Educational Qualifications Discussion

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Originally Posted by qesehmk

On a different topic, Ron Gotcher's newsletter yesterday discussed 3 key reasons behind delays in 140.
1. Ability to pay is being questioned
2. 3 Yr undergrad degree is being questions regardless whether teh applicant has MS or PHD from US.
3. Employer-employee relationship in consulting companies is being scrutinized.

The net effect is increase in I-140 inventory. This of course bodes well for current EB2IC backlog reduction. However, here is something that is baffling to me. Hope somebody might be able to throw light on this.

If you look at the increase in pending 140 (P), it is incosistent with the receipts (R) and approvals (A) and awaiting customer action increase (W).

Theoretically P = R - A - W

But somehow the formula doesn't work on the data published on USCIS dashboard.

Wonder if anybody has any better insights?

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Q,
Agree, just to add, this is what one of the Murthy law firms attorneys said regarding 3-year degree for EB2

"In general, it is well settled case law that an Indian 3-year Bachelors degree will not be able to be used to equate to qualifications necessary for an EB2 Greencard position, no matter how many years of experience or Indian PGDs one has. However, there is a separate category for individuals with exceptional abilities who are working in a job that requires these abilities to qualify for an EB2 position even having a 3-year degree. These applications have higher standards that can be difficult to meet, however, if you think you may qualify, you should consult a knowledgeable immigration attorney in regard to your case."

I think this is key is keeping the porting numbers to less than what we all expected!

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Originally Posted by veni001

Q,
Agree, just to add, this is what one of the Murthy law firms attorneys said regarding 3-year degree for EB2

"In general, it is well settled case law that an Indian 3-year Bachelors degree will not be able to be used to equate to qualifications necessary for an EB2 Greencard position, no matter how many years of experience or Indian PGDs one has. However, there is a separate category for individuals with exceptional abilities who are working in a job that requires these abilities to qualify for an EB2 position even having a 3-year degree. These applications have higher standards that can be difficult to meet, however, if you think you may qualify, you should consult a knowledgeable immigration attorney in regard to your case."

I think this is key is keeping the porting numbers to less than what we all expected!

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Veni thanks for posting I agree. Folks with 3+3 or 3+2 where the subsequent degree is in the same field can still go past with an educational evaluation stating that their combination degrees are equivalent to a 4 year degree.

Ability to pay is definitely going to hit small and typical consulting companies hard, many of them are compelling people to apply in EB3 due to this. I have a colleague who with 10 plus years of work experience being pushed to EB3 as the company says EB2 will be denied.

E2E memo being applied to I140 is really worrying and concerning, they might start digging back into this even at the I485 stage in case it gets assigned to a over zealous officer. Ideally cases pre memo should be grand fathered but we cant say for sure.

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Originally Posted by TeddyKoochu

Veni thanks for posting I agree. Folks with 3+3 or 3+2 where the subsequent degree is in the same field can still go past with an educational evaluation stating that their combination degrees are equivalent to a 4 year degree.

Ability to pay is definitely going to hit small and typical consulting companies hard, many of them are compelling people to apply in EB3 due to this. I have a colleague who with 10 plus years of work experience being pushed to EB3 as the company says EB2 will be denied.

E2E memo being applied to I140 is really worrying and concerning, they might start digging back into this even at the I485 stage in case it gets assigned to a over zealous officer. Ideally cases pre memo should be grand fathered but we cant say for sure.

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Teddy,
There is a big difference between 4-year degree Vs 4-year degree equivalent
1. One with 4-year degree need 5-years of progressive experience to be qualified for EB-2 (Advanced Degree option)
2. One with 4-year degree equivalent need 10-years of progressive experience to be qualified for EB-2 (Exceptional Ability option)
Employment-Based Immigration: Second Preference EB-2
As the attorney pointed, #2 is tough to get approval.

I hope they are not digging the approved i140 to see E2E memo compliance!

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Originally Posted by TeddyKoochu

Veni thanks for posting I agree. Folks with 3+3 or 3+2 where the subsequent degree is in the same field can still go past with an educational evaluation stating that their combination degrees are equivalent to a 4 year degree

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Teddy,

I know this is a technicality and frankly I don't really feel qualified to comment.

I would be wary of using the term combination degree, because that is what USCIS do not accept (at least at the same level). The degree must be single source from a University.

An Indian 3 year Bachelors and 2 year Masters generally equate to a US Bachelors where the single source degree would be considered the Masters, since it is a higher level.

A 3 + 3 e.g.MCA might be considered a US Masters and I have seen some recent cases where that was accepted as the case by USCIS.

PGD like AMIE etc seem to have particular problems. First, USCIS doesn't seem to recognize them as being a higher level, so they would be considered a combination degree. Secondly, I have seen the argument put forward that they are awarded by an Institute, not a University and therefore have no standing for qualifying for EB2.

I admit to finding the area mystifying. Current guidelines are different from those used in the past and people say there are even differences between NSC and TSC. Reading through the AAO decisions doesn't even give definitive answers.

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Originally Posted by veni001

Teddy,
There is a big difference between 4-year degree Vs 4-year degree equivalent
1. One with 4-year degree need 5-years of progressive experience to be qualified for EB-2 (Advanced Degree option)
2. One with 4-year degree equivalent need 10-years of progressive experience to be qualified for EB-2 (Exceptional Ability option)
Employment-Based Immigration: Second Preference EB-2
As the attorney pointed, #2 is tough to get approval.

I hope they are not digging the approved i140 to see E2E memo compliance!

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Originally Posted by Spectator

Teddy,

I know this is a technicality and frankly I don't really feel qualified to comment.

I would be wary of using the term combination degree, because that is what USCIS do not accept (at least at the same level). The degree must be single source from a University.

An Indian 3 year Bachelors and 2 year Masters generally equate to a US Bachelors where the single source degree would be considered the Masters, since it is a higher level.

A 3 + 3 e.g.MCA might be considered a US Masters and I have seen some recent cases where that was accepted as the case by USCIS.

PGD like AMIE etc seem to have particular problems. First, USCIS doesn't seem to recognize them as being a higher level, so they would be considered a combination degree. Secondly, I have seen the argument put forward that they are awarded by an Institute, not a University and therefore have no standing for qualifying for EB2.

I admit to finding the area mystifying. Current guidelines are different from those used in the past and people say there are even differences between NSC and TSC. Reading through the AAO decisions doesn't even give definitive answers.

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Veni / Spec thanks for your insights. Veni thanks for clarifying on the 4 Yr degree equivalents this is very significant I did not know that this will potentially disqualify many people from porting. Spec I fully agree with you that all 3+2 degrees would really be equated to bachelors, MCA can be the exception. I have seen most MCA folks also playing it safe with the labor they would try the bachelors + 5 years route.
Another area is people with 4 years engineering degree in IT, in yester years any branch could be accepted and if it was CS/EC/EE it was ok, EC/EE folks like me would be able to show how many CS courses they had as part of the educational evaluation. I hear some people from EE/EC are also having a hard time and folks from other branches are being denied. I read for 1 case with MTech in EE with 5 years of experience even the consulate gave a hard time for H1B stamping. So definitely the time has changed.

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Originally Posted by TeddyKoochu

Veni / Spec thanks for your insights. Veni thanks for clarifying on the 4 Yr degree equivalents this is very significant I did not know that this will potentially disqualify many people from porting. Spec I fully agree with you that all 3+2 degrees would really be equated to bachelors, MCA can be the exception. I have seen most MCA folks also playing it safe with the labor they would try the bachelors + 5 years route.
Another area is people with 4 years engineering degree in IT, in yester years any branch could be accepted and if it was CS/EC/EE it was ok, EC/EE folks like me would be able to show how many CS courses they had as part of the educational evaluation. I hear some people from EE/EC are also having a hard time and folks from other branches are being denied. I read for 1 case with MTech in EE with 5 years of experience even the consulate gave a hard time for H1B stamping. So definitely the time has changed.

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Not sure about the education credentials for GC part for engineering graduates from other branches. However for H1B, I suspect it is a scare tactics by USCIS/DOS at the direction of Obama administration to "create jobs" here.

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Originally Posted by gcq

However for H1B, I suspect it is a scare tactics by USCIS/DOS at the direction of Obama administration to "create jobs" here.

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I tihnk you're right about this. But I'm not sure what the results will be of such tactics

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Originally Posted by Lauhig

I tihnk you're right about this. But I'm not sure what the results will be of such tactics

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More outsourcing, that would be the result. Obama administration is playing into the hands of outsourcing companies. When companies become desperate for workers, they will outsource the entire project.