 rejection/audit trend this may even be lower.

The second factor of job change and again filing for new perm - may not be high.
At-least I've not seen any case in my friends and office, Do you think this class can be more than 15% of the multiple perms starting Jan-08?

[imdeng]

randomax - As Q keeps saying here - don't put your life on hold because of GC process. Take your new job if it means a significant progress in your career. Only way I see a mid-2010 PD becoming current soon is if HR-3012 passes - and if it does then a few months delay because of the new job will really won't matter much. Best of luck.

PS> Thank you for posting first in the appropriate forum and using the main forum as only the last resort.

Gents - i'm a newbie to this board and have found the info very helpful till now. I posted this in the "485 and CP-related topics" but have not gotten a reply yet. If anybody can address these questions, i'd be grateful. Alternatively, please point me to the right forum... thanks.

"Hi All - relative newbie here and had a question regarding switching jobs. My PD is june-2010 (Indian, EB2) and I have a potential job offer that I won't take up till April 2012. I have two questions:

1) Maintaining PD: I am fairly certain I can maintain my PD even if I switch jobs. My job profile is going to be fairly similar, but are there any caveats here? Is it more or less a given or are there situations where this does not happen?

2) becoming current: although I think its pretty unlikely but what happens if I become current before a new labor can be filed after I move. for example, I file for labor in june 2012 and i become current in may 2012?

3) how long after filing for 485 before i am no longer tied to my employer?

thanks very much for your thoughts. "

thank you.

[randomax]

thank you all for the prompt and helpful replies. Very helpful.

randomax - As Q keeps saying here - don't put your life on hold because of GC process. Take your new job if it means a significant progress in your career. Only way I see a mid-2010 PD becoming current soon is if HR-3012 passes - and if it does then a few months delay because of the new job will really won't matter much. Best of luck.

PS> Thank you for posting first in the appropriate forum and using the main forum as only the last resort.

[mysati]

Friends,

I have a few questions regarding job changes after EAD. I think I understand the 180day rule, for voluntary job changes. But I am not sure about layoffs or such, after getting an EAD.

Once a job is lost, even if the person has(d) an H1-B and EAD simultaneously, I presume the H1-B becomes invalid.

1. Can that person (if they are the primary applicant for AoS) be without a job/ job searching and legally remain in the US through the entire validity of the EAD? I assume this should be valid as it is similar to an OPT EAD. Am I correct?

2. If they find another job, after the layoff, should that job be in the same field as that of the prior one (i.e.) is a career change allowed or not?

3. If the EAD is due for renewal, while in the second job, does it need any kind of proof of layoff/ EVL etc. from the former/current employer?

4. Could it possibly cause any queries during the naturalization process?

5. Finally what should we all be aware of, in such situations, so that we do not inadvertantly remain illegal and jeopardize our long term prospects.

If they have been answered in prior posts, sorry for posting them here and please point me to the links.

Thanks!

[suninphx]

Friends,

I have a few questions regarding job changes after EAD. I think I understand the 180day rule, for voluntary job changes. But I am not sure about layoffs or such, after getting an EAD.

Once a job is lost, even if the person has(d) an H1-B and EAD simultaneously, I presume the H1-B becomes invalid.

1. Can that person (if they are the primary applicant for AoS) be without a job/ job searching and legally remain in the US through the entire validity of the EAD? I assume this should be valid as it is similar to an OPT EAD. Am I correct?

2. If they find another job, after the layoff, should that job be in the same field as that of the prior one (i.e.) is a career change allowed or not?

3. If the EAD is due for renewal, while in the second job, does it need any kind of proof of layoff/ EVL etc. from the former/current employer?

4. Could it possibly cause any queries during the naturalization process?

5. Finally what should we all be aware of, in such situations, so that we do not inadvertantly remain illegal and jeopardize our long term prospects.

If they have been answered in prior posts, sorry for posting them here and please point me to the links.

Thanks!

These are very useful questions. Can we have a separate EAD thread (if not there already?). We can share ideas about how to make best use of EAD in that thread.

[qesehmk]

mysati,

I will try to answer some of these. Not sure I know everything.

#0 - H1B doesn't become instantly invalid. USCIS says that one needs to leave country immediately but in reality is quite lenient if the person finds another job.
#1 - If one had EAD and 485 is pending - then the person can legally stay until 485 is adjudicated. If employer withdraws 140 then 485 will of course be rejected. So post 180 days from 485 filing you are safe. But you MUST have a job in same or similar category the day 485 is adjudicated.
#2 Yes with EAD you can search another job/
#3 My understanding EAD is can be renewed without any proof of employment. But I may be wrong.
#4. No there shouldn't be any problems for naturalization if there was a layoff and you used EAD to gain another job in same / similar classification and then received you GC.
#5. Not travelling outside country would be a good idea. Staying on good terms with former employer would be good idea. As soon as you get a job use EAD and if possible transfer H1 and invoke AC21.

Hope this helps.

Friends,

I have a few questions regarding job changes after EAD. I think I understand the 180day rule, for voluntary job changes. But I am not sure about layoffs or such, after getting an EAD.

Once a job is lost, even if the person has(d) an H1-B and EAD simultaneously, I presume the H1-B becomes invalid.

1. Can that person (if they are the primary applicant for AoS) be without a job/ job searching and legally remain in the US through the entire validity of the EAD? I assume this should be valid as it is similar to an OPT EAD. Am I correct?

2. If they find another job, after the layoff, should that job be in the same field as that of the prior one (i.e.) is a career change allowed or not?

3. If the EAD is due for renewal, while in the second job, does it need any kind of proof of layoff/ EVL etc. from the former/current employer?

4. Could it possibly cause any queries during the naturalization process?

5. Finally what should we all be aware of, in such situations, so that we do not inadvertantly remain illegal and jeopardize our long term prospects.

If they have been answered in prior posts, sorry for posting them here and please point me to the links.

Thanks!

[arikepudi]

Hi,

I have a quick question.
My priioryt date is Dec 19th 2007. I am Dec filer. Today i got SMS saying that EAD/AP was approved for myself and for my wife. Hopefully i should be reaciving them in the next 10 days. I am planning to move from IL to FL in Feb on job change but with the same employer. Will the change of address trigger anything for my 485 application.

Is there anything i need to do in specific other than updating AR-11 form ?

Will change of job cause any issues in approving 485 application .

Thanks

[qesehmk]

If your move is permanent I think it may be an issue from USCIS perspective. If you employer is willing to say its a temporary move then its not an issue.

In theory GC is meant for future employment - so as long as your employer says that the job mentioned in 140 is still available for you and you are going to take it up ... the 485 approval should happen regardless.

Hi,

I have a quick question.
My priioryt date is Dec 19th 2007. I am Dec filer. Today i got SMS saying that EAD/AP was approved for myself and for my wife. Hopefully i should be reaciving them in the next 10 days. I am planning to move from IL to FL in Feb on job change but with the same employer. Will the change of address trigger anything for my 485 application.

Is there anything i need to do in specific other than updating AR-11 form ?

Will change of job cause any issues in approving 485 application .

Thanks

[zenmaster]

Hi,

I have a quick question.
My priioryt date is Dec 19th 2007. I am Dec filer. Today i got SMS saying that EAD/AP was approved for myself and for my wife. Hopefully i should be reaciving them in the next 10 days. I am planning to move from IL to FL in Feb on job change but with the same employer. Will the change of address trigger anything for my 485 application.

Is there anything i need to do in specific other than updating AR-11 form ?

Will change of job cause any issues in approving 485 application .

Thanks

I would say, it depends on how your PERM is filed.
Many consulting firms file PERMs with location mentioned as 'VARIOUS UNANTICIPATED LOCATIONS ACROSS US'.
If that has been the case with you then, I believe, just by filing AR-11 will suffice.
If not, i think what Q says will be correct...

[qesehmk]

That had happened to my son's US passport. They may have delivered it to the wrong address and now don't want to admit it. USCIS is going to have to reissue unless the receiver is gracious enough to track you down and give it to you himself.

p.s. - Interesting in my son's passport case - the receiver was another desi guy half a mile from our house. He came to our house and gave it to us!

I believe i am in a unique situation. According USPS website EAD/AP cards were delivered on Jan 30th, but we didnt receive them. Contacted USCIS and got tracking numbers of USPS. That also says the same thing. Contacted local USPS and they say the same thing. Contacted USCIS and they opened a service ticket for the same. But they say i have to wait for 15 days to resolve it or so.

I am moving from IL to FL on 10th of this month.

Gurus, any suggestions in this case.

I have been following this forum as a silent observer since last summer and wanted to share some good news: received 485 approval emails yesterday.

Thanks to Q, Nishant, Veni, Teddy, Spec and all others for their valuable insights and analysis.

My best wishes for early approvals to all who are waiting in queue.

Chargeability: EB2 - I
PD: 9/5/2007
Processing Stage: I-485
NSC
Received Date: 11/18/2011
Notice Date: 11/23/2011
FP Scheduled: 1/12/2012
EAD/AP approval Date: 1/12/2011
EAD/AP: Combo card received on 01/28/2012
485 Approval: 2/1/2012
485 Email Notification: 2/1/2012
485 Physical Card: <TBD>

EB2I ... congrats my friend. Good luck in your future life and career. Thanks for sharing. Joy increases when shared!

[imdeng]

Take the new opportunity QBF. It is recommended to stay in the GC jog for 180 days so that there are no questions asked in the Naturalization process. However, it is NOT against the law to change jobs as soon as you get your GC and I have not heard of any case whose naturalization was declined because of an immediate job change after GC.

I got a new job opportunity and I am thinking about leaving my company in the same day of my GC approval. Is it legal? I heard we have to work for the employer for 180 days after GC. For me, I have been stuck with them for 8 years and really want to move on. The new job is much better pay and has good pension programs.