Issues with BS+MS from India

Hi Gurus and every forum member

My first EB2 I-140 was approved with the priority date of April 2008. The second I-140 just filed got RFE for 3 yr BS and 2 Yr MS issue. My attny is Murthy and I am trying everything I can to respond. Any help/advise would be greatly appreciated. So far, I contacted FIS-web.com, Sheila Danzig, AACRAO and WES for credential evaluation. TrustForte declined to give any evaluation. They seems to play a safe game at all cost. I even contacted many many professors in my field in US to help me but response is less than satisfactory. Both the BS and MS are done under fast track program from Manipal University. It sems like I need to prove that my BS + MS is equivalent to US MS in the same field. I am hoping for the best. Need to reply for RFE within 2 weeks. Dates are current, of course.

Gurus, please move it to appropriate thread if it does not belong here.

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Hi Gurus and every forum member

My first EB2 I-140 was approved with the priority date of April 2008. The second I-140 just filed got RFE for 3 yr BS and 2 Yr MS issue. My attny is Murthy and I am trying everything I can to respond. Any help/advise would be greatly appreciated. So far, I contacted FIS-web.com, Sheila Danzig, AACRAO and WES for credential evaluation. TrustForte declined to give any evaluation. They seems to play a safe game at all cost. I even contacted many many professors in my field in US to help me but response is less than satisfactory. Both the BS and MS are done under fast track program from Manipal University. It sems like I need to prove that my BS + MS is equivalent to US MS in the same field. I am hoping for the best. Need to reply for RFE within 2 weeks. Dates are current, of course.

Gurus, please move it to appropriate thread if it does not belong here.

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Im guessing you changed jobs or something to have filed another 140. ican think of 2 things
1) breaking it down to the lowest common denominator - credit hours. To earn Us degrees you need to earn a certain number of credit hours and generally a masters degree in the US needs a thesis. If you csn demonstrate that he number of credit hours in your 5 yr Manipal degree is more or less the same as needed in the US it should suffice.
2) have manipal issue a notarized letter saying whst you need it to say and maybe have a Dean or someone high up sign it.

Ofcourse these are just my thoughts and not legal advice. Good luck and keep us posted on how things go.

gtyagi - viz is right. You have to show equivalent credit hours. If nobody does it for you - simply send a list of all courses and their equivalents in US.

On a different note - do you know that BS + 5/6 years (I am not sure if 5 or 6) of experience qualifies for EB2? So your Indian BS/MS + experience so far should qualify you for EB2. So USCIS will consider your BS + MS as BS equivalent in US.

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Hi Gurus and every forum member

My first EB2 I-140 was approved with the priority date of April 2008. The second I-140 just filed got RFE for 3 yr BS and 2 Yr MS issue. My attny is Murthy and I am trying everything I can to respond. Any help/advise would be greatly appreciated. So far, I contacted FIS-web.com, Sheila Danzig, AACRAO and WES for credential evaluation. TrustForte declined to give any evaluation. They seems to play a safe game at all cost. I even contacted many many professors in my field in US to help me but response is less than satisfactory. Both the BS and MS are done under fast track program from Manipal University. It sems like I need to prove that my BS + MS is equivalent to US MS in the same field. I am hoping for the best. Need to reply for RFE within 2 weeks. Dates are current, of course.

Gurus, please move it to appropriate thread if it does not belong here.

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Having Sheela Murthy as your attorney really helps, I have heard about many successful completions of three year degree cases through her firm. Sheila Danzig will do a course by course evaluation, but I think she charges a lot of money. I am not sure Sheela Murthy's firm will be comfortable with Sheila Danzing's course by course evaluation. Talk to the attorney before spending money on course by course evaluation.

At the I-140 stage, you can use 5 years of progressive experience when it is 3+2 degree, if your labor is worded correctly.

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Hi Gurus and every forum member

My first EB2 I-140 was approved with the priority date of April 2008. The second I-140 just filed got RFE for 3 yr BS and 2 Yr MS issue. My attny is Murthy and I am trying everything I can to respond. Any help/advise would be greatly appreciated. So far, I contacted FIS-web.com, Sheila Danzig, AACRAO and WES for credential evaluation. TrustForte declined to give any evaluation. They seems to play a safe game at all cost. I even contacted many many professors in my field in US to help me but response is less than satisfactory. Both the BS and MS are done under fast track program from Manipal University. It sems like I need to prove that my BS + MS is equivalent to US MS in the same field. I am hoping for the best. Need to reply for RFE within 2 weeks. Dates are current, of course.

Gurus, please move it to appropriate thread if it does not belong here.

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Originally Posted by MATT2012

Having Sheela Murthy as your attorney really helps, I have heard about many successful completions of three year degree cases through her firm. Sheila Danzig will do a course by course evaluation, but I think she charges a lot of money. I am not sure Sheela Murthy's firm will be comfortable with Sheila Danzing's course by course evaluation. Talk to the attorney before spending money on course by course evaluation.

At the I-140 stage, you can use 5 years of progressive experience when it is 3+2 degree, if your labor is worded correctly.

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Hi Matt, Viz, Q
Thank you for your advise. Attny at Murthy advised Sheila Danzig. Attny at Murthy says that we cannot use BS + 5 as in PERM it is mentioned that no combination of education and experience will be accepted. Now, Sheila Danzig and another expert in her team says that BS + 5 applies as it is federal law. I am confused.
I am trying to get course by course evaluation done by Sheila Danzig, FIS-web, WES and AACRAO. I am waiting for the results. I am trying to get expert letter from Sheila Danzig and hoping to get it without BS + 5 as advised by murthy.

gtyagi - unfortunately I think both are right but Murthy is more right.

If I read you correctly - Murthy is saying that this particular job was meant ONLY for somebody with BS and MS degrees.

Whereas Sheila Danzig is talking about the federal law about what is eligible to be considered EB2.

So while by federal law the job may be classified as EB2, murthy is saying that you still don't fulfil the job requirement. I am sorry but you may want to go back to Murthy and ask them what are the implications.

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Hi Matt, Viz, Q
Thank you for your advise. Attny at Murthy advised Sheila Danzig. Attny at Murthy says that we cannot use BS + 5 as in PERM it is mentioned that no combination of education and experience will be accepted. Now, Sheila Danzig and another expert in her team says that BS + 5 applies as it is federal law. I am confused.
I am trying to get course by course evaluation done by Sheila Danzig, FIS-web, WES and AACRAO. I am waiting for the results. I am trying to get expert letter from Sheila Danzig and hoping to get it without BS + 5 as advised by murthy.

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Murthy is right. For Eb2, requirement is BS + 5yrs or MS + 3 yrs.

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Attny at Murthy says that we cannot use BS + 5 as in PERM it is mentioned that no combination of education and experience will be accepted. Now, Sheila Danzig and another expert in her team says that BS + 5 applies as it is federal law.

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I am curious what your new PERM says to invalidate the the BS + 5 rule according to Murthy...
Does it say that the minimum education level required is MS?
Does it say that experience required for the job is 5 years?
Does it say that alternate combination of education and experience is not acceptable?
Does it say that foreign education equivalent is not acceptable?

It seems to me that a combination of these questions needs to line up correctly.

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Originally Posted by tenyearsgone

I am curious what your new PERM says to invalidate the the BS + 5 rule according to Murthy...
Does it say that the minimum education level required is MS?
Does it say that experience required for the job is 5 years?
Does it say that alternate combination of education and experience is not acceptable?
Does it say that foreign education equivalent is not acceptable?

It seems to me that a combination of these questions needs to line up correctly.

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Q, I am meeting with the Attny on Monday and will talk to him again.
Tenyearsgone, here is what is on labor.
The PERM has PD of 1/3/2013 with a request to retain a prior priority date of 4/9/2008. The PERM has following:

Education: Master

Major Field of study: Speech Language Pahtology or related.

Training: None Required

Experience in the job offered: 12 months

Alternate field of study: None accepted.

Alternate combination of education and experience: None accepted.

Foreign educational euivalent: Accepted

Experience in the alternate occupation: 12 months as Speech Language Pathologist

I think Murthy is right that you cannot use BS + 5 for below labor. It is very restrictively worded and without a masters degree to accompany it, it will probably not clear 140.
I think the credit based evaluation suggested by Viz / Q is ur best option. Im not an expert in this, so this is just an opinion. even if the I 140 gets approved, this can
get you into trouble during filing I 485 since the adjucating guy can go back and issue RFE for it. Just be prepared for that.

The wording on labor application is something that folks take lightly (and do not review with their attorney / employer) not knowing that in every stage of green card processing as well as post green card processing (for a reasonable time though there are exceptions to this) , you are not only supposed to perform a job similar to that mentioned in Labor, but you should always meet the requirements specified in it (whenever USCIS decides to review it like during filing 140, 485, retreiving 485 from dust after few months etc) The new job should have similar requirements as in original labor

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Q, I am meeting with the Attny on Monday and will talk to him again.
Tenyearsgone, here is what is on labor.
The PERM has PD of 1/3/2013 with a request to retain a prior priority date of 4/9/2008. The PERM has following:

Education: Master

Major Field of study: Speech Language Pahtology or related.

Training: None Required

Experience in the job offered: 12 months

Alternate field of study: None accepted.

Alternate combination of education and experience: None accepted.

Foreign educational euivalent: Accepted

Experience in the alternate occupation: 12 months as Speech Language Pathologist

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Justfying 3 + 2 masters such as BSC + MCA to MS is very difficult.. atleast these days... bs - 16 yrs schooling.. MS is +2 more..

If perm states ms, then no other combination will work..agree with seatlet.. this can potentially haunt in longer run...

I am a first hand victim of this 3 year + 2 year ... wording techniques ... phrases... job title...job duties...wage...
Murthy is my present attorney, she went with trust forte as suggested by murthy, it worked.
Last time AACRAO did work, and once AACRAO did not work.

Long story short, i have applied for PERM and I-140 total 5 times so far in this country with 2 times hit and 3 miss. I have mid 2010 as my PD and waiting and waiting again with just the "hope" factor.

Why in this world this immigration system / process be fixed??? Why cannot they recognize international degres clearly??? Why can't they let I-140 approved alien switch job's freely???
hmmm !!!No doubt of complete messed up system in this era of globalization

You all are correct, as murthy mentioned in this case gtyagi : the wording are catchy, but still keep the hope.
Also another note : for 3 year + 2 year + 1 year ... so on non-us degree's. TSC center works little different and i have seen they aren't strict. My approvals are from TSC, my rejections are not from TSC.
Good Luck

gtyagi - curious what happened with your case. If I remember correctly - murthy had said that the PERM description disqualified you - in other words - even if USCIS were to find you acceptable under EB2 based on your education and experience - that the underlying PERM may be denied based on you not being qualified for the same as per the job description.

I am very interested in this because DOL apparently didn't find any fault with PERM and they cleared it. So USCIS shouldn't go and reexamine PERM. They should simply make a decision on whether you qualify under EB2 or not which apparently you do.

Please let us know what your situation is.

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Originally Posted by gtyagi

Q, I am meeting with the Attny on Monday and will talk to him again.
Tenyearsgone, here is what is on labor.
The PERM has PD of 1/3/2013 with a request to retain a prior priority date of 4/9/2008. The PERM has following:

Education: Master

Major Field of study: Speech Language Pahtology or related.

Training: None Required

Experience in the job offered: 12 months

Alternate field of study: None accepted.

Alternate combination of education and experience: None accepted.

Foreign educational euivalent: Accepted

Experience in the alternate occupation: 12 months as Speech Language Pathologist

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Originally Posted by qriousjunta

I am a first hand victim of this 3 year + 2 year ... wording techniques ... phrases... job title...job duties...wage...
Murthy is my present attorney, she went with trust forte as suggested by murthy, it worked.
Last time AACRAO did work, and once AACRAO did not work.

Long story short, i have applied for PERM and I-140 total 5 times so far in this country with 2 times hit and 3 miss. I have mid 2010 as my PD and waiting and waiting again with just the "hope" factor.

Why in this world this immigration system / process be fixed??? Why cannot they recognize international degres clearly??? Why can't they let I-140 approved alien switch job's freely???
hmmm !!!No doubt of complete messed up system in this era of globalization

You all are correct, as murthy mentioned in this case gtyagi : the wording are catchy, but still keep the hope.
Also another note : for 3 year + 2 year + 1 year ... so on non-us degree's. TSC center works little different and i have seen they aren't strict. My approvals are from TSC, my rejections are not from TSC.
Good Luck

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Understad ur frustration..think about fraud scenarios.. there can't be one equation to solve all problems.. in same way current rules won't justify exceptional scenarios.. it is what is .. but in my opinion its fair game upto 80%.. rest 20 gets effected
unfortunately.. to fix the rest think of the time, money, effort that is required.. with so many interested parties involved, reaching certain rules that govern all applicable scenarios is highly unlikely to define..

Hope for the best and as Darwin said we evolve..so as our practice and system..

Don't get carried away and have patience ..al well that ends well..

And lemme pickup a line from Q as well :-) ...ganapathi bappa moriya..
Excuse me for typos.. I use tabbiiie .. ( I.e. tablet in my kid's language)..