Discussion of Bills that remove the Per Country Limits - H.R.3012, H,R. 213

I am not bashing unions. I believe unions are needed. I am not a corporate fan either. Both should be balanced. When a worker thinks his pay should be extremely high, he forgets about the business side. Businesses are there to make profits. That is why they exist. As for the attitude of corporate bigwigs, I agree with you there.

However we should not forget that any labor law has to make business sense for any business to exist. That was my point. I am not one sided. I am just in the middle. As employees we often forget the business side.

Your desire to be in the middle is good. My view is that hte corporate greed has gone so far to the right that one is going to have to pull it strongly to the left in order to be in the middle :)

Anyway ... that's my last on this topic. Best!

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Originally Posted by gcq

I am not bashing unions. I believe unions are needed. I am not a corporate fan either. Both should be balanced. When a worker thinks his pay should be extremely high, he forgets about the business side. Businesses are there to make profits. That is why they exist. As for the attitude of corporate bigwigs, I agree with you there.

However we should not forget that any labor law has to make business sense for any business to exist. That was my point. I am not one sided. I am just in the middle. As employees we often forget the business side.

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http://democrats.senate.gov/2011/12/...ember-17-2011/
Began the Rule 14 process of H.R.3012, the Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2011.

Rule 14 is a step to bypass senate judiciary committee and place the bill on Senate calendar.

Rule 14 link

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Originally Posted by gcq

http://democrats.senate.gov/2011/12/...ember-17-2011/
Began the Rule 14 process of H.R.3012, the Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2011.

Rule 14 is a step to bypass senate judiciary committee and place the bill on Senate calendar.

Rule 14 link

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Thanks a lot GCQ for the update.

New development....What does this mean?

Does this mean that dems are trying to bring the bill to Senate floor by bypassing the judiciary committee? Can this be done when the bill is on "Hold" by Senator Grassley?

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Originally Posted by gcq

http://democrats.senate.gov/2011/12/...ember-17-2011/
Began the Rule 14 process of H.R.3012, the Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2011.

Rule 14 is a step to bypass senate judiciary committee and place the bill on Senate calendar.

Rule 14 link

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Thanks for the link. I went through the article. Hoping to have this become a good development for the bill in near future. It seems the overall support in the senate may be strong for this bill and that is the reason may be democrats are bypassing the committee so they don't have to deal with hostility from Grassley. I hope they consider it on the floor and vote to make it into a law.

Read the pdf n it has good info about how a bill in processed under Rule 14 and what are the objectives of it. It does not explicitly say that this can be done when a bill is on "Hold" but the objectives are in line to do the same.

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Originally Posted by Ra.One

Read the pdf n it has good info about how a bill in processed under Rule 14 and what are the objectives of it. It does not explicitly say that this can be done when a bill is on "Hold" but the objectives are in line to do the same.

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Hold is a notification that a senator would not like the bill to be taken up in the senate. It is just a "wish". Senate has procedures to bypass holds and filibusters.

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Originally Posted by gcq

http://democrats.senate.gov/2011/12/...ember-17-2011/
Began the Rule 14 process of H.R.3012, the Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2011.

Rule 14 is a step to bypass senate judiciary committee and place the bill on Senate calendar.

Rule 14 link

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Thanks for posting all the details. This is a very good development for the bill. If the bill reaches the senate floor directly there is a very good chance of it passing because it is common sense legislation. It only requires a simple majority to pass in the Senate. Thanks to you for posting and doing all background research around rule 14.

gcq thanks for the details.

Senate is done with this year's roll call voting. Next vote is expected to be on January 23 2012.

Hope we have enough time to draw attention from the senators ( atleast 60 votes required or 3/5 of the quorum )

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Originally Posted by gcq

http://democrats.senate.gov/2011/12/...ember-17-2011/
Began the Rule 14 process of H.R.3012, the Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2011.

Rule 14 is a step to bypass senate judiciary committee and place the bill on Senate calendar.

Rule 14 link

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This is great development. Thanks for sharing.

Again, thanks for the link, gcq.

Here is a slightly short and a little easy explanation of the Rule XIV in Senate.

http://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:/..._2003Aug04.pdf

Read the second last paragraph because that is the most important part.

A measure placed directly on the calendar under Rule XIV is not guaranteed floor consideration. It must be called up for consideration, either by unanimous consent or by a motion that usually is debatable, like any measure that is placed on the calendar after being reported from committee. In the 107th Congress, only 41 Senate bills and joint resolutions were placed directly on the Senate Calendar; of these, 10 were ultimately passed by the Senate and 7 became public law.

Try to contact Senators and educate other friends and families about it to support it.

Try your best at least till it gets a consideration on the Senate floor by unanimous consent or by a motion that is debatable.

Those bills were senate Originated bills which bypassed the Senate committee.

Our Bill had already passed the House judiciary committee and as I mentioned earlier it is very common that any House bill which has an overwhelming bipartisan support is expected to pass by unanimous consent in the Senate and vice versa.

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Originally Posted by Jonty Rhodes

Again, thanks for the link, gcq.

Here is a slightly short and a little easy explanation of the Rule XIV in Senate.

http://digital.library.unt.edu/ark:/..._2003Aug04.pdf

Read the second last paragraph because that is the most important part.

A measure placed directly on the calendar under Rule XIV is not guaranteed floor consideration. It must be called up for consideration, either by unanimous consent or by a motion that usually is debatable, like any measure that is placed on the calendar after being reported from committee. In the 107th Congress, only 41 Senate bills and joint resolutions were placed directly on the Senate Calendar; of these, 10 were ultimately passed by the Senate and 7 became public law.

Try to contact Senators and educate other friends and families about it to support it.

Try your best at least till it gets a consideration on the Senate floor by unanimous consent or by a motion that is debatable.

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Originally Posted by Kanmani

Those bills were senate Originated bills which bypassed the Senate committee.

Our Bill had already passed the House judiciary committee and as I mentioned earlier it is very common that any House bill which has an overwhelming bipartisan support is expected to pass by unanimous consent in the Senate and vice versa.

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Good to know that. Thanks again.

Paragraph 3 indicates (1) that no bill or joint resolution shall be referred to a
committee until after its second reading, (2) that referral to committee after the second
reading is not mandatory, and (3) that unanimous consent is required for a bill or joint
resolution to be read twice and considered on the same day

From Oh Law Firm

12/18/2011: H.R. 3012 Placed on Senate Legislative Calendar

Yesterday, in the Senate, H.R.3012, Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act of 2011, was read the first time on the floor and placed on Senate Legislative Calendar under Read the First Time. It will be interesting to watch how and when this bill will sail through. A bill must be read second time and if motion to proceed and motion to cloture are presented, we will learn whether there will be filibuster by Sen. Grassley.

As a side note, there was a small political development in the State of Utah. Its Senior Senator Orrin Hatch will have to rerun for his seat and there was educated rumor that the rising star House Representative Chaffetz, the sponsor of H.R. 3012, would challenge his Senate seat in the election, but yesterday there was report that Rep. Chaffetz had decided that he would not challenge Sen. Hatch's seat in the coming election and this news was taken as a huge relief for Senator Hatch's political career. One may speculate what might have gone on behind the scene between Sen. Hatch and Rep. Chaffetz relating to the H.R. 3012 which had been on hold in the Senate. Sen. Hatch is one of the longest Senior Senators in the U.S. Senate, and should he lend his hands on this bill, it would help tremendously to crack the barrier. Please stay tuned to this website for the interesting development of this legislation. This reporter is very interested in the move of Sen. Grassley and the sponsors of S. 1983 (numerical limit elimination & Irish visa bill), Sen. Chuck Schumer, Sen. Dick Durbin, and Sen. Patrick Leahy - all heavy weights in the Senate. Very exciting!

As for the timing, the Senate has reaached unanimous-consent agreement yesterday that when the Senate completes its business on 12/17/2011, it adjourn and convene for pro forma sessions only with no business conducted on the following dates and times and that following each pro forma session, the Senate adjourn until the following pro forma session: Tuesday, December 20, 2011 at 11 a.m., Friday, December 23, 2011 at 9:30 a.m., Tuesday, December 27, 2011 at 12 p.m., Friday, December 30, 2011 at 11 a.m.; and that the 2nd session of the 112th Congress convene on Tuesday, January 3, 2012 at 12 p.m., for a pro forma session only with no business conducted D1384and that following the pro forma session, the Senate adjourn and convene for pro forma sessions only with no business conducted on the following dates and times and that following each pro forma session, the Senate adjourn until the following pro forma session: Friday, January 6, 2012 at 11 a.m., Tuesday, January 10, 2012 at 11 a.m., Friday, January 13, 2012 at 12 p.m., Tuesday, January 17, 2012 at 10:15 a.m., Friday, January 20, 2012 at 2 p.m.; and that the Senate adjourn on Friday, January 20, 2012 until 2 p.m. on Monday, January 23, 2012. The House is also adjourned for a constituent work period. During this period, members of the House return to their districts to meet with constituents. House will also have in pro forma session, but no legislative actions will take place until next year.

It thus appears the readers may be able to hold their long breathe for a while to hear exiciting news, if any. Believe me, there will be a lot of things going on during the recess!! In this regards, H.R. 3012 is not quite dead yet.

HAPPY HOLIDAYS TO YOU, DISTINGUISHED LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, MEMBERS OF THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE!!!

BTW, I have become "infamous around these parts (red squares) on ** forum from "going to be famous soon (green squares)" overnight suddenly. Probably they saw my post talking about HR 3012 being put on Senate Calendar. I can't believe they think that in this current time where information spreads faster than a jungle fire, EB ROW guys are not looking at every possible news related to HR 3012. They might have thought that once I put the message, EB ROW will find out and jeopardize their efforts. I can understand their concern to some extent but if I had not posted the message, somebody else may have posted it or people will find out in few days in any case. Its not that I posted something very secret which only a bunch of people working behind the scenes knew. It was already on Senate Democrats website and on Oh Law Firm. I mean how much time does it take for someone who devotes a lot of time on these forums and particularly to this bill, to search in Trackitt or Google news items for HR 3012 before the updates and news show up. Unbelievable!!! I am not offended at all but I can very well imagine now why Q left **. Why don't they just remove my post instead if they think its damaging to their efforts? Strange behavior. :D

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Originally Posted by Jonty Rhodes

...there was educated rumor that the rising star House Representative Chaffetz, the sponsor of H.R. 3012, would challenge his Senate seat in the election, but yesterday there was report that Rep. Chaffetz had decided that he would not challenge Sen. Hatch's seat in the coming election and this news was taken as a huge relief for Senator Hatch's political career.

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Jonty .... thanks. The paragraph above is a very good indication that 3012 might indeed pass.

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Originally Posted by qesehmk

Jonty .... thanks. The paragraph above is a very good indication that 3012 might indeed pass.

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Amen!!!!!!!

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/...mp/~r112lgQ2HP

Was Mr Reid behind bringing the motion? That is great news, no?

Senator Reid is the majority leader , hence he is behind all the bills which comes to the floor( likewise Eric Cantor in the house)

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Originally Posted by vishnu

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/...mp/~r112lgQ2HP

Was Mr Reid behind bringing the motion? That is great news, no?

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Update:

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/Dem...135848473.html

HR 3012 on risk...

Still unclear - HR 3012 is still only the removal of caps (no Irish provision) - so what Leahy may have introduced (as per article) is the Senate bill which has the removal of caps + Irish provision. The latter could have been blocked by GOP...

HR-3012 is not at risk right now. It is under Rule-XIV process in the Senate. Dems have used a lot of Rule-XIV in past few months to bypass a discussion/delay in the committees. This is perfectly fine and it means that the bill *can* be placed on the calendar when the Senate reconvenes. This is a pro-active and strong measure by the Dems. Now, when it gets considered again then Grassley will again have options to delay the voting on the bill. For all of those options, there are counter-options available to Sen Reid and supporters of the bill.

What we need to do is to show our support for the bill to the Senators (call/meet your Senator). This will ensure that when the bill comes again to the Senate floor, there is enough backing to nullify whatever Grassley and his fellow nativists try to do to derail the bill.

thanks for the clarification, hope this will become law before mid feb 2012....

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Originally Posted by lalaji

thanks for the clarification, hope this will become law before mid feb 2012....

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lalaji,
If you have a question, pose it as a question rather than making a statement like "hr 3012 at risk". This will spread panic across the supporters. If you want this bill to pass, it is very essential to keep its supporters including you excited about it.