EB2-3 Predictions (Rather Calculations) 2015-2020

[idliman]

I believe another employer can initiate H1b transfer at any point in time, regardless of the 180-day window from the employer who filed I485. AC21 doesn't require the individual to be employed with the employer who filed for 180 days, does it? Or is it that it's recommended to be with the employer for 180 days out of abundance of caution?
H1B/L1 and AOS Pending are two parallel and separate status'es. Only one of them is active. If you had not updated I-9 with EAD or not entered the country using AP, you are in H1B / L1 status. So you will follow the same steps assuming that you are in one status only. For H1B transfer follow whatever procedure that has been done before. If you want to complicate things, you can have multiple H1Bs at the same time.

The 180 days is concerning only the I485 and subsequent use of AC21 job portability. To avail that benefit you need to stay with the employer for 180 days from the notice day. After that period you can port without starting another PERM/I-140. You become a "free agent" after that 180 day period. That's why it is important to stay with your employer for 180 days.

Now if you do H1B transfer within the 180 days, then you violate your 180 day clock on the I485. So you may have to redo PERM and I-140 all over again.

[kuku82]

H1B/L1 and AOS Pending are two parallel and separate status'es. Only one of them is active. If you had not updated I-9 with EAD or not entered the country using AP, you are in H1B / L1 status. So you will follow the same steps assuming that you are in one status only. For H1B transfer follow whatever procedure that has been done before. If you want to complicate things, you can have multiple H1Bs at the same time.

The 180 days is concerning only the I485 and subsequent use of AC21 job portability. To avail that benefit you need to stay with the employer for 180 days from the notice day. After that period you can port without starting another PERM/I-140. You become a "free agent" after that 180 day period. That's why it is important to stay with your employer for 180 days.

Now if you do H1B transfer within the 180 days, then you violate your 180 day clock on the I485. So you may have to redo PERM and I-140 all over again.

Correct, I forgot to mention the part if currently on H1 with employer A who filed for I485 and no change in I-9, and now employer B wants to initiate H1 transfer. I believe should not impact the 180-day clock whatsoever.

Separately, I'm curious where this aspect about sticking with employer for 180-days post notice date is documented? Any links to share?

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Correct, I forgot to mention the part if currently on H1 with employer A who filed for I485 and no change in I-9, and now employer B wants to initiate H1 transfer. I believe should not impact the 180-day clock whatsoever.

Separately, I'm curious where this aspect about sticking with employer for 180-days post notice date is documented? Any links to share?

Explained pretty succinctly here on the landing page itself:
https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/how-uscis-determines-same-or-similar-occupational-classifications-for-job-portability-under-ac21

Also just to be technically correct, it's not 180 days from the Notice Date, it's from the Received Date.

[idliman]

Correct, I forgot to mention the part if currently on H1 with employer A who filed for I485 and no change in I-9, and now employer B wants to initiate H1 transfer. I believe should not impact the 180-day clock whatsoever.
Separately, I'm curious where this aspect about sticking with employer for 180-days post notice date is documented? Any links to share?
If you do a H1B transfer within the 180 days, you are taking a risk. The following does not say that you need to stay with the employer directly, but it is implied. Now if you transfer after 120 days and say you get a RFE on the 150th day, then you will have 2 to 3 months for the RFE deadline. By the time you reply the RFE your 180 day clock might have crossed. But you are starting to increase the risks of something going wrong.

Having waited for so many years to get a chance to file I485, why would you unnecessarily take a risk and go into a grey area? The whole point of filing for I485 based on DF dates is to avail AC21 benefits after 180 days. Anyway it is your choice.

USCIS Policy Manual has a Chapter on AC21 (https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-5). It says


To qualify for portability under INA 204(j), the adjustment applicant must meet the following eligibility requirements:


The applicant is the beneficiary of an approved Form I-140 petition or of a pending petition that is ultimately approved;
The petition is filed in the employment-based 1st, 2nd, or 3rd preference category;
The applicant?s properly filed adjustment application has been pending with USCIS for 180 days or more at the time USCIS receives the request to port;
The new job offer through which the applicant seeks to adjust status is in the same or similar occupational classification as the job specified in the petition; and
The applicant submitted a request to port. If the applicant makes a request to port on or after January 17, 2017, the applicant must submit a Confirmation of Bona Fide Job Offer or Request for Job Portability Under INA Section 204(j) (Form I-485 Supplement J). If the applicant requested to port before January 17, 2017, the applicant could have requested to port through a letter, since Form I-485 Supplement J did not go into effect until January 17, 2017.

The new job offer may be with the same petitioner or with an entirely new employer, including self-employment. Applicants can submit the portability request and evidence with the adjustment application or in any in-person interviews or in response to a request or other notice from USCIS.

[kuku82]

Explained pretty succinctly here on the landing page itself:
https://www.uscis.gov/working-in-the-united-states/how-uscis-determines-same-or-similar-occupational-classifications-for-job-portability-under-ac21

Also just to be technically correct, it's not 180 days from the Notice Date, it's from the Received Date.

It simply says it needs to be pending for 180 days. Doesn't require the individual to also be employed by the filing entity in that duration. I've been reading up this as well: https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-5

It's entirely possible I'm missing something........

[moonlight]

If you do a H1B transfer within the 180 days, you are taking a risk. The following does not say that you need to stay with the employer directly, but it is implied. Now if you transfer after 120 days and say you get a RFE on the 150th day, then you will have 2 to 3 months for the RFE deadline. By the time you reply the RFE your 180 day clock might have crossed. But you are starting to increase the risks of something going wrong.

Having waited for so many years to get a chance to file I485, why would you unnecessarily take a risk and go into a grey area? The whole point of filing for I485 based on DF dates is to avail AC21 benefits after 180 days. Anyway it is your choice.

USCIS Policy Manual has a Chapter on AC21 (https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-5). It says

Thanks idliman for clarification on AC21. It is clear now that I-485 should be pending for 180 days from received date. But it is still grey area if any individual can initiate H1B transfer before 180 days and NOT join the new company until 180 days clock is over. Many people are in that situation and wondering if they can at least initiate H1B transfer. Do you see any risk?

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Thanks idliman for clarification on AC21. It is clear now that I-485 should be pending for 180 days from received date. But it is still grey area if any individual can initiate H1B transfer before 180 days and NOT join the new company until 180 days clock is over. Many people are in that situation and wondering if they can at least initiate H1B transfer. Do you see any risk?

I don't know man, it seems pretty clear to me from the below line. You lose portability if you don't wait 180 days. There are no grey areas or workarounds in my opinion. Best you check with your own attorney or get a consult if you don't have one to get the official word.

For you to change the offer of employment or employer, your Form I-485 must have been pending with USCIS for 180 days or more.

[kuku82]

If you do a H1B transfer within the 180 days, you are taking a risk. The following does not say that you need to stay with the employer directly, but it is implied. Now if you transfer after 120 days and say you get a RFE on the 150th day, then you will have 2 to 3 months for the RFE deadline. By the time you reply the RFE your 180 day clock might have crossed. But you are starting to increase the risks of something going wrong.

Having waited for so many years to get a chance to file I485, why would you unnecessarily take a risk and go into a grey area? The whole point of filing for I485 based on DF dates is to avail AC21 benefits after 180 days. Anyway it is your choice.

USCIS Policy Manual has a Chapter on AC21 (https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-5). It says

Totally agree not worth the risk. Just trying to understand the law here. Read about unfortunate cases such as job loss after 485 being filed and before 180 days are up. The pending 485, since it's for future employment, I believe gives legal status and opportunity to seek another employment once 180 days have passed.

[inspired_p]

For you to change the offer of employment or employer, your Form I-485 must have been pending with USCIS for 180 days or more.
To be even more clear, if one has to change employers before 180 days then the new employer has to apply for PERM and I-140 again for the employee.
The AC21 rules allows the existing pending I-485 to be I-1140 independent.

[rocketfast]

IMO, there is nothing called "H1B transfer". It is a new H1B application. I do not see any problem with applying for a new H1B application which asks for a start date after 180 days. For e.g, H1B approval letter has a "start date for approval". You are only supposed to work for 180 days with the old employer. It does not tell that you can't interview, initiate a new H1B application with a later starting date.

Edit: This information came from a immi lawyer of a good firm.

[ak7419]

Does anyone know truth to this statement - heard during RNLawgroup live youtube session that USCIS received ~415,000 downgrade applications.

[gcconnect]

Does anyone know truth to this statement - heard during RNLawgroup live youtube session that USCIS received ~415,000 downgrade applications.


This is similar
https://www.gtlaw-insidebusinessimmigration.com/covid-19/uscis-lockbox-update-regarding-receipt-notice-delays-2/

[vsivarama]

Does anyone know truth to this statement - heard during RNLawgroup live youtube session that USCIS received ~415,000 downgrade applications.

That's not possible. See the link below. The total number of i140s till 2019 are EB2-336596 and EB3-80388. Even including the dependents it's quite a stretch to image 415K applications were received. What could be is that everything applied is counted as an application. So a family of 2 applying for AOS are technically applying 7 applications (2 - i485s, 2 - i765s, 2-i131s, 1-i140/i485SupJ). I can see ~415K based on the above metrics.

https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/data/I140_by_class_country_FY09_19.pdf

[moonlight]

IMO, there is nothing called "H1B transfer". It is a new H1B application. I do not see any problem with applying for a new H1B application which asks for a start date after 180 days. For e.g, H1B approval letter has a "start date for approval". You are only supposed to work for 180 days with the old employer. It does not tell that you can't interview, initiate a new H1B application with a later starting date.

Edit: This information came from a immi lawyer of a good firm.

Thanks rocketfast. It makes sense.

[InbaMayam]

Hello Gurus and everyone , appreciate all of your valuable posts.

I am eb3-I and my priority date is current since Jan2021 and my 485 is not approved yet, so far no status change after interview was completed in 2019. 485 was applied in Jan2019 , didn't use attorney's help. I am having EAD renewed until mid of 2022. My contract is ending with client in Feb 2020. My client and my current employer (485 sponsor) agreed to the full time employment conversion with client.
I have not changed jobs and currently working on h1 with my 485 sponsor last 15 years. I am planning to use EAD to join my client and joining date would be March 1st.

If my 485 is approved before March 1st, then is it ok to use the GC and join my client, without making an I-9 entry of GC with my 485 sponsor.
Any valuable suggestions please. Sincere Thanks.

[smac1982]

New ask for Supplement J may have nothing to do with your work from home option. Now a days whole world is doing remote work anyway. It is just a confirmation that USCIS requires in preparation of advancing the dates to make sure you still are employed bonafide as is mentioned by your job description. Go ahead and submit new supplement J and not worry about anything else.

Thanks for your response. The RFE did say that the latest correspondence to USCIS indicated that I moved away from the geographical area specified in my most recent SupJ. As you said, it's better that I submit a new SupJ even though there's no change from the last time. Hopefully this is the last time I have to do this before I get greened :).

[inspired_p]

IMO, there is nothing called "H1B transfer". It is a new H1B application. I do not see any problem with applying for a new H1B application which asks for a start date after 180 days. For e.g, H1B approval letter has a "start date for approval". You are only supposed to work for 180 days with the old employer. It does not tell that you can't interview, initiate a new H1B application with a later starting date.

Edit: This information came from a immi lawyer of a good firm.
So does this make sense ??
" Bottom line is one can't leave the sponsor employer till 180 days after receipt or else I-485J of the new employer will not be allowed and I-485 will be denied. New employer will have to file PERM and I-140 for the employee in that case"

[rocketfast]

So does this make sense ??
" Bottom line is one can't leave the sponsor employer till 180 days after receipt or else I-485J of the new employer will not be allowed and I-485 will be denied. New employer will have to file PERM and I-140 for the employee in that case"

The USCIS language is not clear, but the general consensus is as you say above. I do know a friend that got laid off before 180 days. He joined the new employer, who filed his 485-j and it was NOT rejected and he got his GC. But I don't think that is the norm though.

[Ron1981]

Hello friends - I have a situation similar to that being discussed here and looking for guidance. My current employer filed for my I-140, EAD/AP & 485 in Oct 2020. I have received the receipts from USCIS for EAD/AP & 485. But no update on I-140. I have a new job offer that I'd like to take, and the employer is willing to wait for 180 days (end of April 2021) for me to begin. However, with no update on my I-140, I am not sure what to do. I learnt that you can receive your EAD/AP even without your I-140 being approved. Can I take the new job with after EAD/AP is approved, but my I-140 is not approved?

[krisswaves]

Hi guys, My PD is in Aug-2011 EB2, the current client where i am working is offering me FTE. I am not able to decide whether to take the offer or stick with the current employer and get EAD if the dates move in EB2/EB3(by downgrading) this FY, or at least in the start of FY22. I am hoping there will be some movement at the start of next FY. On the other hand, if I take the FTE offer with the client, I am thinking it's going to be at least 2 - 2 1/2 yrs until I'll be able to apply for I-140 because they don't start the PERM process for the first one year. Appreciate any suggestions/inputs. Thanks

[android09]

I don't know man, it seems pretty clear to me from the below line. You lose portability if you don't wait 180 days. There are no grey areas or workarounds in my opinion. Best you check with your own attorney or get a consult if you don't have one to get the official word.

For you to change the offer of employment or employer, your Form I-485 must have been pending with USCIS for 180 days or more.

Is it 180 calendar days or 180 business days ?

[knighthood83]

This is not true. AC21 states that adjustment application should be pending 180 days. It does not say you need to be employed. There is a difference. Lots of employers dont withdraw the petition. If you are out of a job on day 150 sure you are not portable but on day 181 you do become portable. The law states the adjustment application must be pending 180 days does not say anything about a job

[moonlight]

Is it 180 calendar days or 180 business days ?

It is calendar days.

[LeoAugust]

H1B/L1 and AOS Pending are two parallel and separate status'es. Only one of them is active. If you had not updated I-9 with EAD or not entered the country using AP, you are in H1B / L1 status. So you will follow the same steps assuming that you are in one status only. For H1B transfer follow whatever procedure that has been done before. If you want to complicate things, you can have multiple H1Bs at the same time.

The 180 days is concerning only the I485 and subsequent use of AC21 job portability. To avail that benefit you need to stay with the employer for 180 days from the notice day. After that period you can port without starting another PERM/I-140. You become a "free agent" after that 180 day period. That's why it is important to stay with your employer for 180 days.

Now if you do H1B transfer within the 180 days, then you violate your 180 day clock on the I485. So you may have to redo PERM and I-140 all over again.

"The 180 days is concerning only the I485 and subsequent use of AC21 job portability. To avail that benefit you need to stay with the employer for 180 days from the notice day."-- Is it 180 days from received date or notice date? For e.g. if my document is submitted to USCIS on Oct-29 (which is the received date) but the notice date is Jan 30. On such scenario 180 days will be calculated from Oct-29-2020 or Jan-30-2021?

[LeoAugust]

Is it 180 calendar days or 180 business days ?

Calenday days. For e.g. If your received date of document at uscis is Dec-31-2020 then Jul-01-2021 you can use AC21 to switch job.

[Octgc7]

Sorry for posting in this thread.....but wanted to check with the forum experts regarding a passport related issue........
There is a typo in the ?place of birth? field listed on my wife's passport . It differs from the one listed on her birth certificate. In the VFS site, for passport renewal, I see there is a check box for
Miscellaneous Service with option "Do you want to Change your Place of birth?" Has anyone availed this feature during their passport renewal process.
Any help/information regarding this will be much appreciated.
Thanks in advance!

I also had the same issue with "Place of birth" in my passport. I was able to change it in my passport in oct 2020 and it was done through CKGS at that time. Misc service was chosen for the option. I dont remember the exact steps in it.

[idliman]

"The 180 days is concerning only the I485 and subsequent use of AC21 job portability. To avail that benefit you need to stay with the employer for 180 days from the notice day."-- Is it 180 days from received date or notice date? For e.g. if my document is submitted to USCIS on Oct-29 (which is the received date) but the notice date is Jan 30. On such scenario 180 days will be calculated from Oct-29-2020 or Jan-30-2021?
It is "Received Date" as noted by Turbulent_Dragonfly above.

The 180 days is based on calendar days (not business days). The clock starts with the "Received Date" of your I-485 application, as indicated in your I-797 receipt notice.

It is also clearly stated in the USCIS Policy Manual (https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-5).


If USCIS has approved an applicant?s Form I-140 petition and the applicant?s adjustment application remained unadjudicated for 180 days or more (from the adjustment application receipt date), the approved petition remains valid unless the petition?s approval is later substantively revoked. This applies even if the applicant changes jobs or employers so long as the new offer of employment is in the same or similar occupation. If the adjustment application has been pending for less than 180 days, the approved petition does not remain valid with respect to a new offer of employment.

[iamdeb]

I also had the same issue with "Place of birth" in my passport. I was able to change it in my passport in oct 2020 and it was done through CKGS at that time. Misc service was chosen for the option. I dont remember the exact steps in it.

Appreciate the response!!couple of questions if you don't mind...how long did it take to get your corrected passport back? and also did you have to provide any supporting document as evidence for the place of birth?

[rocketfast]

This is not true. AC21 states that adjustment application should be pending 180 days. It does not say you need to be employed. There is a difference. Lots of employers dont withdraw the petition. If you are out of a job on day 150 sure you are not portable but on day 181 you do become portable. The law states the adjustment application must be pending 180 days does not say anything about a job

This is pretty much exactly that happened with my friend. He got laid off. The employer assured him that they will not withdraw the petition. He joined a new company who filed the 485-j. But, USCIS language is not very clear here to make an assertion that this is always true. It is surprising that something as common as this does not have clear answers in the USCIS website.

Some snippets from immi lawyer websites:


B6. Will my I‐485 AOS application be denied if I am laid off less than 180 days after it was filed?

Not necessarily. USCIS has stated that an I‐485 AOS application will not necessarily be denied if the applicant leaves the I‐140 immigrant visa petitioner
less than 180 days after the AOS application is filed. This is because both the I‐140 immigrant visa petition and I‐485 AOS application focus on the
prospective (future) employment of the applicant. That said, both the I‐140 immigrant visa petition‐filing employer must have intended to offer, and the I‐
485 AOS applicant must have intended to accept the employment at the time of AOS filing. USCIS has indicated it will investigate such cases as it deems
appropriate.

..

I lost my job before the I-485 had been pending 180 days. Can I still use portability?

There are some key concerns in this situation. If one is laid off, it is best to get input from an experienced immigration attorney to address status maintenance and the preservation of any possible benefits from the prior green card filing. Often, it is best to file a new green card case as a backup, even if it is potentially possible to pursue a pending green card case.

[smuggymba]

Anyone from TSC received RFE's for 485 from when we submitted it in 2012? My PD is March 2010 and no RFE/no communication so far but I'm seeing some action from Nebraska on trackit for 2010 PD's.

[ak7419]

Anyone from TSC received RFE's for 485 from when we submitted it in 2012? My PD is March 2010 and no RFE/no communication so far but I'm seeing some action from Nebraska on trackit for 2010 PD's. I am current since November and have not received any RFE. My case is with NSC and my spouse's with TSC. Neither of us received any communication from USCIS recently. waiting game...

[android09]

I had not logged on the qesehmk forum for a few days and came back in last evening, I must say each and every page of this forum is gold. I caught up from 352 to now and my word, the amount of valid, relevant and important discussion in those 8-9 pages is just astounding. Sending my thank you to all who provides such key insights that informs everyone !

[Pundit Arjun]

I am current since November and have not received any RFE. My case is with NSC and my spouse's with TSC. Neither of us received any communication from USCIS recently. waiting game...

Use your senator or online inquiry. I used it and got RFEs triggered.

[Moveon]

Appreciate the response!!couple of questions if you don't mind...how long did it take to get your corrected passport back? and also did you have to provide any supporting document as evidence for the place of birth?

Please keep your passport and birth certificate in sync to avoid any issues with GC issuance. If they see a discrepancy they will cause issues .

[qesehmk]

If you lose your job less than 180 days since your 485 is pending, just hold tight until 180 calendar days are completed. You are still in status. Don't worry.

After your 180 days are completed, you can switch to a new employer and you don't even need an H1. Simply use your EAD when you get one.

[knighthood83]

If you lose your job less than 180 days since your 485 is pending, just hold tight until 180 calendar days are completed. You are still in status. Don't worry.

After your 180 days are completed, you can switch to a new employer and you don't even need an H1. Simply use your EAD when you get one.

Thanks Q I agree spoke with an attorney on this and they said the same. The only thing I would say is when one moves on a EAD there would have to be some sort of an arrangement for the new Employer to support 485J right?

Is that usually a problem?

[Zenzone]

Thanks Q I agree spoke with an attorney on this and they said the same. The only thing I would say is when one moves on a EAD there would have to be some sort of an arrangement for the new Employer to support 485J right?

Is that usually a problem?

Usually it isn't a problem. Just make sure the job is in the same or similar field pursuant to AC21 portability requirements. But the 485-J pprwrk. burden on the employer is very light. Usually many if not most will agree to it because it involves on visa sponsorship or PERM/I-140 applications which way more involving on them.

[mrperfect]

Gurus .. Need your advice plz.. My PD is 12/23/09 (EB2) i have been on EAD since 02/12 .. My wife got a PD 5/18/10 from a small Desi consulting company with approved 140.. However she switched to use EAD from my PD and has been working FT with a big financial company. Should we revive her PD and apply? or wait for mine to reach the line... the wait is killing :(

[Mgajsk]

Folks who received EAD on October filing. How long after your received an update from USCIS to reuse Bio-metrics, have you received your EAD cards?
Does getting this Biometric reuse status mean the USCIS is close to processing the EAD application?



765,131 Filing Date : Dec 07 2020 ( Applied after I received the 485 receipt no )
765,131 Received Date : Jan 16 2021
765,131 Notice' Date : Jan 27 2021 ( Notice to reuse bio-metrics done for 485)

PD : Mar 2011 (EB2-I)
485 Filing date : Oct 19 2020
485 Receipt notice date : Nov 11 2020
Bio-metric notice received date : 01/02/2021
Bio-metric appointment date : 01/12/2021 (Grand Rapids Mi ASC)

[Transformer]

Gurus, I filed 485/EAD/AP in October. EB2-EB3 downgrade with PD May 2011 (missed Eb2 by 2 days). Due to family emergency I had to travel to India. I am back in USA and received my receipts last week. I know I have to refile my AP as my travel out of country invalidated it. Do I need to pay filing fee for AP or is it free even in this scenario? Also how hard it is to file on my own. Thank you.

[qesehmk]

Thanks Q I agree spoke with an attorney on this and they said the same. The only thing I would say is when one moves on a EAD there would have to be some sort of an arrangement for the new Employer to support 485J right?

Is that usually a problem?

485-J indeed is a requirement every time you switch a job before GC approval. There is no escaping (except perhaps when filing concurrent). Unfortunately DOS / USCIS have made it a requirement.

The good thing is that it is not very onerous. So employers should be able to take care of this quickly.

[Octgc7]

Appreciate the response!!couple of questions if you don't mind...how long did it take to get your corrected passport back? and also did you have to provide any supporting document as evidence for the place of birth?

It took about a month to receive the passport in hand. Copy of original birth certificate and copy of digital birth certificate from the state government website were submitted as evidence (You need only one of it as evidence). Just want to add that my "Place of birth" was entirely different in the passport, not a typo. Only city of birth can be changed, State or Country of birth CANNOT be changed.

Even though my passport had validity for 4 more years, it was submitted as renewal. So I had to submit all the other documents for passport renewal in addition to the birth certificate copy. The latest passport has an expiry of 10 years from the applied date.

If you applied to New York consulate, it has online helpline called PRAMIT (Pravasi Mitra). Their response was really good with all the clarifications and status update.

[LeoAugust]

If you lose your job less than 180 days since your 485 is pending, just hold tight until 180 calendar days are completed. You are still in status. Don't worry.

After your 180 days are completed, you can switch to a new employer and you don't even need an H1. Simply use your EAD when you get one.

Current scenario Bio appointment is taking more than 4-5 months. What will happen if bio is not done and the person did not receive the card by that time?

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Folks who received EAD on October filing. How long after your received an update from USCIS to reuse Bio-metrics, have you received your EAD cards?
Does getting this Biometric reuse status mean the USCIS is close to processing the EAD application?



765,131 Filing Date : Dec 07 2020 ( Applied after I received the 485 receipt no )
765,131 Received Date : Jan 16 2021
765,131 Notice' Date : Jan 27 2021 ( Notice to reuse bio-metrics done for 485)

PD : Mar 2011 (EB2-I)
485 Filing date : Oct 19 2020
485 Receipt notice date : Nov 11 2020
Bio-metric notice received date : 01/02/2021
Bio-metric appointment date : 01/12/2021 (Grand Rapids Mi ASC)



Probably too late, but try not to reveal your true identity here or other online forums!

Also I applied in first week of Oct and did my FP in the first week of Dec and have not yet received any approvals for EAD/AP.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Gurus, I filed 485/EAD/AP in October. EB2-EB3 downgrade with PD May 2011 (missed Eb2 by 2 days). Due to family emergency I had to travel to India. I am back in USA and received my receipts last week. I know I have to refile my AP as my travel out of country invalidated it. Do I need to pay filing fee for AP or is it free even in this scenario? Also how hard it is to file on my own. Thank you.

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/filling-out-form-i-131-advance-parole.html

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Gurus .. Need your advice plz.. My PD is 12/23/09 (EB2) i have been on EAD since 02/12 .. My wife got a PD 5/18/10 from a small Desi consulting company with approved 140.. However she switched to use EAD from my PD and has been working FT with a big financial company. Should we revive her PD and apply? or wait for mine to reach the line... the wait is killing :(

So you have an earlier PD than your wife and want to apply based on her PD? Maybe you got your dates wrong or something because that question does not make sense.

[Mgajsk]

Probably too late, but try not to reveal your true identity here or other online forums!

Also I applied in first week of Oct and did my FP in the first week of Dec and have not yet received any approvals for EAD/AP.
Thank you.
is yours being processed and National benefits center?

[Transformer]

https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/filling-out-form-i-131-advance-parole.html
Thank you for the link. Fee part is little ambiguous. Just contacted my attorney and he says this:

Since the first AP never got approved, this filing will not be an extension. It will a first time AP so he will have to pay $575.00 for each applicant to file AP.

I am confused.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Thank you for the link. Fee part is little ambiguous. Just contacted my attorney and he says this:

Since the first AP never got approved, this filing will not be an extension. It will a first time AP so he will have to pay $575.00 for each applicant to file AP.

I am confused.

I believe he is right. In your case, your current I-131 application will eventually have a status of applied for and abandoned. So you essentially lost the freebie you get when applying for I-131 along with the I-485 and will have to pay for the new applications.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Thank you.
is yours being processed and National benefits center?

Yeah that's correct, applied at Dallas Lockbox and routed to MSC.

[19YRSNOGC]

So you have an earlier PD than your wife and want to apply based on her PD? Maybe you got your dates wrong or something because that question does not make sense.
maybe 1 in EB2 and other in EB3

[android09]

Given where we are in terms of visa bulletin movements, is there any kind of expectation of where the bulletin final dates may be in June 2021 and sept 2021? Just looking to see where we think we may land up in terms of the numbers in 3 and 6 months. Please opine.

[AceMan]

So you have an earlier PD than your wife and want to apply based on her PD? Maybe you got your dates wrong or something because that question does not make sense.

No he did not, he wants to try and get his GC 5 minutes faster because if it did not happen the wait might kill him.

[inspired_p]

Gurus .. Need your advice plz.. My PD is 12/23/09 (EB2) i have been on EAD since 02/12 .. My wife got a PD 5/18/10 from a small Desi consulting company with approved 140.. However she switched to use EAD from my PD and has been working FT with a big financial company. Should we revive her PD and apply? or wait for mine to reach the line... the wait is killing :(

Go for it if wife's employer is paying for it. In all probability it will be current before EB2 12/23/09.

[08jul11]

It simply says it needs to be pending for 180 days. Doesn't require the individual to also be employed by the filing entity in that duration. I've been reading up this as well: https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-e-chapter-5

It's entirely possible I'm missing something........


Does this means that even if the Filing employer is not the current employer, we can change the employer and be on EAD through AC21 benefit?

[qesehmk]

Current scenario Bio appointment is taking more than 4-5 months. What will happen if bio is not done and the person did not receive the card by that time?
You can still use your existing H1 (if you have one).

[LeoAugust]

You can still use your existing H1 (if you have one).
Yea. H1B will be the last hope...

[rabp77]

Given where we are in terms of visa bulletin movements, is there any kind of expectation of where the bulletin final dates may be in June 2021 and sept 2021? Just looking to see where we think we may land up in terms of the numbers in 3 and 6 months. Please opine.

For us to conclusively answer that question, we would need inventory data, which has not been published for almost 2.5 years now. So any guess is based on assumptions based on historical data. My guess is that horizontal spillover will be equally distributd across backlogged countries,resulting in india and china getting around 20000- 30000 extra visas each per eb category. This should leave eb3i moving around 15-30 months, and eb2 moving 10-20 months. So my guess is both both of these should get close to 2011 in worst case, and best case get close to 2013. Assuming 1-2 k inventory per month which was the case I'm 2009.

You should try whereismygc, as they have much more data to predict this. All predictions need to assume that every attempt will be made to prevent visa wastage.

[Dallas111]

Gurus
I have a question on I485J. MY PD is Oct 29, 2009 (EB2). I got an RFE from NSC that requires medicals and I485J. I had got same RFE in 2018 when I had submitted I485J and it was approved also. My employer is also not changed. Do you see any issue in me getting I485J again for same employer. I am planning to submit I485J again and my employer (large company) is also fine. I am planning to submit exactly same I485J response as last time.

RFE also mentions that if I need to continue with same lawyer (as in I 485 which is a different lawyer from previous company) , pls indicate. Do I need to continue with same lawyer and do I need a personal lawyer. Pls advise

[Moveon]

Gurus
I have a question on I485J. MY PD is Oct 29, 2009 (EB2). I got an RFE from NSC that requires medicals and I485J. I had got same RFE in 2018 when I had submitted I485J and it was approved also. My employer is also not changed. Do you see any issue in me getting I485J again for same employer. I am planning to submit I485J again and my employer (large company) is also fine. I am planning to submit exactly same I485J response as last time.

RFE also mentions that if I need to continue with same lawyer (as in I 485 which is a different lawyer from previous company) , pls indicate. Do I need to continue with same lawyer and do I need a personal lawyer. Pls advise

If your job role has not changed , then its fine to use the same . use the lawyer your company provides as all large companies pay for it . This is a straight forward procedure, so don't sweat it out.

[Zenzone]

Is there anything yet in JB's EOs that lifts the family GC ban from consulates? I don't re-collect seeing any and if that's true we may have more SOs than we think for fiscal 2022 also. Not bad eh.

[Zenzone]

Gurus
I have a question on I485J. MY PD is Oct 29, 2009 (EB2). I got an RFE from NSC that requires medicals and I485J. I had got same RFE in 2018 when I had submitted I485J and it was approved also. My employer is also not changed. Do you see any issue in me getting I485J again for same employer. I am planning to submit I485J again and my employer (large company) is also fine. I am planning to submit exactly same I485J response as last time.

RFE also mentions that if I need to continue with same lawyer (as in I 485 which is a different lawyer from previous company) , pls indicate. Do I need to continue with same lawyer and do I need a personal lawyer. Pls advise

Nothing stipulates you to use the same lawyer. Looks like your case is pretty straightforward too.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Is there anything yet in JB's EOs that lifts the family GC ban from consulates? I don't re-collect seeing any and if that's true we may have more SOs than we think for fiscal 2022 also. Not bad eh.

No, there is nothing in the EO to end the visa bans which has got people like gsiskind, ckuck all mad and threatening lawsuits. I will be shocked if we don't get 60k+ spillover for FY2022.

[samada]

I am current since November and have not received any RFE. My case is with NSC and my spouse's with TSC. Neither of us received any communication from USCIS recently. waiting game...

I am current since November with PD September 2009. First applied in 2012. RFE in 2014 and 2016. Recent RFE for 485j, Medicals and Geographical information on Jan 5th 2021. Responded RFE on 28th Jan 2021. Received receipt for 485J on 2/2/2021.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

I am current since November with PD September 2009. First applied in 2012. RFE in 2014 and 2016. Recent RFE for 485j, Medicals and Geographical information on Jan 5th 2021. Responded RFE on 28th Jan 2021. Received receipt for 485J on 2/2/2021.

My best friend had a June 2009 PD and became a citizen early last year, one of the fortunate ones... amazing what a few months difference in PDs in 2009 ended up costing. If they apply the spillover properly and issue the GC, one can hope people in 2010 won't meet the same fate.

[ak7419]

My best friend had a June 2009 PD and became a citizen early last year, one of the fortunate ones... amazing what a few months difference in PDs in 2009 ended up costing. If they apply the spillover properly and issue the GC, one can hope people in 2010 won't meet the same fate.

I have a handful of friends whose PD was only few months earlier than me and they are now applying for citizenship and I am still waiting for RFE.... :)

[AceMan]

My best friend had a June 2009 PD and became a citizen early last year, one of the fortunate ones... amazing what a few months difference in PDs in 2009 ended up costing. If they apply the spillover properly and issue the GC, one can hope people in 2010 won't meet the same fate.

With only 140,000 GC for entire category for the last 30 years, this problem is going to be extrapolated in the coming years. The recession of 2009-11 camouflaged the issue for some time, just like Covid pandemic from 2020 - 21,22. All these extra numbers is going to help max of people till the end of 2012.

So in the year 2027 you will have a Dec 2012 applicant as a citizen and a Jan 2014 applicant still on H1 if the demand is high for next 5 years after 2022.

EB green card numbers has to be raised to 250,000 and all the people with approved 140s given a one time GC to the tune of 1 million.

[idliman]

I have a handful of friends whose PD was only few months earlier than me and they are now applying for citizenship and I am still waiting for RFE.... :)
Hear you. I have at least 2 from same company who got GCs in 2012 (EB2I 2009 PDs) and became Citizens couple of years ago. The movement from COVID spillover is a golden chance. Sadly people who miss out on GCs might have to face what you and other 2012 EAD folks are going through. A few months may matter a lot for some unfortunate folks. That's why I am advising everyone to keep one feet on EB2 and other on EB3.

Edit: The situation of people who just missed out on EAD with May 2010+ PDs is even worse. They had to wait many years to even apply for EADs. EADs have become the new GCs.

[donkeykong]

Hear you. I have at least 2 from same company who got GCs in 2012 (EB2I 2009 PDs) and became Citizens couple of years ago. The movement from COVID spillover is a golden chance. Sadly people who miss out on GCs might have to face what you and other 2012 EAD folks are going through. A few months may matter a lot for some unfortunate folks. That's why I am advising everyone to keep one feet on EB2 and other on EB3.

Edit: The situation of people who just missed out on EAD with May 2010+ PDs is even worse. They had to wait many years to even apply for EADs. EADs have become the new GCs.

Couldn't agree more, Mine is June 2010 EB2. Not to mention the 2015 fiasco. I was pretty skeptical this time after multiple burns but actually got EAD.

[rocketfast]

The infuriating part is that USCIS has been moving EB1-I dates over the last 4 months, but there are no applications in EB1-I queue who are eligible as most of the moved dates are applying after October, so they are all still waiting for biometrics etc. Whereas EB2-I is stuck and that is the only place where there is readily available applications in queue.

Only 0.3% of EB1-I that applied after October have gotten GC yet.

[Zenzone]

Hear you. I have at least 2 from same company who got GCs in 2012 (EB2I 2009 PDs) and became Citizens couple of years ago. The movement from COVID spillover is a golden chance. Sadly people who miss out on GCs might have to face what you and other 2012 EAD folks are going through. A few months may matter a lot for some unfortunate folks. That's why I am advising everyone to keep one feet on EB2 and other on EB3.

Edit: The situation of people who just missed out on EAD with May 2010+ PDs is even worse. They had to wait many years to even apply for EADs. EADs have become the new GCs.

The glimmer of additional hope is that we are likely to have FB SO again in 2022 FY. So some ppl. who miss out closely this time may get another stab next year. Who knows..the country caps may be removed by then. I'm an eternal optimist :)

[LeoAugust]

With only 140,000 GC for entire category for the last 30 years, this problem is going to be extrapolated in the coming years. The recession of 2009-11 camouflaged the issue for some time, just like Covid pandemic from 2020 - 21,22. All these extra numbers is going to help max of people till the end of 2012.

So in the year 2027 you will have a Dec 2012 applicant as a citizen and a Jan 2014 applicant still on H1 if the demand is high for next 5 years after 2022.

EB green card numbers has to be raised to 250,000 and all the people with approved 140s given a one time GC to the tune of 1 million.

What is your opinion about Dec-2013 please? Where do you see they stand and benefit from the current spillover.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

What is your opinion about Dec-2013 please? Where do you see they stand and benefit from the current spillover.

Without pending inventory, it's going to be very difficult to estimate especially now that thousands have downgraded in the last few months. If someone wants to do something as far as imploring the admin is concerned, releasing the pending inventory would bring about much needed transparency and visibility into the case pipeline.

[AceMan]

What is your opinion about Dec-2013 please? Where do you see they stand and benefit from the current spillover.

You have 4 full years of data before it reaches 2013. Let me start with my outlook for FY 2021. EB2 I am hoping to move 3-4 months from April 2021 to July 2021. It has a good solid chance of reaching May 2011 by September 21. Eb3 I is hampered a little by residual Eb3 ROW demand which was backlogged last year around same time. But the low numbers in Eb3 I should give it one year movement to May 2011 in the July 21 bulletin. Any forward movement beyond that is unlikely because of downgraders.

With the visa issuance still restricted at foreign posts the chance of Family spilling over more than 150,000-175,000 to EB in 2022 is another windfall possibility. December 2013 filer should look for in October 21 bulletin for any advancement in FD for Eb2 and Eb3 then. If the pandemic situation is similar Eb2I is poised to do the movements done by Eb1 this fiscal year.

At that point these aayarams and gayarams who downgraded already will be requesting options on how to upgrade.

[usvisas]

Anyone knows why biometrics notices have been non-existent since Jan 1st 2021? There were just a few sent with ND of 1/23 - that is the best I have heard.

Is this expected to get better? If not, then, at this speed - not sure how much spillovers would actually be greened or wasted!!!

[H1b2006]

2011 May is definite for both EB2+EB3
2011 Dec will clear with 2021 FY SO and 2022 FY SO

2012 might have a chance but not sure for how far into 2012 with FY 2022 SO

Thats it, part of 2012 onwards it is another 10yrs wait

EB1 spillover is unlikely for 2023 FY as WITCH companies start clogging it again in a year or two.

[H1b2006]

2010,2011, part of 2012 are clearing bcause of Covid SO in FY 2021/FY2022
without it will take 10 yrs for 2010,10yrs for 2011 to clear, so on..

[vsivarama]

At that point these aayarams and gayarams who downgraded already will be requesting options on how to upgrade.

Thanks for the condescension. I gather you do NOT want people downgrading to EB3. Everyone will do what's best for them and your seething attitude is not going to stop them. I was EB2-I who downgraded in October and I have a leg to stand on here. I always welcomed upgrades from EB3 to EB2 (even to my detriment) as they freaking applied before me. EB1, EB2 or EB3 all are one and same for the most part. Not a lot of rocket scientists here... It's time we stopped treating our fellow brethren as our enemies.

[AceMan]

Thanks for the condescension. I gather you do NOT want people downgrading to EB3. Everyone will do what's best for them and your seething attitude is not going to stop them. I was EB2-I who downgraded in October and I have a leg to stand on here. I always welcomed upgrades from EB3 to EB2 (even to my detriment) as they freaking applied before me. EB1, EB2 or EB3 all are one and same for the most part. Not a lot of rocket scientists here... It's time we stopped treating our fellow brethren as our enemies.

I predicted that if we get 150,000-175,000 spill over for 2022 Eb2I will be biggest beneficiary if pandemic related restrictions are still present and how it can impact a December 2013 filer and how the thread questions will be after the October 2021.

Just because you welcome other people to do something crazy does not mean that I should agree to that.

[EB2IndSep09]

Anyone knows why biometrics notices have been non-existent since Jan 1st 2021? There were just a few sent with ND of 1/23 - that is the best I have heard.

Is this expected to get better? If not, then, at this speed - not sure how much spillovers would actually be greened or wasted!!!

I am yet to receive the receipt number for AOS filings done from last week of Oct 2020 along with hundreds and hundreds of my colleagues. People are breaking their heads figuring when they would receive receipt numbers.
My law firm response is "As of last week, USCIS estimates there are still 415,000 cases which have not yet been receipted at the Dallas Lockbox center".

Good luck figuring why biometric appointments are not generated and when these hundreds of thousands of people are going to be greened :D

[usvisas]

Good luck figuring why biometric appointments are not generated and when these hundreds of thousands of people are going to be greened :D

Yea, thats my point too. Though note that those 400K needs to be divided by 3 or something as they include different forms (I-485, I-765, I-131) for the same individual. Still massive, but I guess we'll know accurate number in a month or so.

[redtogreen]

Hi all, did anyone from TSC with PDs in 2010 receive RFE? I am only reading about folks from NSC on Trackitt. I haven't received a single RFE till date. Is this the case with others from TSC who filed in 2012? I am concerned that some of our files are just packed up somewhere in the dust.

[phkb2020]

Hi all, did anyone from TSC with PDs in 2010 receive RFE? I am only reading about folks from NSC on Trackitt. I haven't received a single RFE till date. Is this the case with others from TSC who filed in 2012? I am concerned that some of our files are just packed up somewhere in the dust.

Feb 2010 priority date application with TSC. No RFEs since our 2012 application. I changed jobs in 2012 (after 180 day mark) and filed AC21 notification. Supp J was not a thing at that time. I keep thinking whether I should just file Supp J now (without waiting for RFE) just to bump the file.

[bones20]

Hi Guys - I have an AC21 related question:
- Lets say your i485 has been pending (waiting for FAD to be current) for more than 180 days in eb2 category and your PD becomes current in FAD chart in eb3 category. At that time, the employer can file a downgrade to eb3 by filing a new i140 with eb2 PERM. Can you change job right away after filing the downgrade and do ac21 porting with new employer in eb3 category or do you need to wait for eb3 i140 to be approved? (The reason to do this is to avoid the wait with previous employer for i140 approval, GC approval, post GC stay)

thank you!

[old_monk]

Hi Guys - I have an AC21 related question:
- Lets say your i485 has been pending (waiting for FAD to be current) for more than 180 days in eb2 category and your PD becomes current in FAD chart in eb3 category. At that time, the employer can file a downgrade to eb3 by filing a new i140 with eb2 PERM. Can you change job right away after filing the downgrade and do ac21 porting with new employer in eb3 category or do you need to wait for eb3 i140 to be approved? (The reason to do this is to avoid the wait with previous employer for i140 approval, GC approval, post GC stay)

thank you!

I think you need to wait for new I140 to get approved. If your 140 is not approved, your eb3 485 petition will not be valid. You can do premium processing though(not sure how premium processing works in these cases though).
Gurus, in this case, will the wait period of 180 day be applicable to eb3 petition as well i.e. stay with current employer for 180 days after EB3 I140/ 485 is filed concurrently. I am asking this as I am also planning to follow the same steps as bones20 .

[bones20]

I think you need to wait for new I140 to get approved. If your 140 is not approved, your eb3 485 petition will not be valid. You can do premium processing though(not sure how premium processing works in these cases though).
Gurus, in this case, will the wait period of 180 day be applicable to eb3 petition as well i.e. stay with current employer for 180 days after EB3 I140/ 485 is filed concurrently. I am asking this as I am also planning to follow the same steps as bones20 .

- Premium for i140 can only be filed first time when you have a physical copy of PERM approval. It seems though you can request premium after receiving the receipt:
https://www.kamalalaw.com/process-to-downgrade-from-eb-2-to-eb-3.html#eb2-to-eb3-downgrade-premium
- My use case is that the eb2 i485 has already been filed. My understanding is that for the downgrade, the only thing that needs to be filed is a new i140 for eb3 (no new/additional i485). Ref:
https://www.kamalalaw.com/process-to-downgrade-from-eb-2-to-eb-3.html#eb2-to-eb3-downgrade-with-485-pending

A new approved I-140 under EB-3 category will be transferred to the service center where I-485 is currently pending and no new fee is required.

[sjayanthi]

Hi All, excited to see predictions for EB2 2011 cases by end of FY2021. I have a tricky question: I am currently outside USA on a international assignment with the same employer (I have approved I140 with this employer). My original PD is April 2011. Now as I plan to return to US later in the year, I have two options 1) to move to location B (where I plan to settle down) and use EB1 ; 2) potentially go to location A where my PERM and I 140 were filed and use EB2. Considering I need a new H1B to come to US (which will be filed in next few weeks) and any change in location will trigger a amendment, was wondering if someone can guide me on which location to chose from. Additionally, EB1 C I 140 timelines are all over the place (6 months to a year and there is no AC21 without I 140 approval) so if EB2 becomes current I would prefer to use it (saves everyone some filing fees). Is it possible for my employer to file for I 485 even if I work from location B? I can work from location A as well once I get my EAD but want to avoid amendements.

[tenyearsgone]

Thanks for the condescension. I gather you do NOT want people downgrading to EB3. Everyone will do what's best for them and your seething attitude is not going to stop them. I was EB2-I who downgraded in October and I have a leg to stand on here. I always welcomed upgrades from EB3 to EB2 (even to my detriment) as they freaking applied before me. EB1, EB2 or EB3 all are one and same for the most part. Not a lot of rocket scientists here... It's time we stopped treating our fellow brethren as our enemies.

Agreed. Do what's in your best interest and react to data as it becomes available. Everyone's situation is different and there's no need to judge them. Downgrade/Upgrade - do it when it is feasible and don't hold your career back for GC.
As someone else pointed out, a few months of difference in 2009 PDs has been life changing for folks on either side of Apr 2009. Same goes for Apr 2010. After 10-20 years of wait even a few months extra can be really painful to some folks due to the stress built up over time while other folks are able to deal with it better.

[old_monk]

- Premium for i140 can only be filed first time when you have a physical copy of PERM approval. It seems though you can request premium after receiving the receipt:
https://www.kamalalaw.com/process-to-downgrade-from-eb-2-to-eb-3.html#eb2-to-eb3-downgrade-premium
- My use case is that the eb2 i485 has already been filed. My understanding is that for the downgrade, the only thing that needs to be filed is a new i140 for eb3 (no new/additional i485). Ref:
https://www.kamalalaw.com/process-to-downgrade-from-eb-2-to-eb-3.html#eb2-to-eb3-downgrade-with-485-pending

Thanks, wasn't aware of these. I am in the same situation as you. Lets see what the future holds.

[bluelabel]

I got an RFE on my I-485 and they asked the following -

1. Please submit an updated form G-325A.
2. Please submit an evidence of employment authorization since Jan of 2019. (Maybe because I had already submitted EADs till 2018 during 2018 RFE response)
3. Supplement J
4. Please submit a copy of the biographic page of your currently valid passport which clearly shows your photo and name.
5. I-693 medical report.

I only found deferred action G325A in USCIS website. Is there any other G325A available? I also see that it's no longer required for I-485 but not sure why USCIS is asking for it.

[idliman]

I got an RFE on my I-485 and they asked the following -

1. Please submit an updated form G-325A.
2. Please submit an evidence of employment authorization since Jan of 2019. (Maybe because I had already submitted EADs till 2018 during 2018 RFE response)
3. Supplement J
4. Please submit a copy of the biographic page of your currently valid passport which clearly shows your photo and name.
5. I-693 medical report.

I only found deferred action G325A in USCIS website. Is there any other G325A available? I also see that it's no longer required for I-485 but not sure why USCIS is asking for it.
Congratulations on RFE. Are you in TSC or NSC? PD?

You are correct. There is only one G-325A form (https://www.uscis.gov/g-325a). Aliens used to file G-325A and citizens used to file G-325 (for finance GC). In the last iteration USCIS merged I-485 and G-325A together into one form. However, older applicants are required to update G-325A every few years. So it is a harmless RFE. But make sure that you complete every field including the last residence outside of USA.

[bluelabel]

Thanks for the reply. It's NSC and my PD is 03/02/2010.

[jackryan041815]

Hi all,

I am new to this forum, migrated here to give it a try from Trackitt. Was wondering what your predictions are for the end of this fiscal year. My priority date is EB-3 India April 2011

[inspired_p]

Thanks for the condescension. I gather you do NOT want people downgrading to EB3. Everyone will do what's best for them and your seething attitude is not going to stop them. I was EB2-I who downgraded in October and I have a leg to stand on here. I always welcomed upgrades from EB3 to EB2 (even to my detriment) as they freaking applied before me. EB1, EB2 or EB3 all are one and same for the most part. Not a lot of rocket scientists here... It's time we stopped treating our fellow brethren as our enemies.

I agree completely. I have ranted on this topic before as well, but companies have been known to file the application in EB3 even when the job and the candidate were eligible for EB2, solely stating that its company policy to do so and no-one raised any eyebrows to that practice. Anyways the PERM is what validates the job, I-140 is just a formality. PERM with job qualified for EB1,the I-140 can be applied in any of the three categories.

I have not downgraded my petition, but when i changed employers I had the option of EB2 or EB3 ( PERM job qualified for EB2), and I chose EB3, employer lawyers gave me that choice. I see nothing wrong in this and if required I don't see anything wrong if I have to upgrade my petition if my calculations are proven wrong.

Vilifying downgrades from EB2 is as obnoxious as vilifying EB3 -> EB2 upgrades

[inspired_p]

I got an RFE on my I-485 and they asked the following -

1. Please submit an updated form G-325A.
2. Please submit an evidence of employment authorization since Jan of 2019. (Maybe because I had already submitted EADs till 2018 during 2018 RFE response)
3. Supplement J
4. Please submit a copy of the biographic page of your currently valid passport which clearly shows your photo and name.
5. I-693 medical report.

I only found deferred action G325A in USCIS website. Is there any other G325A available? I also see that it's no longer required for I-485 but not sure why USCIS is asking for it.

Congratulations ! Thats a good positive sign for EB2-I given that your PD is in 03/2010.

[RVSree]

My Background
PD: Apr 2011 in EB2, 15+ years of H1B life
Status: Filed for AOS, EAD, AP in Oct-2020 and rec'd receipt# by Nov-2020, currently waiting for Biometrics appointment notice
H4 Child: My son is in college (freshmen)

I have a question, need some consultation:
Assuming USCIS utilize available SO for FY-2021, we will get our GC this year. If not, then I have to downgrade to EB-3 in order to avoid my son's potential age-out issue (2.5 years left). Since my employer is not supporting downgrade, I am exploring options to change job after 180 days. Wondering whether my new employer can file I-140 in EB-3 directly, i.e. without filing a new PERM based on AC-21 rule.

[AceMan]

I agree completely. I have ranted on this topic before as well, but companies have been known to file the application in EB3 even when the job and the candidate were eligible for EB2, solely stating that its company policy to do so and no-one raised any eyebrows to that practice. Anyways the PERM is what validates the job, I-140 is just a formality. PERM with job qualified for EB1,the I-140 can be applied in any of the three categories.

I have not downgraded my petition, but when i changed employers I had the option of EB2 or EB3 ( PERM job qualified for EB2), and I chose EB3, employer lawyers gave me that choice. I see nothing wrong in this and if required I don't see anything wrong if I have to upgrade my petition if my calculations are proven wrong.

Vilifying downgrades from EB2 is as obnoxious as vilifying EB3 -> EB2 upgrades

Few missing points in your post. 140 is not a formality. There is no Perm for Eb1. Employment based category means employer has the full authority to decide what category you belong to based on the job you are performing and not necessarily your qualifications.

In a normal scenario downgrades should not happen. It is happening because the people who did Eb2 originally did not qualify for it and now running and applying in regular category when originally they claimed to be exceptional Perm and the skills not available in US.

Eb3-2 upgrade applies with a new perm, Eb2-3 uses the old perm which has excluded people who could not match the exceptional skill requirement. Now when applying for Eb3 the rules are happily ignored to the extend that person who points these are obnoxious and condescending.

What you did is nothing wrong, you had an underlying perm for your Eb3.

So people instead of trying to find fault in my line of thinking, realize the pandemic induced embassy closures might result in 150,000-175,000 visas to Eb category in 2022 from October 21. Once Eb1 is current the biggest beneficiary is going to be Eb2I.

[android09]

Few missing points in your post. 140 is not a formality. There is no Perm for Eb1. Employment based category means employer has the full authority to decide what category you belong to based on the job you are performing and not necessarily your qualifications.

In a normal scenario downgrades should not happen. It is happening because the people who did Eb2 originally did not qualify for it and now running and applying in regular category when originally they claimed to be exceptional Perm and the skills not available in US.

Eb3-2 upgrade applies with a new perm, Eb2-3 uses the old perm which has excluded people who could not match the exceptional skill requirement. Now when applying for Eb3 the rules are happily ignored to the extend that person who points these are obnoxious and condescending.

What you did is nothing wrong, you had an underlying perm for your Eb3.

So people instead of trying to find fault in my line of thinking, realize the pandemic induced embassy closures might result in 150,000-175,000 visas to Eb category in 2022 from October 21. Once Eb1 is current the biggest beneficiary is going to be Eb2I.

The last paragraph of your post is most interesting. While there may be spill over of about 150,000 - 175,000 visas to the EB category from the Family Based category, why do we assume that these will be issued? It is correct insofar that it may push the dates ahead due to statutory requirements, but what that additional flow means remains to be seen in outcomes. We already know the USCIS struggles to issue 140,000 regular EB based visas with many being wasted every year due to systemic inefficiencies and process factors that run the clock out. Now we're saying, yeah sure let's add another 150,000 visas to your pile to do what you already do not do.

[RVSree]

My Background
PD: Apr 2011 in EB2, 15+ years of H1B life
Status: Filed for AOS, EAD, AP in Oct-2020 and rec'd receipt# by Nov-2020, currently waiting for Biometrics appointment notice
H4 Child: My son is in college (freshmen)

I have a question, need some consultation:
Assuming USCIS utilize available SO for FY-2021, we will get our GC this year. If not, then I have to downgrade to EB-3 in order to avoid my son's potential age-out issue (2.5 years left). Since my employer is not supporting downgrade, I am exploring options to change job after 180 days. Wondering whether my new employer can file I-140 in EB-3 directly, i.e. without filing a new PERM based on AC-21 rule.

[Mgajsk]

The last paragraph of your post is most interesting. While there may be spill over of about 150,000 - 175,000 visas to the EB category from the Family Based category, why do we assume that these will be issued? It is correct insofar that it may push the dates ahead due to statutory requirements, but what that additional flow means remains to be seen in outcomes. We already know the USCIS struggles to issue 140,000 regular EB based visas with many being wasted every year due to systemic inefficiencies and process factors that run the clock out. Now we're saying, yeah sure let's add another 150,000 visas to your pile and what you already do not do.

Should'nt we consider the possiblity that USCIS is processing way less FB cases compared to a non Pandemic year and that might give them enough time to process all 150K visas?

[tenyearsgone]

It is happening because the people who did Eb2 originally did not qualify for it and now running and applying in regular category when originally they claimed to be exceptional Perm and the skills not available in US.

Eb3-2 upgrade applies with a new perm, Eb2-3 uses the old perm which has excluded people who could not match the exceptional skill requirement. Now when applying for Eb3 the rules are happily ignored to the extend that person who points these are obnoxious and condescending.



Ace .. your insinuation above that EB2 applicants were not qualified and cheated on it because they want to downgrade now is obnoxious and condescending.

[qesehmk]

Guys if I may say something - people don't always mean what you and I interpret it to be. Our blog's philosophy is to treat all other immigrant groups with respect and never criticize any other immigrant group.

Just follow this yourself and forgive others if somebody says something - it could very well be unintentional.

[vsivarama]

In a normal scenario downgrades should not happen. It is happening because the people who did Eb2 originally did not qualify for it and now running and applying in regular category when originally they claimed to be exceptional Perm and the skills not available in US.

Eb3-2 upgrade applies with a new perm, Eb2-3 uses the old perm which has excluded people who could not match the exceptional skill requirement. Now when applying for Eb3 the rules are happily ignored to the extend that person who points these are obnoxious and condescending.

So people instead of trying to find fault in my line of thinking, realize the pandemic induced embassy closures might result in 150,000-175,000 visas to EB category in 2022 from October 21. Once Eb1 is current the biggest beneficiary is going to be Eb2I.

The USCIS does not break this into rigid categories as you put it. From the USCIS standpoint it is like the following, If a person has demonstrated beyond shadow of doubt that he can compete and perform in 10K competitions (EB2 in this case), it is ridiculous on their part to ask these folks to prove that they have the stamina to compete in 5K competitions (EB3 in this case as it's usually a subset of eb2 requirements). So you can use the same perm to downgrade. Just because someone has participated in 5K competitions does NOT mean that their initial claim of being able to complete in 10K meets are now fraudulent.

I agree that EB2I may benefit from future spillovers if EB1 is current. But for most of the people, a bird in hand is better than two in the bush. Are you willing to let go of the ability to file 485 in hopes of a potential windfall in the future for EB2?

[inspired_p]

Few missing points in your post. 140 is not a formality. There is no Perm for Eb1. Employment based category means employer has the full authority to decide what category you belong to based on the job you are performing and not necessarily your qualifications.

In a normal scenario downgrades should not happen. It is happening because the people who did Eb2 originally did not qualify for it and now running and applying in regular category when originally they claimed to be exceptional Perm and the skills not available in US.

Eb3-2 upgrade applies with a new perm, Eb2-3 uses the old perm which has excluded people who could not match the exceptional skill requirement. Now when applying for Eb3 the rules are happily ignored to the extend that person who points these are obnoxious and condescending.

What you did is nothing wrong, you had an underlying perm for your Eb3.

So people instead of trying to find fault in my line of thinking, realize the pandemic induced embassy closures might result in 150,000-175,000 visas to Eb category in 2022 from October 21. Once Eb1 is current the biggest beneficiary is going to be Eb2I.
When i say I-140 is formality I meant this .... Job validation done at the time of PERM. and it qualifies for say EB2 category ( till now I thought PERM waiver was only for National interest waiver EB1s basically self petition and companies had to file PERM for EB1 applications as well) .I-140 can be filed at any category at or below the bar.

Companies have done so repeatedly under "Company policy".
No Rules are ignored when person files for EB3 based on the PERM that was used for EB2 approval.
As you rightly said EB3->EB2 upgrade will require another PERM ONLY IF the initial PERM was specific to EB3 job. In my case in point, I have confirmed that the PERM filed for me qualifies for EB2, so I will not need a new PERM for EB2 upgrade either.

Expecting people to stay in the buckets when there are no such buckets in law/rule is what I am trying point out here.

[idliman]

Feb 2010 priority date application with TSC. No RFEs since our 2012 application. I changed jobs in 2012 (after 180 day mark) and filed AC21 notification. Supp J was not a thing at that time. I keep thinking whether I should just file Supp J now (without waiting for RFE) just to bump the file.
If you submit a Supp J right now, you will get a RFE in 2-3 months time. That will be the usual one for G-325A, I-693 and maybe employment authorization if you had used EAD. Once you complete that process, your file should be current ready for approval for a period of 2 years from I-693 signature date. We cannot predict what's going to happen in the future: Say JB admin cancels requirement of I-693 for every 2 years OR the processing delays due to rush of new I485 applications. However your thinking is not bad.

[inspired_p]

The USCIS does not break this into rigid categories as you put it. From the USCIS standpoint it is like the following, If a person has demonstrated beyond shadow of doubt that he can compete and perform in 10K competitions (EB2 in this case), it is ridiculous on their part to ask these folks to prove that they have the stamina to compete in 5K competitions (EB3 in this case as it's usually a subset of eb2 requirements). So you can use the same perm to downgrade. Just because someone has participated in 5K competitions does NOT mean that their initial claim of being able to complete in 10K meets are now fraudulent.

I agree that EB2I may benefit from future spillovers if EB1 is current. But for most of the people, a bird in hand is better than two in the bush. Are you willing to let go of the ability to file 485 in hopes of a potential windfall in the future for EB2?

Also the 10K and 5K category is tied to the PERM filed and not the I140 filed.

[vsivarama]

Also the 10K and 5K category is tied to the PERM filed and not the I140 filed.

I stand corrected, Thanks for pointing that one out.

[idliman]

Hi all,

I am new to this forum, migrated here to give it a try from Trackitt. Was wondering what your predictions are for the end of this fiscal year. My priority date is EB-3 India April 2011
Welcome. The fact that USCIS opened up the DF till 2015 shows that they originally expected everyone upto that date to be current before Oct 2021. However, how they are going to do it is not sure. Past trends indicate they will start advancing dates from say May 2021 bulletin or so. How many GCs could they process in 5 months? Do they give up (like the past admin) and refuse to move the dates citing lack of capacity for processing and issuing GCs? No one knows. There are a bunch of folks who filed in 2012 waiting for the PDs to clear 2009 for the past 9 years. All we can wish for is USCIS using and issuing as much GCs as permitted by law. So lately the prediction part of this forum is quiet because the past admin found thousand excuses to systematically delay and deny issuing of GCs.

You can also try whereismygc.com to see how their model is working for your PD. Prediction math is a number game. However, it all depends on the intent of the admin and the agencies to provide immigration benefits to as many people as allowed by law.

[inspired_p]

So people instead of trying to find fault in my line of thinking, realize the pandemic induced embassy closures might result in 150,000-175,000 visas to Eb category in 2022 from October 21. Once Eb1 is current the biggest beneficiary is going to be Eb2I.

This can very well be the case.
EB2-I can very well shoot past EB3-I in FADs , and hence I personally will be keeping an eye out on FADs and will exercise the right to file a separate EB2 with the existing PERM if absolutely required.

People who downgraded to EB3 from EB2 anyways have both Eb2 and EB3 applications to choose from, if EB2 FAD are favorable than EB3 FAD.

And all power to them.

[AceMan]

Ace .. your insinuation above that EB2 applicants were not qualified and cheated on it because they want to downgrade now is obnoxious and condescending.

If the highlighted text is what you felt most related from what I posted, I can't help it.

[AceMan]

When i say I-140 is formality I meant this .... Job validation done at the time of PERM. and it qualifies for say EB2 category ( till now I thought PERM waiver was only for National interest waiver EB1s basically self petition and companies had to file PERM for EB1 applications as well) .I-140 can be filed at any category at or below the bar.

Companies have done so repeatedly under "Company policy".
No Rules are ignored when person files for EB3 based on the PERM that was used for EB2 approval.
As you rightly said EB3->EB2 upgrade will require another PERM ONLY IF the initial PERM was specific to EB3 job. In my case in point, I have confirmed that the PERM filed for me qualifies for EB2, so I will not need a new PERM for EB2 upgrade either.

Expecting people to stay in the buckets when there are no such buckets in law/rule is what I am trying point out here.

I think you are still not fully understanding what I said. People are upgrading and downgrading. If you look at October 2018 filers, almost all the people who downgraded are Eb2 filers who upgraded from Eb3 after 2012. IF they had upgraded before 2011 they would have been able to adjust the status in 2012 itself. For the people who are comparing the perms to 10K and 5K analogy, I have better one. You are paying for 2 buffets and 1 set of buffet is getting wasted. You are using up a valuable resource, when you can do without it. It is not just the rules I am talking about. Once you downgrade you try and apply for premium when it is explicitly not allowed. Now some lawyers found the loop hole and figured out if it goes to the same service center they might accept it. This made sure that all the people started applying for premium and use up the resources when they should not be.

Eb2-3 downgrade is not against the rule, it is the follow up actions.

And the same person is magically going to try and qualify back in EB2 when that dates move forward. I absolutely respect these people for their tenacity. But that does not change the fact that they are aayarams and gayarams.

[AceMan]

The USCIS does not break this into rigid categories as you put it. From the USCIS standpoint it is like the following, If a person has demonstrated beyond shadow of doubt that he can compete and perform in 10K competitions (EB2 in this case), it is ridiculous on their part to ask these folks to prove that they have the stamina to compete in 5K competitions (EB3 in this case as it's usually a subset of eb2 requirements). So you can use the same perm to downgrade. Just because someone has participated in 5K competitions does NOT mean that their initial claim of being able to complete in 10K meets are now fraudulent.

I agree that EB2I may benefit from future spillovers if EB1 is current. But for most of the people, a bird in hand is better than two in the bush. Are you willing to let go of the ability to file 485 in hopes of a potential windfall in the future for EB2?

If you think Eb3 is a subset of EB2 why do they even keep it separate? I understand that you want getting into 485 queue and having an EAD and using AP is much better than being on H1. I respect that it is a common sense thing to do. Most probably you think I would have also done it. However if the scenario for new round of spill over happens from family and Eb2 I is the beneficiary can you honestly say that you will stay back in EB3 or will you try and attempt to get to Eb2 (with the same bird story!!!)

If you did not do it, I can assure you 95% of the people who downgraded are going to try that. You will still ask what is the problem with that? I would still say those guys are using up the USCIS resources for stuff which should not have been wasted if they had stayed put in the first place.

[AceMan]

People who downgraded to EB3 from EB2 anyways have both Eb2 and EB3 applications to choose from, if EB2 FAD are favorable than EB3 FAD.

And all power to them.

Are you sure with that? May be you want to check the difference between an amended and a new petition.

[texas_]

If you think Eb3 is a subset of EB2 why do they even keep it separate? I understand that you want getting into 485 queue and having an EAD and using AP is much better than being on H1. I respect that it is a common sense thing to do. Most probably you think I would have also done it. However if the scenario for new round of spill over happens from family and Eb2 I is the beneficiary can you honestly say that you will stay back in EB3 or will you try and attempt to get to Eb2 (with the same bird story!!!)

If you did not do it, I can assure you 95% of the people who downgraded are going to try that. You will still ask what is the problem with that? I would still say those guys are using up the USCIS resources for stuff which should not have been wasted if they had stayed put in the first place.

If this situation comes I would keep both the birds in hand and leave none in bush!! Keepin' all my birds in a row... :)

[phkb2020]

Just out of curiosity, how many of Eb2I 2012 filers with priority dates between July 09 and May 2010 downgraded to EB3 when EB3 FAD dates moved past EB2?
I for one have stayed put. Folks in my friend circle have stayed put. Any folks in the forum who have downgraded?

[alpha0]

The USCIS does not break this into rigid categories as you put it. From the USCIS standpoint it is like the following, If a person has demonstrated beyond shadow of doubt that he can compete and perform in 10K competitions (EB2 in this case), it is ridiculous on their part to ask these folks to prove that they have the stamina to compete in 5K competitions (EB3 in this case as it's usually a subset of eb2 requirements). So you can use the same perm to downgrade. Just because someone has participated in 5K competitions does NOT mean that their initial claim of being able to complete in 10K meets are now fraudulent.

I agree that EB2I may benefit from future spillovers if EB1 is current. But for most of the people, a bird in hand is better than two in the bush. Are you willing to let go of the ability to file 485 in hopes of a potential windfall in the future for EB2?

During PERM process, you eliminated all americans who could do 5k saying that this job needs 10k and got labor cert for this immigrant, and now you are saying that this job infact only needs to run 5k, entire labor cert is invalid if you see this way.

[AceMan]

If this situation comes I would keep both the birds in hand and leave none in bush!! Keepin' all my birds in a row... :)

And the bird we are talking about is a GC. Do you need 2 or 3 GC?s for yourself?

[incredible]

Hi All

I have received an RFE for I485 of both mine and spouse's. The actual document has not yet arrived, so I do not know what the RFE is for. I am expecting it to be a regular RFE for medicals, G325 and/or Supplement J. Though, i am not sure why USCIS will request for supplement J. I have changed jobs in Feb of 2020 and submitted supplement - J as part of it and it is not yet approved from USCIS. Also, like most of the folks I did receive RFE for Supplement J, medicals back in 2018 and have submitted at that time. Also, the supplement J submitted back in 2018 was approved in six months. Just for your information I have filed 485 back in 2012 with NSC and priority date of EB2 02/01/2010.

[incredible]

Hi All

I have received an RFE for I485 of both mine and spouse's. The actual document has not yet arrived, so I do not know what the RFE is for. I am expecting it to be a regular RFE for medicals, G325 and/or Supplement J. Though, i am not sure why USCIS will request for supplement J. I have changed jobs in Feb of 2020 and submitted supplement - J as part of it and it is not yet approved from USCIS. Also, like most of the folks I did receive RFE for Supplement J, medicals back in 2018 and have submitted at that time. Also, the supplement J submitted back in 2018 was approved in six months. Just for your information I have filed 485 back in 2012 with NSC and priority date of EB2 02/01/2010.

Also, I have a quick question and need guidance from seasoned folks here. I am in discussion with one of the top 4 consulting firms and my offer may be finalized in the next 2 to 3 weeks. With this RFE and if it asks for Supplement J, should I submit everything now and wait for GC before moving on to the large company (not necessarily sure, if they would wait though). Or should I ask the new company to speed up the process and provide me the supplement J and then file response to the RFE?? Any suggestions are appreciated.

[idliman]

Hi All

I have received an RFE for I485 of both mine and spouse's. The actual document has not yet arrived, so I do not know what the RFE is for. I am expecting it to be a regular RFE for medicals, G325 and/or Supplement J. Though, i am not sure why USCIS will request for supplement J. I have changed jobs in Feb of 2020 and submitted supplement - J as part of it and it is not yet approved from USCIS. Also, like most of the folks I did receive RFE for Supplement J, medicals back in 2018 and have submitted at that time. Also, the supplement J submitted back in 2018 was approved in six months. Just for your information I have filed 485 back in 2012 with NSC and priority date of EB2 02/01/2010.
It is NSC and you have expired medicals that were submitted in 2018. It may be that NSC is doing another round of RFEs for folks till May 2010 to keep their files updated and ready to be approved. So may be it is just for I-693 only or they used a standard template and asked for usual things. Just wait.


Also, I have a quick question and need guidance from seasoned folks here. I am in discussion with one of the top 4 consulting firms and my offer may be finalized in the next 2 to 3 weeks. With this RFE and if it asks for Supplement J, should I submit everything now and wait for GC before moving on to the large company (not necessarily sure, if they would wait though). Or should I ask the new company to speed up the process and provide me the supplement J and then file response to the RFE?? Any suggestions are appreciated.
It all depends on the deadline for RFE. Can you get a new offer and at the same time meet the RFE deadline? If you do a I485J with the new company then there is no need for you to do another I485J. However, I am suspecting that once your file is complete after replying to RFE from the present company, I don't think the AO will look for anything more. He/she will approve and go. Anyway no matter what meet the RFE deadline (otherwise your I485 is abandoned). I prefer to go with new I485J. But it does not matter a lot. You can always request them to send another I485J after joining the new company. Wait for replies from others who might have done similar thing and then decide.

[AceMan]

During PERM process, you eliminated all americans who could do 5k saying that this job needs 10k and got labor cert for this immigrant, and now you are saying that this job infact only needs to run 5k, entire labor cert is invalid if you see this way.

On point without any ambiguity.

[incredible]

It is NSC and you have expired medicals that were submitted in 2018. It may be that NSC is doing another round of RFEs for folks till May 2010 to keep their files updated and ready to be approved. So may be it is just for I-693 only or they used a standard template and asked for usual things. Just wait.


It all depends on the deadline for RFE. Can you get a new offer and at the same time meet the RFE deadline? If you do a I485J with the new company then there is no need for you to do another I485J. However, I am suspecting that once your file is complete after replying to RFE from the present company, I don't think the AO will look for anything more. He/she will approve and go. Anyway no matter what meet the RFE deadline (otherwise your I485 is abandoned). I prefer to go with new I485J. But it does not matter a lot. You can always request them to send another I485J after joining the new company. Wait for replies from others who might have done similar thing and then decide.

Thank you for your quick reply. It is strangely great feeling of relief mixed with anxiety. Great feeling for potentially getting greened in the coming months. Anxiety on new company discussions, etc. Anyways, I will wait and see what is in there and also wait for other experts comments.

[LeoAugust]

Are you sure with that? May be you want to check the difference between an amended and a new petition.

Downgrade Eb2 to EB3 as new application will keep the i140 of EB2 in tact. If EB2 moves fast they dont have to upgrade. They just have to use the i140 to files AOS again. This is my understanding.

[Transformer]

My Background
PD: Apr 2011 in EB2, 15+ years of H1B life
Status: Filed for AOS, EAD, AP in Oct-2020 and rec'd receipt# by Nov-2020, currently waiting for Biometrics appointment notice
H4 Child: My son is in college (freshmen)

I have a question, need some consultation:
Assuming USCIS utilize available SO for FY-2021, we will get our GC this year. If not, then I have to downgrade to EB-3 in order to avoid my son's potential age-out issue (2.5 years left). Since my employer is not supporting downgrade, I am exploring options to change job after 180 days. Wondering whether my new employer can file I-140 in EB-3 directly, i.e. without filing a new PERM based on AC-21 rule.

Unfortunately new employer can't file I-140 for PERM from a different employer. They have to start from PERM again. Try to negotiate with your current employer by explaining kids age out scenario.

[Transformer]

During PERM process, you eliminated all americans who could do 5k saying that this job needs 10k and got labor cert for this immigrant, and now you are saying that this job infact only needs to run 5k, entire labor cert is invalid if you see this way.

Agree with the logic but unfortunately EB immigration in this country has no logic, only LAW. If there is a logic then I don't believe people waiting in line for 10-15 years. I think everyone (from backlogged countries) trying their best to get the GC faster in what is allowed under the LAW. I don't blame the individual but the immigration system.

[idliman]

My Background
PD: Apr 2011 in EB2, 15+ years of H1B life
Status: Filed for AOS, EAD, AP in Oct-2020 and rec'd receipt# by Nov-2020, currently waiting for Biometrics appointment notice
H4 Child: My son is in college (freshmen)

I have a question, need some consultation:
Assuming USCIS utilize available SO for FY-2021, we will get our GC this year. If not, then I have to downgrade to EB-3 in order to avoid my son's potential age-out issue (2.5 years left). Since my employer is not supporting downgrade, I am exploring options to change job after 180 days. Wondering whether my new employer can file I-140 in EB-3 directly, i.e. without filing a new PERM based on AC-21 rule.
As per my understanding, if you are not with the same employer who originally filed PERM and I-140, you have to do a new PERM and I-140. I am sorry that you have to go through the kid age-out scenario.

The age-out stops only when the "FA" dates are current. Right now for your PD, only the "DF" is current. So your son still faces an age-out scenario when he is 21. I would suggest you to count 180 days, use AC21 and port to a new employer and file PERM/I-140 EB3 application immediately. PERM / I-140 if you speed through can be completed in one year time. The "FA" for your PD is most likely to be current in EB3 before EB2.

I know people are very optimistic about big movement of EB2 this year (including myself). But until that happens nothing is certain. You have a pressing deadline / age-out scenario. So take whatever steps you can to lock your son's age. So IMO you need to have applications in both EB2 & EB3. The waiting game from 2012 has given me the experience of doing whatever we can open multiple lanes for path to GC. If EB2 FA becomes current that will be great. However, we need to also prepare for the worst case. Good luck.

Edit: Forgot to mention that prepare for AC21. Get copies of approved PERM so that you can have a)SOC code, b) Job title and c)Job description. If employer is not sharing PERM, use FOIA to get older copies.

[AceMan]

Downgrade Eb2 to EB3 as new application will keep the i140 of EB2 in tact. If EB2 moves fast they dont have to upgrade. They just have to use the i140 to files AOS again. This is my understanding.

Let us take it step by step. The first line filing it as a new application will keep EB2 140 intact is a correct understanding.

However to my understanding the law firms are filing the EB3 140 as amended citing some Neumann memo which claims a new petition with an expired labor can be rejected.

So the people can confirm with their attorney's if their downgrade petition was new or amended.

[inspired_p]

During PERM process, you eliminated all americans who could do 5k saying that this job needs 10k and got labor cert for this immigrant, and now you are saying that this job infact only needs to run 5k, entire labor cert is invalid if you see this way.

Again , thats why i keep repeating the 10k and 5K differenciation is tied to the PERM and not i-140. Hence i-140 can be applied in lower category only. I-140 is not deciding which americans got overlooked ; PERM process is and thats still kosher

[AceMan]

Agree with the logic but unfortunately EB immigration in this country has no logic, only LAW. If there is a logic then I don't believe people waiting in line for 10-15 years. I think everyone (from backlogged countries) trying their best to get the GC faster in what is allowed under the LAW. I don't blame the individual but the immigration system.

No, you cannot have both ways. These are the people who having being fighting for fairness and when a chance comes they have no qualms to attempt to run in the middle of 2 lane road. This has to be pointed as a clear case of hypocrisy when the individual should not have been in Eb2 in the first place, now downgrading to Eb3 and when chance comes they want to run back to EB2 citing the law does not prevent them from doing it.

[EB2IndSep09]

My Background
PD: Apr 2011 in EB2, 15+ years of H1B life
Status: Filed for AOS, EAD, AP in Oct-2020 and rec'd receipt# by Nov-2020, currently waiting for Biometrics appointment notice
H4 Child: My son is in college (freshmen)

I have a question, need some consultation:
Assuming USCIS utilize available SO for FY-2021, we will get our GC this year. If not, then I have to downgrade to EB-3 in order to avoid my son's potential age-out issue (2.5 years left). Since my employer is not supporting downgrade, I am exploring options to change job after 180 days. Wondering whether my new employer can file I-140 in EB-3 directly, i.e. without filing a new PERM based on AC-21 rule.

Sorry to hear about your situation, there are thousands of families in the same situation unfortunately due to the obvious know reasons to all.
I believe your son's I485 petition also has been applied in Oct 2020.
Why do you think he is going to age out? As per CSPA Age calculation, your son's age at any point when the visa numbers are available is going to stay as 18.5 Years based on the AOS filing date.

https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-a-chapter-7 - Refer to "2. Child Status Protection Act Age Calculation" under "F. Family and Employment-Based Preference and Diversity Immigrants"

Only benefit you might have is to get the card earlier if EB3 moves faster than EB2 which no one can predict. Take an appropriate decision weighing all facts.

[inspired_p]

No, you cannot have both ways. These are the people who having being fighting for fairness and when a chance comes they have no qualms to attempt to run in the middle of 2 lane road. This has to be pointed as a clear case of hypocrisy when the individual should not have been in Eb2 in the first place, now downgrading to Eb3 and when chance comes they want to run back to EB2 citing the law does not prevent them from doing it.
I am done , keep judging people based on your biased misconceptions

[LeoAugust]

Let us take it step by step. The first line filing it as a new application will keep EB2 140 intact is a correct understanding.

However to my understanding the law firms are filing the EB3 140 as amended citing some Neumann memo which claims a new petition with an expired labor can be rejected.

So the people can confirm with their attorney's if their downgrade petition was new or amended.

If the they amend the existing i140 and it get rejected it will put the case in jeopardy. Hence most of the case instead of going for amend they go for new application. incase new one get rejected person can have their already approved i140 to use. He may not take advantage of AOs but he will be safe with i140 and continue with h1b. I am pretty clear and confirmed on this understanding.

[Transformer]

No, you cannot have both ways. These are the people who having being fighting for fairness and when a chance comes they have no qualms to attempt to run in the middle of 2 lane road. This has to be pointed as a clear case of hypocrisy when the individual should not have been in Eb2 in the first place, now downgrading to Eb3 and when chance comes they want to run back to EB2 citing the law does not prevent them from doing it.

You are entitled to your opinion and everyone to their own, lets respect each other. What ultimately matters is how USCIS perceives it. They are fine with it so far. I am not willing to continue further on this topic.

[vsivarama]

During PERM process, you eliminated all americans who could do 5k saying that this job needs 10k and got labor cert for this immigrant, and now you are saying that this job infact only needs to run 5k, entire labor cert is invalid if you see this way.

You are undercutting your own argument here. We are not filing a new perm here to say job responsibilities are in fact less. Just using the same perm to qualify in EB3. If you have 20 years of experience and want to apply for a mid-level developer position requiring 5 years of experience, I do not see any legal violations here. That's how USCIS sees this. My proof for the fact is the 1000s of downgrade applications approved so far by USCIS in last decade or so. Ask yourself this, when was the last time USCIS went above and beyond the letter of the law to help out hapless immigrants?

[AceMan]

I am not a judge, I am just pointing out the facts at the crowd who have been wronged for a long time in their search for fairness. From 2010-2020 every body qualified on EB2, every other Eb3 rushed to clog the EB2 irrespective of where they are with the dates. From 2018 it is the reverse path.

This was clear when Eb2 I is still not reached from the dates it reached 9 years back. And in 2018 when EB3 moved forward the downgrades held it back with no forward movement. These are hard facts and not my bias or misconception. This site provides a wealth of information on the number of Eb3 applicants for more than a decade.

Don't blame the fact checker when you are shown the truth. Closing the eyes, or accusing me of bias and misconception just don't change the fact the people changing the queue slows down the process.

It is an individual choice of what to do. I am clearly showing the consequences of wrong choices over the last 10 years and repeating the same mistake is not going to help anybody. All it results in people jumping from one bucket to another. Yes, the lawyers are benefited from it.

[mitul75]

Should'nt we consider the possiblity that USCIS is processing way less FB cases compared to a non Pandemic year and that might give them enough time to process all 150K visas?
As far as I know, most family based green cards are issued at local US embassies/consulates and the USCIS service centers are not involved. So the workload for FB visas is distributed to a bigger workforce. EB GCs on the other hand are mostly issued by USCIS service centers and due to COVID, most of these centers are running with a depleted workforce. Without a dramatic increase in staffing, I imagine most of the FB-EB spillover visas will get wasted.

[vsivarama]

Don't blame the fact checker when you are shown the truth. Closing the eyes, or accusing me of bias and misconception just don't change the fact the people changing the queue slows down the process.

It is an individual choice of what to do. I am clearly showing the consequences of wrong choices over the last 10 years and repeating the same mistake is not going to help anybody. All it results in people jumping from one bucket to another. Yes, the lawyers are benefited from it.

So through your fact based judgment can you show how many EB3/EB2 visas got wasted in the past decade because of EB3 to EB2 upgrades? It may slow down the process and add confusion. But we have done all the number crunching in this forum and have found no wastage. If someone qualifies in EB3, great a slot opens up in EB2 and vice versa. As you pointed out, no one is getting 2-3 GCs. If USCIS wants to sit on the cases it will find a reason to do so. The same goes in the reverse.

P.S. If you want to talk about last years wastage, we all know upgrades/downgrades were not the cause of it.

[aGCHopefull]

Sorry to hear about your situation, there are thousands of families in the same situation unfortunately due to the obvious know reasons to all.
I believe your son's I485 petition also has been applied in Oct 2020.
Why do you think he is going to age out? As per CSPA Age calculation, your son's age at any point when the visa numbers are available is going to stay as 18.5 Years based on the AOS filing date.

https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-a-chapter-7 - Refer to "2. Child Status Protection Act Age Calculation" under "F. Family and Employment-Based Preference and Diversity Immigrants"

Only benefit you might have is to get the card earlier if EB3 moves faster than EB2 which no one can predict. Take an appropriate decision weighing all facts.

Could someone please confirm this? If the I 485 has been filed for the child when he/she was 18.5 years of age (but the final action date was not current), would child still age out at 21 if FAD is still not current at that point (when child turns 21)?

[Transformer]

I believe your son's I485 petition also has been applied in Oct 2020.
Why do you think he is going to age out? As per CSPA Age calculation, your son's age at any point when the visa numbers are available is going to stay as 18.5 Years based on the AOS filing date..

CSPA is only applied if dates are in Final Action Dates not in Date of filing chart. Child date is not locked until his PD moves to FAD. Unfortunately nothing much we can do, even I have a kid aging out in 4 years. With May 2011 date my attorney advised not to file AOS for the kid as it may create problems in future when he wants to change to F1.

[aGCHopefull]

Could someone please confirm this? If the I 485 has been filed for the child when he/she was 18.5 years of age (but the final action date was not current), would child still age out at 21 if FAD is still not current at that point (when child turns 21)?

reading https://www.uscis.gov/policy-manual/volume-7-part-a-chapter-7

Instead of freezing the age of the applicant on the filing date, CSPA provides a formula by which the applicant’s CSPA age is calculated that takes into account the amount of time the qualifying petition was pending.

Age at time of visa availability - Pending time = CSPA Age

Seems like this pending time is based on when actually visa number was available - when FAD got current

Can someone please confirm this?

[inspired_p]

I am not a judge, I am just pointing out the facts at the crowd who have been wronged for a long time in their search for fairness. From 2010-2020 every body qualified on EB2, every other Eb3 rushed to clog the EB2 irrespective of where they are with the dates. From 2018 it is the reverse path.

This was clear when Eb2 I is still not reached from the dates it reached 9 years back. And in 2018 when EB3 moved forward the downgrades held it back with no forward movement. These are hard facts and not my bias or misconception. This site provides a wealth of information on the number of Eb3 applicants for more than a decade.

Don't blame the fact checker when you are shown the truth. Closing the eyes, or accusing me of bias and misconception just don't change the fact the people changing the queue slows down the process.

It is an individual choice of what to do. I am clearly showing the consequences of wrong choices over the last 10 years and repeating the same mistake is not going to help anybody. All it results in people jumping from one bucket to another. Yes, the lawyers are benefited from it.

I have no bones to pick on your opinion if moving from eb2 to eb3 or vice versa is beneficial or not. It might be counter productive.I think I have amply proven that based on PERM ; it is perfectly okay to file both applications ; by the letter of the law as well as the essence of the law. All the power to people who do that.

[vsivarama]

Could someone please confirm this? If the I 485 has been filed for the child when he/she was 18.5 years of age (but the final action date was not current), would child still age out at 21 if FAD is still not current at that point (when child turns 21)?

Unfortunately Filing Date doe NOT lock a child's age. The link specifically refers to Final Action Date. Hope it changes in the current administration. So answer to your question is that the child will still age out. Hope there is swift relief to the thousands facing this ordeal.

[mitul75]

Another way to look at the EB1-EB2-EB3 debate is we all are applying for a future job, and the employer will do whatever is in the best interest of the company at the time of hiring the employee. If a company has a Job A open today that requires hiring of candidates with "advanced degrees or exceptional ability", then they will hire someone that best fits the bill, whether it's a US citizen or a foreign national.
Once that someone, who happens to be from India without a green card, becomes a senior and valued member of the company, the company will do whatever it can to keep the employee happy and continue with the job. At that point in time, if a opportunity opens up for this employee to legally downgrade his GC petition and fast track his GC process, then I don't think the company will think twice to apply for an I-140 petition to downgrade, since it will be in the best interest of the company not to lose a senior and experienced staff who can now do both Job A requiring "advanced degrees or exceptional ability", and Job B that only needs a "skilled worker" in the same job category, rather than hiring a new candidate, let's say a US citizen, who would now need to be trained at a higher cost to do Job B.
After all, it's a free-market economy.

[aGCHopefull]

Unfortunately Filing Date doe NOT lock a child's age. The link specifically refers to Final Action Date. Hope it changes in the current administration. So answer to your question is that the child will still age out. Hope there is swift relief to the millions facing this ordeal.

What happens if FAD becomes current for a child (let's say May 11) but somehow gets retrogressed again?

[AceMan]

So through your fact based judgment can you show how many EB3/EB2 visas got wasted in the past decade because of EB3 to EB2 upgrades? It may slow down the process and add confusion. But we have done all the number crunching in this forum and have found no wastage. If someone qualifies in EB3, great a slot opens up in EB2 and vice versa. As you pointed out, no one is getting 2-3 GCs. If USCIS wants to sit on the cases it will find a reason to do so. The same goes in the reverse.

P.S. If you want to talk about last years wastage, we all know upgrades/downgrades were not the cause of it.

From 2010-2017 I have followed the EB3 specific numbers which can be verified in DHS statistics as well as the Immigration year book. EB3 had a shortage of about 17,000 for these years, however those numbers were used by other EB categories so it ends up as a zero sum game which prompts you to say no wastage. Those EB3 numbers were a loss for EB3 India applicants. Now you may say they were compensated by upgrading to EB2.

Let us look at October 2018 when the first instance of reverse usage came into prominence. For FY 2019 EB3 I got more than 5000 visas however the dates moved back mid year.

2020 is a one of the kind year with covid and we got only about 138 K for entire EB category when it was supposed to get 156 K.

Any loss of visa when people are waiting directly impacts the backlogged people. A person will downgrade their petition citing USCIS accepts it, valid case itself, now what do you have to say about that person pushing the 140 petition to premium when dates are not even current, and that is clearly forbidden by the law, but people still do it because of some loop hole?

[AceMan]

I have no bones to pick on your opinion if moving from eb2 to eb3 or vice versa is beneficial or not. It might be counter productive.I think I have amply proven that based on PERM ; it is perfectly okay to file both applications ; by the letter of the law as well as the essence of the law. All the power to people who do that.

It is perfectly legit to do that. My wish of anything different is not the USCIS rule. I was clearly pointing out the people who have downgraded now by amending their petition is going to fill up the pages in October 21 on how they are entitled to be back in EB2 queue.

[idliman]

What happens if FAD becomes current for a child (let's say May 11) but somehow gets retrogressed again?
The first time the FA becomes current for you, the child's age gets locked. It does not matter if FA dates keep current or retrogress. The child will get his/her GC.

The unfortunate thing is that this is just a policy by USCIS. They can change it to "DF" dates instead of "FA" with some activism. Don't know why they were so rigid on locking dates only for "FA".

[vsivarama]

What happens if FAD becomes current for a child (let's say May 11) but somehow gets retrogressed again?

Then the child's age will get locked in at that date. Does not matter if you get your GC after a decade. The child is protected.

[Transformer]

What happens if FAD becomes current for a child (let's say May 11) but somehow gets retrogressed again?

It will lock the age even if it was retrogressed later. I have friends who applied in 2012 and haven't received GC yet (there was only FAD at that time). One of friends kid is 24 now, but his age is locked when he filed. I don't have to tell you that dates retrogressed later for them.

[AceMan]

If the they amend the existing i140 and it get rejected it will put the case in jeopardy. Hence most of the case instead of going for amend they go for new application. incase new one get rejected person can have their already approved i140 to use. He may not take advantage of AOs but he will be safe with i140 and continue with h1b. I am pretty clear and confirmed on this understanding.

I have been searching around, and it seems that Neufield memo from 2007 (https://www.aila.org/infonet/uscis-neufeld-ac21-memo) states something else. The interpretation which is disputed is saying that possibility of rejection for NEW petition is high.

[inspired_p]

It is perfectly legit to do that. My wish of anything different is not the USCIS rule. I was clearly pointing out the people who have downgraded now by amending their petition is going to fill up the pages in October 21 on how they are entitled to be back in EB2 queue.

AND they are ENTITLED .. that's the point !

[delguy]

It is perfectly legit to do that. My wish of anything different is not the USCIS rule. I was clearly pointing out the people who have downgraded now by amending their petition is going to fill up the pages in October 21 on how they are entitled to be back in EB2 queue.

EB3 folks did exactly the same for last 10 years, upgrading to EB2 and jumping the queue. I am EB2 with June 2010 PD and never complained. If EB2 is doing the same which is allowed ny USCIS, there shouldnt be any issue now. I encouraged 2 of my friends to downgrade to EB3 and take advantage of date movement. EB2 /3 is just same. We go with whichever we seems to think is going to move faster.

[LeoAugust]

Unfortunately Filing Date doe NOT lock a child's age. The link specifically refers to Final Action Date. Hope it changes in the current administration. So answer to your question is that the child will still age out. Hope there is swift relief to the thousands facing this ordeal.

If the child get a EAD based on the AOS filled on filling date, wont he be protected? Just wish to know

[LeoAugust]

I have been searching around, and it seems that Neufield memo from 2007 (https://www.aila.org/infonet/uscis-neufeld-ac21-memo) states something else. The interpretation which is disputed is saying that possibility of rejection for NEW petition is high.

All new petitions are getting approved with PP. Those who files PP without waiting they are asked to apply later. Also there are case of i140 rejection as well but it is very less compare to approve.

[moonlight]

It will lock the age even if it was retrogressed later. I have friends who applied in 2012 and haven't received GC yet (there was only FAD at that time). One of friends kid is 24 now, but his age is locked when he filed. I don't have to tell you that dates retrogressed later for them.

What documentations are required to evidence the locking of Child age in case of retrogression?

[Transformer]

What documentations are required to evidence the locking of Child age in case of retrogression?

Nothing. It is done automatically by USCIS.

[vsivarama]

From 2010-2017 I have followed the EB3 specific numbers which can be verified in DHS statistics as well as the Immigration year book. EB3 had a shortage of about 17,000 for these years, however those numbers were used by other EB categories so it ends up as a zero sum game which prompts you to say no wastage. Those EB3 numbers were a loss for EB3 India applicants. Now you may say they were compensated by upgrading to EB2.

Let us look at October 2018 when the first instance of reverse usage came into prominence. For FY 2019 EB3 I got more than 5000 visas however the dates moved back mid year.

If everyone stayed put in their queues over the last decade, EB2 may had been in 2011 or 2012 and EB3 would have been in 2007-2008 range. Now both are moving a few months apart. So it depends on the perspective if you want to call it wastage.


2020 is a one of the kind year with covid and we got only about 138 K for entire EB category when it was supposed to get 156 K. Any loss of visa when people are waiting directly impacts the backlogged people.

I 100% agree with you here.


A person will downgrade their petition citing USCIS accepts it, valid case itself, now what do you have to say about that person pushing the 140 petition to premium when dates are not even current, and that is clearly forbidden by the law, but people still do it because of some loop hole?

I certainly do not know about loopholes here so will not comment on them. If it is forbidden by law USCIS should reject premium processing, period. If they are accepting it then I would say it's either legit or that's how they interpreted the law.

[Transformer]

If the child get a EAD based on the AOS filled on filling date, wont he be protected? Just wish to know

No. EAD is just a biproduct of pending AOS. Once they age out their AOS is rejected, EAD is invalidated, unless FAD is current before age out.

[LeoAugust]

No. EAD is just a biproduct of pending AOS. Once they age out their AOS is rejected, EAD is invalidated, unless FAD is current before age out.

Oh... that's scary. I did not know that. I thought age locked once child has EAD. This is serious. Many of the folk's child aging out is not aware of this it seems.

[incredible]

Thank you for your quick reply. It is strangely great feeling of relief mixed with anxiety. Great feeling for potentially getting greened in the coming months. Anxiety on new company discussions, etc. Anyways, I will wait and see what is in there and also wait for other experts comments.

Seems USCIS is working in overdrive suddenly. Supplement J that I have applied back in 2020 Jan and was pending for long time, suddenly got approved today. This makes me believe that the RFE (not yet received the documents) may only be related to medicals. There may be a good chance of dates advancing to early 2010 (FAD) very soon for EB2 based on sudden activities that we are seeing.

[AceMan]

If everyone stayed put in their queues over the last decade, EB2 may had been in 2011 or 2012 and EB3 would have been in 2007-2008 range. Now both are moving a few months apart. So it depends on the perspective if you want to call it wastage.


The spill over works with EB1,EB2 and Eb3. People grow up in the career and EB3-2 is natural progression. Eb2 has 320,000 applicants and Eb3 has 69,000 applicants. You don't grow downwards in your skill unless you change a job or apply for a new position.






I certainly do not know about loopholes here so will not comment on them. If it is forbidden by law USCIS should reject premium processing, period. If they are accepting it then I would say it's either legit or that's how they interpreted the law.

Since you are comfortable with analogies I will give you an example. There are items available at display in Walmart and may other places. People "accidentally" keep that items in the bag and they walk out. When caught they feign innocence. I have seen lot of people trivializing shop lifting when it is a very serious offense which can lead to a GC denial.

USCIS rule book says premium processing not allowed when the original PERM is not attached. Premium process is the ability to use a resource for working on an item which requires immediate assistance and this limited resource is used for something which should not be even applied in the first place.

You wanted to know earlier that downgrades are not a reason for delay. I can say that after more than 100 days of applying my status is still finger print received which is the status for a vast majority of applicants. With no applicants from around the world what else do you think is the reason for it?

[ak7419]

Seems USCIS is working in overdrive suddenly. Supplement J that I have applied back in 2020 Jan and was pending for long time, suddenly got approved today. This makes me believe that the RFE (not yet received the documents) may only be related to medicals. There may be a good chance of dates advancing to early 2010 (FAD) very soon for EB2 based on sudden activities that we are seeing.

Just an FYI. There are lot of folks like me who got current five months ago and have not received any RFE.

[vsivarama]

The spill over works with EB1,EB2 and Eb3. People grow up in the career and EB3-2 is natural progression. Eb2 has 320,000 applicants and Eb3 has 69,000 applicants. You don't grow downwards in your skill unless you change a job or apply for a new position.

I have already made the case as to how USCIS looks at it. No one is saying they grow downwards (you could make that case only if a different PERM was required). If in fact USCIS ran with your logic, they could kick everyone out of EB3 who have been waiting for a decade as they failed to show natural progression for over a decade. I will not engage further on this since nothing I say will change your opinion on people who downgraded. It does not really matter if someone thinks I am fraudulent, my conscience is clear.


Since you are comfortable with analogies I will give you an example. There are items available at display in Walmart and may other places. People "accidentally" keep that items in the bag and they walk out. When caught they feign innocence. I have seen lot of people trivializing shop lifting when it is a very serious offense which can lead to a GC denial.

USCIS rule book says premium processing not allowed when the original PERM is not attached. Premium process is the ability to use a resource for working on an item which requires immediate assistance and this limited resource is used for something which should not be even applied in the first place.

I do not know what point you are trying to make here. It looks like an apples to oranges comparison to me. If the law says you are not allowed to buy beer under the age of 21, then if you are caught not having paid for it you do NOT get the option to pay for it and leave (if you are a minor). USCIS is under NO OBLIGATION to premium process an application if it is against the law (If it's a grey area then it's a different issue). Not sure how much more clear I can be on this. You can try and premium process your 485 or EAD and see what the USCIS has to say about it.


You wanted to know earlier that downgrades are not a reason for delay. I can say that after more than 100 days of applying my status is still finger print received which is the status for a vast majority of applicants. With no applicants from around the world what else do you think is the reason for it?

You can read my previous statements, I said we had not seen visa wastage as a result of upgrades in last decade. I did acknowledge there will be delays and confusion. As for your inconvenience, I do apologize for having the temerity to downgrade my case. I should have known better.

[monsieur]

......... If in fact USCIS ran with your logic, they could kick everyone out of EB3 who have been waiting for a decade as they failed to show natural progression for over a decade. ...........

When I 1st applied for GC, I had BE + MS + 4.5 years of experience. It was Sr Engineer role and Fragomen deemed me as EB2 category back in 2010. Since then I moved 2 jobs, went upto Principal Engieer role and all my employer used Fragomen and filed it in EB-2.

But I switched job again in late 2019 and took Dev Mgr role. New firm is in cloud services and Fragomen is their immi team. Fragomen told me as Individual Contributer engineer role, yes I am eligible for EB2 but based on job description given by my employer to them, S/W Dev Mgr role is deemed as EB-3 role. Even thou I am managing team of well experienced engineers my own case is filed as EB3 awaiting perm approval.

TLDR - Not all EB3 cases after 10 yrs failed to show natural progression :)

[gc2021]

Hello Guru's,

I have approved H1B(valid till 2023) with my current employer and I have approved EAD/AP through Adjustment of status. If I want to switch from H1 B status to EAD what should my employer do ? Need to update I-9 ? How does USCIS know what is my current visa status ? H1B vs Pending 485?

My wife is working on H4 EAD which is valid for another two years and now her GC EAD also approved . Is she need to inform her employer with GC EAD details or her H4 EAD still fine?

[Moveon]

When I 1st applied for GC, I had BE + MS + 4.5 years of experience. It was Sr Engineer role and Fragomen deemed me as EB2 category back in 2010. Since then I moved 2 jobs, went upto Principal Engieer role and all my employer used Fragomen and filed it in EB-2.

But I switched job again in late 2019 and took Dev Mgr role. New firm is in cloud services and Fragomen is their immi team. Fragomen told me as Individual Contributer engineer role, yes I am eligible for EB2 but based on job description given by my employer to them, S/W Dev Mgr role is deemed as EB-3 role. Even thou I am managing team of well experienced engineers my own case is filed as EB3 awaiting perm approval.

TLDR - Not all EB3 cases after 10 yrs failed to show natural progression :)

Well I have seen many people move from IC roles to Managerial roles but all stayed in EB-2 and some used that to move from EB-3 to EB-2 . I filed EB-2 back in 2009 as an IC and got my EAD in 2012. I then took up a senior manager role at my previous and current company with Fragoman and BAL as the lawyers. I still have 75% of my duties as that of an architect but do manage a team of ~10 . I did not have to downgrade or file a new petition . Both the law firms said that it was a natural progression and as the Technical role was still maintained it was not a problem.
Did you have to file a new petition when you moved to a managerial position ? Were the job duties completely different .

[inspired_p]

When I 1st applied for GC, I had BE + MS + 4.5 years of experience. It was Sr Engineer role and Fragomen deemed me as EB2 category back in 2010. Since then I moved 2 jobs, went upto Principal Engieer role and all my employer used Fragomen and filed it in EB-2.

But I switched job again in late 2019 and took Dev Mgr role. New firm is in cloud services and Fragomen is their immi team. Fragomen told me as Individual Contributer engineer role, yes I am eligible for EB2 but based on job description given by my employer to them, S/W Dev Mgr role is deemed as EB-3 role. Even thou I am managing team of well experienced engineers my own case is filed as EB3 awaiting perm approval.

TLDR - Not all EB3 cases after 10 yrs failed to show natural progression :)

Your case combined with mine gives complete clarity that job description and qualification/experience on the PERM determines if EB2/ EB2 "can" be applied. in which eligible category the I-140 is applied is moot and the rules/law no say about it either ways. People just like to play "Us Vs Them".
I repeat again … I know many companies who only file in EB3 as it is their "policy" no matter what the job actually qualified for.

We can always debate if it is helpful for individual or to the entire waiting community to jump from EB2 to EB3 or vice vers. But I find it obnoxious when legality/morality is getting questioned with some notion that is not based on facts.

[vsivarama]

When I 1st applied for GC, I had BE + MS + 4.5 years of experience. It was Sr Engineer role and Fragomen deemed me as EB2 category back in 2010. Since then I moved 2 jobs, went upto Principal Engieer role and all my employer used Fragomen and filed it in EB-2.

But I switched job again in late 2019 and took Dev Mgr role. New firm is in cloud services and Fragomen is their immi team. Fragomen told me as Individual Contributer engineer role, yes I am eligible for EB2 but based on job description given by my employer to them, S/W Dev Mgr role is deemed as EB-3 role. Even thou I am managing team of well experienced engineers my own case is filed as EB3 awaiting perm approval.

TLDR - Not all EB3 cases after 10 yrs failed to show natural progression :)

Thank You, for so eloquently making the point for me. That's exactly how I should have said it. I would say a lot of folks in this forum would even qualify for EB1C if the 1 year, work (manage people) outside of US qualification was not there. Even the lawyers with their interpretation could bump up or down your eligibility.

[AceMan]

I have already made the case as to how USCIS looks at it. No one is saying they grow downwards (you could make that case only if a different PERM was required). If in fact USCIS ran with your logic, they could kick everyone out of EB3 who have been waiting for a decade as they failed to show natural progression for over a decade. I will not engage further on this since nothing I say will change your opinion on people who downgraded. It does not really matter if someone thinks I am fraudulent, my conscience is clear.



I do not know what point you are trying to make here. It looks like an apples to oranges comparison to me. If the law says you are not allowed to buy beer under the age of 21, then if you are caught not having paid for it you do NOT get the option to pay for it and leave (if you are a minor). USCIS is under NO OBLIGATION to premium process an application if it is against the law (If it's a grey area then it's a different issue). Not sure how much more clear I can be on this. You can try and premium process your 485 or EAD and see what the USCIS has to say about it.



You can read my previous statements, I said we had not seen visa wastage as a result of upgrades in last decade. I did acknowledge there will be delays and confusion. As for your inconvenience, I do apologize for having the temerity to downgrade my case. I should have known better.

The premium process I am talking about is for 140. But again you can wake up a person who is sleeping, you cannot if one is pretending to sleep.

I will agree to the part this discussion has run its course and it is up to the individual to decide if a change in category can help them or not. I respect the fact that you are a fellow immigrant who believes what you did is right, I am another immigrant who has very strong opinions on people who downgrade.

[AceMan]

When I 1st applied for GC, I had BE + MS + 4.5 years of experience. It was Sr Engineer role and Fragomen deemed me as EB2 category back in 2010. Since then I moved 2 jobs, went upto Principal Engieer role and all my employer used Fragomen and filed it in EB-2.

But I switched job again in late 2019 and took Dev Mgr role. New firm is in cloud services and Fragomen is their immi team. Fragomen told me as Individual Contributer engineer role, yes I am eligible for EB2 but based on job description given by my employer to them, S/W Dev Mgr role is deemed as EB-3 role. Even thou I am managing team of well experienced engineers my own case is filed as EB3 awaiting perm approval.

TLDR - Not all EB3 cases after 10 yrs failed to show natural progression :)

Very good point. What people who are using your post to justify downgrade is missing the fundamental fact that you have changed jobs.

[vedu]

I have already made the case as to how USCIS looks at it. No one is saying they grow downwards (you could make that case only if a different PERM was required). If in fact USCIS ran with your logic, they could kick everyone out of EB3 who have been waiting for a decade as they failed to show natural progression for over a decade. I will not engage further on this since nothing I say will change your opinion on people who downgraded. It does not really matter if someone thinks I am fraudulent, my conscience is clear.



Vsivarama,

I support your viewpoint on this. You did the right thing by downgrading. Securing EAD/AP for you and your family is worth its weight in gold (It's not that heavy anyways! :D). One should do anything possible, upgrade/downgrade to get in the AOS status.

If one already has an EAD/AP, then should he/she downgrade? I say "Yes", particularly if your employer is paying and if it means you can get your GC 6-7 months earlier. What do you have to lose? We are nobody to judge morality of it. Let the USCIS worry about that.

[idliman]

Coming back to predictions. Here's whats Feb 2021 Visa Bulletin says about potential monthly movement.

EMPLOYMENT-based categories (potential monthly movement)
EB1 - India: Up to six months
EB2 - India: Up to two weeks
EB3 - India: Up to three weeks

So the best case scenarios for FA dates in Mar 2021 VB are
EB1I - 01JUL20
EB2I - 26OCT09
EB3I - 22APR10

In reality the actual movements will be lower than what's stated in past VB.

[idliman]

Hello Guru's,

I have approved H1B(valid till 2023) with my current employer and I have approved EAD/AP through Adjustment of status. If I want to switch from H1 B status to EAD what should my employer do ? Need to update I-9 ? How does USCIS know what is my current visa status ? H1B vs Pending 485?

My wife is working on H4 EAD which is valid for another two years and now her GC EAD also approved . Is she need to inform her employer with GC EAD details or her H4 EAD still fine?
Welcome to this forum.

Is there a reason why you want to switch to EAD when you have a valid H1B status? H1B status has its own advantage (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2936-Transit-Visa-details-and-disscusion-for-travel-on-EAD-AP?p=69234&viewfull=1#post69234). Your employer will complete a I-9 and submit or if you use AP to reenter the country (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2927-EAD-AP-Renewal-Sample-format?p=69155&viewfull=1#post69155), you will automatically go to "AOS Pending" or "DA" status. I would recommend you to stay in H1B and later on when you travel you will automatically go to "DA" status.

For your spouse, it is a good idea to move to GC EAD instead of H4 EAD. H4 EAD is based on a rule that can be cancelled any time (DT admin tried to cancel it). GC EAD is based on a law and it cannot be cancelled that easily. Your spouse can stay on "AOS Pending" and you can stay on H1B. The beauty is there is no USCIS fee to renew EAD/AP with I485 pending. See details in EAD/AP thread (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2927-EAD-AP-Renewal-Sample-format).

If you use EAD/AP, your wife will also move to "AOS Pending" status and will have to fill a new I-9. However, if she moves to "AOS Pending", you still stay with current status. Hope this helps.

[gthbvf]

AC21/Porting/CSPA Protection (hypothetical scenario)


PD: May/2011
Previous Employer filed I-140 EB2 (PD May/2011)
Current Employer Filed EB3 (PD ported)
Employee filed AOS (Oct/2020) based on I-485J provided by Current Employer (EB3) . Employee should get EAD before May-2020

Question:
IF FAD for EB2 moves to May/2011 at end of FY2021 (While FAD EB3 does not move to May/2011)

Can employee go back to previous employer under AC21 start working on EAD and then request to USCIS to Transfer of Underlying Basis to adjudicate AOS case under EB2 FAD ? ie .. 485J from previous employer

Some folks who have H4 child about to age out in less than year could be well into this situation and they can lock child's age IF old employer could still offer job :)
Because at start of FY2022 ..FAD will likely retrogress till last quarter of FY2022.



----------------------------

My Background
PD: Apr 2011 in EB2, 15+ years of H1B life
Status: Filed for AOS, EAD, AP in Oct-2020 and rec'd receipt# by Nov-2020, currently waiting for Biometrics appointment notice
H4 Child: My son is in college (freshmen)

I have a question, need some consultation:
Assuming USCIS utilize available SO for FY-2021, we will get our GC this year. If not, then I have to downgrade to EB-3 in order to avoid my son's potential age-out issue (2.5 years left). Since my employer is not supporting downgrade, I am exploring options to change job after 180 days. Wondering whether my new employer can file I-140 in EB-3 directly, i.e. without filing a new PERM based on AC-21 rule.

[monsieur]

@Moveon - Did you have to file a new petition when you moved to a managerial position ?

Yes, Its a new job so started from scratch i.e Perm + I-140. I am still waiting for perm to be approved before I can file I-140.


@inspired_p - job description and qualification/experience on the PERM determines if EB2/ EB2 "can" be applied.

This is absolutely correct. Its always Job Description AND Qualification of candidate which determines EB category. It can’t be just one. We always get carried away with qualification of candidate without giving thought about Job Description.

@vsivarama - Hehe so true my Internet friend; I do have lawyer certificate which gives me property rights on moon so yeah I agree that if they want they can make any person as EB-1 candidate.

@Aceman - Buddy your frustration is USCIS is progressing slowly. Thats an agency problem, reason is whether lack of funding, political agenda or genuine surge of immigration in USA (legal, illegal both) is bringing to its knees. Keep in mind, apart from EB GC, they are responsible for ALL Visa category which is much much bigger workload. Agency needs overhaul in terms of rules and regulation but most imp in attitude. Maybe they are immigrant friendly but us (EB-I) don’t see it coz of sheer number of us waiting for GC.

I know one thing, if we all can apply to EB1 or EB5 GC and get it next month we will do it in blink of an eye. I firmly believe that all of active users whose dates are in mid-2011 will be greened by this year end or max 2022. If this doesn't happen, Spec will share data to show where those GC number are allotted.

[idliman]

In a complicated scenario like yourself with uncertainties, try to break into simpler things first.

AOS Pending Status: It is where you have an I-485 receipt number. By itself, a) it does not allow you to work and b) it does not allow you to reenter the country. There is no requirement of work.

AOS Pending + EAD: EAD allows you to work when you are in AOS pending status.

AOS Pending + AP: It allows you to travel out of the country without abandoning your I485. If you travel without AP, you are in serious jeopardy unless you have another status such as H1, L1, etc., See AP Travel thread for more inf (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2936-Transit-Visa-details-and-disscusion-for-travel-on-EAD-AP)o.

AC21 or INA Section 204(j): It grants you ?job portability? after 180 days of pending I485 from ?Received Date? on I485 form I797 receipt notice.

I485 Supplement J: First understand that I485 / GC is for a future job that is stated on PERM. The first time you file I485, Supp J is for confirmation of Bona Fide Job Offer. After 180 days if you send Supp J it is a request for Job Portability Under INA Section 204(j) / AC21.

The moment you talk about AC21, the first rule is no matter what you have to meet the 180 day requirement. After 180 days, you are a "free agent" and you can go and work for any employer as long as the job is in ?same or similar? category. It goes without saying that you need to have an EAD to work in AOS Pending status.


AC21/Porting/CSPA Protection (hypothetical scenario)
Question: Can employee go back to previous employer under AC21 start working on EAD and then request to USCIS to Transfer of Underlying Basis to adjudicate AOS case under EB2 FAD ? ie .. 485J from previous employer

You are correct. After 180 days, you will use AC21 and port to previous employer and then request USCIS for ?Transfer of Underlying Basis? a.k.a Interfiling. You can move from EB2 to EB3 and vice versa as you have two sets of PERM+I-140 approved by two different employers. See Murthy article on this for more details / fine print (https://www.murthy.com/2020/10/14/interfiling-new-immigrant-petition-into-pending-i-485-case-1-of-2/).


AC21/Porting/CSPA Protection (hypothetical scenario)
Some folks who have H4 child about to age out in less than year could be well into this situation and they can lock child's age IF old employer could still offer job :)
Because at start of FY2022 ..FAD will likely retrogress till last quarter of FY2022.

Yes you are correct. That?s why I recommend my friends who are facing age-out type scenario to maintain an EB2 and EB3 I140. Whichever queue becomes ?FA? current first, you can Interfile and lock the child?s age.

Hope this helps.

[monsieur]

AC21/Porting/CSPA Protection (hypothetical scenario)


PD: May/2011

Question:
IF FAD for EB2 moves to May/2011 at end of FY2021 (While FAD EB3 does not move to May/2011)

----------------------------

What makes you think this will happen i.e EB2 will reach May-2011 before EB-3?? Currently EB-3 is Apr-2010 and EB-2 is still in 2009.

https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/data/I140_by_class_country_FY09_19.pdf My go to report as there is no way one person can go back in time and get their I-140 approved. Based on it there are total of 15K EB2+ 7K EB3 (total-22k) approved I-140 in 2010 and 30K total (22k - EB2, 8K EB3) in 2011.

Rough behind the napkin number says there are 60K folks (22k * 2 from 2010 + 15K * 2 from 2011; subtract 14K for folks with both partner I-140 + folks who upgraded to EB1) ahead of you. Keep an tab how many total EB2 and EB3 GC approved for India category in given year.

As you might have read discussion in this page, EB2 and EB3 category differentiation is no longer valid after 10 yrs. Folks move and their new petition get changed. EB2 and EB3 will go hand in hand. Things are too far, don't get stressed abt stuff which you can't control.

[ak7419]

Folks - I am trying to find current 485J supplement form on USCIS site. Found this one but it seems to have expired in Oct 2020. Can I still use it?

https://www.uscis.gov/i-485supj

[vedu]

AOS Pending + AP: It allows you to travel out of the country without abandoning your I485. If you travel without AP, you are in serious jeopardy unless you have another status such as H1, L1, etc., See AP Travel thread for more inf (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2936-Transit-Visa-details-and-disscusion-for-travel-on-EAD-AP)o.



Idliman,

I have a question about "AOS Pending + AP" scenario you have outlined above. I recently got my H1-B approved. I have also applied for AP (because last time USCIS gave me separate 2 year EAD and one year AP document). I am not sure how long it will take for USCIS to approve my AP. So, the question is...if I don't receive the AP in time and I have to travel for an emergency, I can take the H1-B visa appointment in India and leave the US without AP without jeopardizing my I485 application....right or wrong? And the second question...if for some reason the visa stamping gets declined in India, then I will be without any status and thus will jeopardize my I 485 application, and possibly won't be able to return to the US...right?

As such, I don't anticipate any issues with visa stamping, but just want to make sure that all the bases are covered and I am not overlooking any unforeseen scenario.

[idliman]

Idliman,

I have a question about "AOS Pending + AP" scenario you have outlined above. I recently got my H1-B approved. I have also applied for AP (because last time USCIS gave me separate 2 year EAD and one year AP document). I am not sure how long it will take for USCIS to approve my AP. So, the question is...if I don't receive the AP in time and I have to travel for an emergency, I can take the H1-B visa appointment in India and leave the US without AP without jeopardizing my I485 application....right or wrong?

Yes. But the catch is you have to be in H1B status at the time of departure to return back in H1B status. This will not abandon your I-485 application. This means that you need to be eligible for H1B and have all docs, including a valid visa stamp to return to US.


And the second question...if for some reason the visa stamping gets declined in India, then I will be without any status and thus will jeopardize my I 485 application, and possibly won't be able to return to the US...right?
As such, I don't anticipate any issues with visa stamping, but just want to make sure that all the bases are covered and I am not overlooking any unforeseen scenario.

This is a harder question for me to answer. I don?t think you will have any issue with stamping as long as you have not done fraud, felony, DUI, etc., If H1B is denied for work related issue, your employer can do another I-129 addressing the issues that the consulate had raised. Then you can go for H1B stamping again. You probably have to pay big bucks to law firms so that they can get you out of jail (a metaphor).

General:
For applying AP, you need to be physically present in the USA. The AP should be approved and in hand before leaving USA and you need to return before the expiry of the AP at the time of departure. Let?s say a pending AP is approved and you ask your friend to mail it to India. You cannot use the new AP to reenter. However, you can come back using old AP and then use new AP for a separate trip.

Traveling on AP is tricky business. So please read / educate yourself before going on a trip.

There are also provisions to request emergency AP. You need to google it to see if you can avail that. Hope this Helps.

[vedu]

Yes. But the catch is you have to be in H1B status at the time of departure to return back in H1B status. This will not abandon your I-485 application. This means that you need to be eligible for H1B and have all docs, including a valid visa stamp to return to US.


Thank you for your detailed response! My last entry to US was based on AP as a parolee. I had a valid H1-B, but didn't get the stamp in India at that time. After I returned to US, I continued on H1-B (didn't change I-9 form with the employer), since then the H1-B was renewed two times without any issues with the most recent approval came a couple of weeks ago. So, say I decide to leave US without AP, I suppose I am in H1B status at the time of departure. I will have all the docs EXCEPT a valid visa stamp at the time of departure, which I will get in India. Long story short, not having a valid visa stamp in passport at the time of departure from US shouldn't be an issue...right?

[idliman]

Thank you for your detailed response! My last entry to US was based on AP as a parolee. I had a valid H1-B, but didn't get the stamp in India at that time. After I returned to US, I continued on H1-B (didn't change I-9 form with the employer), since then the H1-B was renewed two times without any issues with the most recent approval came a couple of weeks ago. So, say I decide to leave US without AP, I suppose I am in H1B status at the time of departure. I will have all the docs EXCEPT a valid visa stamp at the time of departure, which I will get in India. Long story short, not having a valid visa stamp in passport at the time of departure from US shouldn't be an issue...right?
Sure. You can go for H1B stamping in India with pending AOS. H1B is a dual intent visa and will not affect your AOS. If you don't believe me (you should always cross-check random internet advice), look at the questionnaire in Zhang & Co website (https://www.hooyou.com/h-1b/h1b_Work%20and%20Travel%20Issues%20Related%20to%20 I-485.html). It is well explained.

I am sorry that you got into 1 year paper AP mess. Next time use (c)(9)(P) and look at the EAD/AP renewal template. This has worked for most of us without any issues.

[gthbvf]

@monsieur - I certainly do not want this happen. But Eb3I movement depends on ROW demand and EB2I due possibility of EB1 spillover (From May2021) might catch up fast .

USCIS bureaucracy and ability to handle case , impact of interview requirement on cases is big unknown. With Steady ROW demand USCIS may wait till last quarter to apply horizontal spillover for EB3. And I am worried that USCIS won't move FAD OR move it very conservatively . And with start of FY2022 , FAD retrogress for Eb2I/3I as SO visa's disappear. :(


@idliman --Thanks for explanation and Murthy law link.

Another Q - IF FAD is current , Can one apply for I-140 and send interfiling request with I-140 application? (OR have to wait for I-140 approval)







What makes you think this will happen i.e EB2 will reach May-2011 before EB-3?? Currently EB-3 is Apr-2010 and EB-2 is still in 2009.

https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/data/I140_by_class_country_FY09_19.pdf My go to report as there is no way one person can go back in time and get their I-140 approved. Based on it there are total of 15K EB2+ 7K EB3 (total-22k) approved I-140 in 2010 and 30K total (22k - EB2, 8K EB3) in 2011.

Rough behind the napkin number says there are 60K folks (22k * 2 from 2010 + 15K * 2 from 2011; subtract 14K for folks with both partner I-140 + folks who upgraded to EB1) ahead of you. Keep an tab how many total EB2 and EB3 GC approved for India category in given year.

As you might have read discussion in this page, EB2 and EB3 category differentiation is no longer valid after 10 yrs. Folks move and their new petition get changed. EB2 and EB3 will go hand in hand. Things are too far, don't get stressed abt stuff which you can't control.

[vedu]

Sure. You can go for H1B stamping in India with pending AOS. H1B is a dual intent visa and will not affect your AOS. If you don't believe me (you should always cross-check random internet advice), look at the questionnaire in Zhang & Co website (https://www.hooyou.com/h-1b/h1b_Work%20and%20Travel%20Issues%20Related%20to%20 I-485.html). It is well explained.

I am sorry that you got into 1 year paper AP mess. Next time use (c)(9)(P) and look at the EAD/AP renewal template. This has worked for most of us without any issues.

Once again, thank you for your advice! I am going to carefully consider all the things you have mentioned before my travel. Hopefully dates move faster in the next few visa bulletins and we all get our GCs soon, so that we don't have to worry about all these complicated issues while travelling to India.

[gc2021]

Welcome to this forum.

Is there a reason why you want to switch to EAD when you have a valid H1B status? H1B status has its own advantage (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2936-Transit-Visa-details-and-disscusion-for-travel-on-EAD-AP?p=69234&viewfull=1#post69234). Your employer will complete a I-9 and submit or if you use AP to reenter the country (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2927-EAD-AP-Renewal-Sample-format?p=69155&viewfull=1#post69155), you will automatically go to "AOS Pending" or "DA" status. I would recommend you to stay in H1B and later on when you travel you will automatically go to "DA" status.

For your spouse, it is a good idea to move to GC EAD instead of H4 EAD. H4 EAD is based on a rule that can be cancelled any time (DT admin tried to cancel it). GC EAD is based on a law and it cannot be cancelled that easily. Your spouse can stay on "AOS Pending" and you can stay on H1B. The beauty is there is no USCIS fee to renew EAD/AP with I485 pending. See details in EAD/AP thread (https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2927-EAD-AP-Renewal-Sample-format).

If you use EAD/AP, your wife will also move to "AOS Pending" status and will have to fill a new I-9. However, if she moves to "AOS Pending", you still stay with current status. Hope this helps.

Hi Idliman,

Thank you very much for explanation. I had a hard time with my current employer so was eagerly waiting for my EAD/AP and now it is approved so thought of changing employer. I know employer need to fill new I-9 with EAD details but where they need to submit this form ? I thought this is simply a compliancy form which every employer need to maintain in employees file for proof in case of any Audit. So trying to understand how USCIS will know whether you are using H1B or EAD if you are in the country(not used AP for travel) and H1B is still valid. Is employer sending I-9 form to USCIS and USCIS is maintaining this data ?

Thank you.

[gc2021]

To add more to it. As per as USCIS site regarding I-9 form :

Where to File
Do not file Form I-9 with USCIS or U.S. Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE). Employers must:

Have a completed Form I-9 on file for each person on their payroll who is required to complete the form;
Retain and store Forms I-9 for three years after the date of hire, or for one year after employment is terminated, whichever is later; and
Make their forms available for inspection if requested by authorized U.S. government officials from the Department of Homeland Security, Department of Labor, or Department of Justice.

[Zenzone]

To add more to it. As per as USCIS site regarding I-9 form :

Where to File
Do not file Form I-9 with USCIS or U.S. Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE). Employers must:

Have a completed Form I-9 on file for each person on their payroll who is required to complete the form;
Retain and store Forms I-9 for three years after the date of hire, or for one year after employment is terminated, whichever is later; and
Make their forms available for inspection if requested by authorized U.S. government officials from the Department of Homeland Security, Department of Labor, or Department of Justice.

Folks - Another update from my end. Received a separate receipt notice for Form I-485 J Supplement I filed along with my packet in October. Looks like USCIS indeed sends separate notice for that even when its filed for the first time along with a 485 form.

[kuku82]

Folks - Another update from my end. Received a separate receipt notice for Form I-485 J Supplement I filed along with my packet in October. Looks like USCIS indeed sends separate notice for that even when its filed for the first time along with a 485 form.

I got it too couple days back.

[idliman]

Hi Idliman,

Thank you very much for explanation. I had a hard time with my current employer so was eagerly waiting for my EAD/AP and now it is approved so thought of changing employer. I know employer need to fill new I-9 with EAD details but where they need to submit this form ? I thought this is simply a compliancy form which every employer need to maintain in employees file for proof in case of any Audit. So trying to understand how USCIS will know whether you are using H1B or EAD if you are in the country(not used AP for travel) and H1B is still valid. Is employer sending I-9 form to USCIS and USCIS is maintaining this data ?

Thank you.
Try googling for "E-Verify" and "I-9". There are hundreds of websites and videos that explain the whole process. They probably will do a better job than me trying to reinvent the wheel.

To verify the current status, you will use the I94 portal. This will give you your travel history for the last 5 years and also the recent status.
https://i94.cbp.dhs.gov/


There is no registration for I94 website. You enter your name, DOB and Passport number. Anyone and everyone can do it on the fly.
If your passport number had changed after the last travel, the system might return "No Record found for Traveler". Try old passport number that you had used for last travel.
If you have done a recent H1B renewal after last entry using AP, the I94 number remains the same. But for some reason the I94 portal has not updated the status and expiry date. So there is some mismatch between brother CBP & sister USCIS, even though they are from he same parent, DHS. Maybe they had a recent feud and they don't talk to each other. Their new dad (Mr. Alejandro Mayorkas) has to sort it out. Pun intended.

HTH.

[Zenzone]

Try googling for "E-Verify" and "I-9". There are hundreds of websites and videos that explain the whole process. They probably will do a better job than me trying to reinvent the wheel.

To verify the current status, you will use the I94 portal. This will give you your travel history for the last 5 years and also the recent status.
https://i94.cbp.dhs.gov/


There is no registration for I94 website. You enter your name, DOB and Passport number. Anyone and everyone can do it on the fly.
If your passport number had changed after the last travel, the system might return "No Record found for Traveler". Try old passport number that you had used for last travel.
If you have done a recent H1B renewal after last entry using AP, the I94 number remains the same. But for some reason the I94 portal has not updated the status and expiry date. So there is some mismatch between brother CBP & sister USCIS, even though they are from he same parent, DHS. Maybe they had a recent feud and they don't talk to each other. Their new dad (Mr. Alejandro Mayorkas) has to sort it out. Pun intended.

HTH.

You made me LOL with that last bullet mate! Good one.

[mcmilers]

Last night I received an email from USCIS regarding an RFE they have sent to me, I did receive RFE for medicals and Supp J in 2018.

[AceMan]

@Aceman - Buddy your frustration is USCIS is progressing slowly. Thats an agency problem, reason is whether lack of funding, political agenda or genuine surge of immigration in USA (legal, illegal both) is bringing to its knees. Keep in mind, apart from EB GC, they are responsible for ALL Visa category which is much much bigger workload. Agency needs overhaul in terms of rules and regulation but most imp in attitude. Maybe they are immigrant friendly but us (EB-I) don?t see it coz of sheer number of us waiting for GC.

I know one thing, if we all can apply to EB1 or EB5 GC and get it next month we will do it in blink of an eye. I firmly believe that all of active users whose dates are in mid-2011 will be greened by this year end or max 2022. If this doesn't happen, Spec will share data to show where those GC number are allotted.

I love to rub on the Eb2 I guys just for the fun of it. Back in 2009 I had my Masters and all the qualifications for Eb2 however the position required only 3 years experience with a degree. So I had to take Eb3, while lot of my contract coworkers even with a lower salary got in Eb2. Call it jealousy or whatever, but one of the guys rubbed me in the wrong way. He stated money does not make it. Eb2 is exceptional and like Royals, Eb3 is a commoner and a plebeian. They are classified along with unskilled in pure Haryanvi language :-).

Very funny and highly impactful!!!

Fast forward 5 years and couple of promotions later around 2015 end, I wanted to upgrade to Eb2 and started collecting the details for the same. At the same time I started following Trackitt and found out people were moving heavily from Eb3 to Eb2. That was the same time when filing date was introduced and the changed the bulletin to pull back filing date. Later in 2016 Eb2 got only about 7000 visas. Eb1 was growing in popularity. It was during the peak time of Eb1 abuse claims by Eb2 guys along with Eb1B candidates egging them. I did my detailed research and found that 90% of the Eb2 applicants had their credentials and back ground which should have really been in Eb3.

So it makes me happy to see ghar vapasi by these prodigal children!!!! And lot of them still think they are going back to Eb2. The same attitude shown by my then co worker.

The icing in the cake was my chance to remind my Eb2 co worker who had a November 2010 PD about his words. Both of us applied for AOS at around same time and both of us are still waiting for finger print.

I love to add another anecdote here, the solution to fix a water leak is not adding more water to the problem!!!

[bluelabel]

Hello Gurus,

Does USCIS verify old G325A with new ones we submit as a response to an I-485 RFE? When i filed my G325A in 2012, I had my address outside USA was in Bangalore and it's renamed as Bengaluru in 2014. Now i am filling it as Bengaluru, Does USCIS care this?

And Supplement J form is expired on 10/31/2020 and there's no new one available in USCIS website, can i submit an expired form?

[idliman]

Ace,

I tried to not get involved in the EB2 vs EB3 debate here. Back in 2012 time frame, I thought I am going to get GC soon in EB2. When some EB1C exceptionally skilled people (my friends who went to high school with me in India) got their GCs and rubbed on me about why I did MS'es & PhD, I got mad. Over time, I have got used to this abuse of the system along with the mafia conspiracy of immigration. I am at a workplace where any org change has to be kept in records for 40 years and submitted to the agencies. Imagine someone who comes and tells me to create a fake org chart for EB1C. My reaction is obviously, "Are you kidding me?".

This is a big system where multiple people are exploiting backlogged folks. The companies, lawyers and other services. So people are doing whatever they can to take whatever shortcuts they can. I can see why immigration reform never has a decent chance of passing. The whole world is benefiting because the Indians are backlogged. This will be very hard to get rid of. Even the DREAM legislation will be hard, but they have the vote-bank and younger kids protesting on the capitol footsteps and on the street. So they have a chance to pass without Citizenship. I have respect for the folks who try to be active and change this. As my part, I try to educate all the brethren and help them as much as I can.

For every few people who are honest and true, there are 10 times the folks who are from WITCH based or Desi consultancy companies who are used to being exploited and are just waiting for their turn to exploit someone else and get ahead. It is just the culture they are used to, just like the fake resumes prevalent in the IT industry. I would say, just lookout for your case and make intelligent decisions so that you have multiple paths to reach your immigration goals.

Peace.

[gc2021]

Try googling for "E-Verify" and "I-9". There are hundreds of websites and videos that explain the whole process. They probably will do a better job than me trying to reinvent the wheel.

To verify the current status, you will use the I94 portal. This will give you your travel history for the last 5 years and also the recent status.
https://i94.cbp.dhs.gov/


There is no registration for I94 website. You enter your name, DOB and Passport number. Anyone and everyone can do it on the fly.
If your passport number had changed after the last travel, the system might return "No Record found for Traveler". Try old passport number that you had used for last travel.
If you have done a recent H1B renewal after last entry using AP, the I94 number remains the same. But for some reason the I94 portal has not updated the status and expiry date. So there is some mismatch between brother CBP & sister USCIS, even though they are from he same parent, DHS. Maybe they had a recent feud and they don't talk to each other. Their new dad (Mr. Alejandro Mayorkas) has to sort it out. Pun intended.

HTH.
Thank you for above response. Just continuing this discussion so that it will be helpful for other who are in similar situation.
" E-Verify" is optional not all employers doing this but I-9 is compliance form and every employer needs to maintain employer visa/work authorization status for any audits. I know if you travel aboard and while returning to USA whatever document you produce (AP or H1 visa) based on that you will be on either H1 or Pending Adjustment status. But my question is if I have valid H1 and AP and I am not travelling out of country and employer not doing E-verify how USCIS will know our current working status unless they do audits and finds through I-9 form . I am not saying I will use both H1 and EAD but just checking to see how this system is verifying . Per instance while I am continuing with my employer on H1B as a fulltime role and at same time using ead for part time Job's.

[idliman]

Hello Gurus,
Does USCIS verify old G325A with new ones we submit as a response to an I-485 RFE? When i filed my G325A in 2012, I had my address outside USA was in Bangalore and it's renamed as Bengaluru in 2014. Now i am filling it as Bengaluru, Does USCIS care this?
And Supplement J form is expired on 10/31/2020 and there's no new one available in USCIS website, can i submit an expired form?
The intent of the G-325A is to collect biographic info for background checking. It is almost like a formality. Bangalore Vs Bengaluru will not make any difference in the context. So just complete it and don't worry about it. But, if you have any missing fields, you will get an RFE.

Use the latest form from USCIS website. Before submitting make sure that a new version of the form is not released. They should be some communication about this form, but I am not able to find it by googling on AILA.

[texas_]

Good Morning Gurus,

In the event of passing 180 days mark after filing I 485 application and loses Job but scheduled for interview around the same time frame, what happens?

Would USCIS rejects the I 485 application ?
Do I have any options?

Please guide
Many thanks in advance;
JP

[AceMan]

Ace,

I tried to not get involved in the EB2 vs EB3 debate here. Back in 2012 time frame, I thought I am going to get GC soon in EB2. When some EB1C exceptionally skilled people (my friends who went to high school with me in India) got their GCs and rubbed on me about why I did MS'es & PhD, I got mad. Over time, I have got used to this abuse of the system along with the mafia conspiracy of immigration. I am at a workplace where any org change has to be kept in records for 40 years and submitted to the agencies. Imagine someone who comes and tells me to create a fake org chart for EB1C. My reaction is obviously, "Are you kidding me?".

This is a big system where multiple people are exploiting backlogged folks. The companies, lawyers and other services. So people are doing whatever they can to take whatever shortcuts they can. I can see why immigration reform never has a decent chance of passing. The whole world is benefiting because the Indians are backlogged. This will be very hard to get rid of. Even the DREAM legislation will be hard, but they have the vote-bank and younger kids protesting on the capitol footsteps and on the street. So they have a chance to pass without Citizenship. I have respect for the folks who try to be active and change this. As my part, I try to educate all the brethren and help them as much as I can.

For every few people who are honest and true, there are 10 times the folks who are from WITCH based or Desi consultancy companies who are used to being exploited and are just waiting for their turn to exploit someone else and get ahead. It is just the culture they are used to, just like the fake resumes prevalent in the IT industry. I would say, just lookout for your case and make intelligent decisions so that you have multiple paths to reach your immigration goals.

Peace.

No offense taken. The most important point is lot of people think, I am looking out for my case is the reason for my dislike for EB2 to Eb3 downgrades. I had the common sense in 2015 to understand the numbers and not upgrade to EB2. Yes, people continually jumping from one basket to another like headless chicken is not going to help. To make matters worse, they can't even comprehend the fact that the spillover is coming to Eb2.

People with EB2 made their cake, so I continue to remind them to eat it. Nothing malicious about it !!!

[idliman]

Good Morning Gurus,

In the event of passing 180 days mark after filing I 485 application and loses Job but scheduled for interview around the same time frame, what happens?

Would USCIS rejects the I 485 application ?
Do I have any options?

Please guide
Many thanks in advance;
JP
In that case, you have to invoke AC21. You have to find a job position with another employer, and this new job position is "same or similar" to the position from your previous I-140. Any RFE from USCIS will have almost 2-3 months time-frame for response.

The good news for you is that USCIS is "waiving" the in-person interview requirement for EB immigrants, using only written evidence to approve the applicant for U.S. residence (a green card). Read this article (https://www.visalawyerblog.com/covid-19-update-are-green-card-interviews-being-waived/). In that case you will get GC in mail without any worries.

If anyone is facing a layoff scenario after 180 days, I would advise them to proactively file I-485 J, so that a RFE is triggered for I-693 and other docs. In 3 months time or so, your file will be complete with valid medical and ready to be approved.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Good Morning Gurus,

In the event of passing 180 days mark after filing I 485 application and loses Job but scheduled for interview around the same time frame, what happens?

Would USCIS rejects the I 485 application ?
Do I have any options?

Please guide
Many thanks in advance;
JP

After 180 days, there is no pressure. Just try to get a job in the same classification as the original job for which the GC was applied. The new employer will have to submit Supp J., and you will be good to go and get your GC if the final action dates are current and your medicals/fingerprints are current.

[texas_]

Thanks Idlliman as always..

However, I filed my green card application only in October 2020 with a PD of October 2010 for EB3 category
Do USCIS still waiving Interviews for all the EB even if you filed your application after March 2017?


Should getting a layoff after 180 days and not finding job when my PD is current then what happens?
Just a hypothetical situation

Thanks in advance;
JP

[immieb2i]

Hi Gurus, I need your help.

I received the interview request online case status. I am bit concerned because I filed i485 in 2012. The interview for employment based started in March 2017 onwards application.

Could you please help, why I am getting interview? Bit worried on this. Don't have any offence, or criminal activity.

My priority date in March 2010 EB2I
Field 485 in 2012.
Changed employer in 2017 May.
Field i485J: 2017 June
i485J was showing the status still in pending in online status till Nov'2020.
Contacted my company lawyer and they contacted USCIS in Jan 2021.

[immieb2i]

Hi Gurus, Needs your help.


I received the interview request online case status. I am bit concerned because I filed i485 in 2012. The interview for employment based started in March 2017 onwards application.

Could you please help, why I am getting interview? Bit worried on this, don't have any criminal record.

My priority date in March 2010 EB2I
Field 485 in 2012.
Changed employer in 2017 May.
Field i485J: 2017 June
i485J was showing the status still in pending in online status till Nov'2020.
Contacted my company lawyer and they contacted USCIS in Jan 2021.

[vsivarama]

Thanks Idlliman as always..

However, I filed my green card application only in October 2020 with a PD of October 2010 for EB3 category
Do USCIS still waiving Interviews for all the EB even if you filed your application after March 2017?


Should getting a layoff after 180 days and not finding job when my PD is current then what happens?
Just a hypothetical situation

Thanks in advance;
JP

If your file is complete and USCIS does not have any RFEs for you then you get your GC. RFE's like medicals you should be fine as well. It's 485J RFE that you need to worry about. If you are unable to find a job in time to respond to the RFE your case may be in jeopardy. But these are one off scenarios and hoping none of us have to go through it.

[texas_]

Thanks Visva, Turbulent, Idlliman and all experts

That means I 485 filing and passing 180 days is way better situation compare to one in H1B Status.

Thanks again guys and Qesehmk community

[smuggymba]

Last night I received an email from USCIS regarding an RFE they have sent to me, I did receive RFE for medicals and Supp J in 2018.

hopefully Texas Service Center catches up soon. I'm March 2010 EB2 /TSC?

[Moveon]

Thanks Visva, Turbulent, Idlliman and all experts

That means I 485 filing and passing 180 days is way better situation compare to one in H1B Status.

Thanks again guys and Qesehmk community

Yes , having the EAD is like a Semi GC. Because the EAD was meant to be a stop Gap of 2-4 months between filing of AOS and getting the GC, its not defined as to how they can treat you if you are our of a job on EAD. So you get the benefit of doubt . As Mentioned previously the only time you can get into trouble is when you get an RFE for supplement J and you are out of a job . Getting Sup-J is rare unless your date is close or been a while since the last one was issued (5-6 years). The advantage of EAD is there is no transfer of any sort and employers are more willing to hire you as you are not considered as an HIB candidate . HIB is time/money consuming for many employers and when premium processing is not available it takes 3-4 months for a transfer . You can join the day the offer is extended (provided background checks are fine) with EAD.

EAD is quite close to a GC as long you are OK to work in the same area of the one in your petition .

[texas_]

Thanks Moveon ... and all the experts

EAD based on Pending I-485 is like a boon for the folks waiting for GC in line, it appears.

Since my supplement J was signed in October 2020 and my PD is not far either (October 2010) there should not be a problem, I guess.
I was just thinking worst possible scenario but it appears that GC is for future employment and signing supplement J should not be an issue for the current employer as it is for future employment when RFE comes and beneficiary loses employment

Awesome guys thanks yet again to all the knowledgeful peeps on Qesehmk...
Best Regards
JP

[AceMan]

Thanks Moveon ... and all the experts

EAD based on Pending I-485 is like a boon for the folks waiting for GC in line, it appears.

Since my supplement J was signed in October 2020 and my PD is not far either (October 2010) there should not be a problem, I guess.
I was just thinking worst possible scenario but it appears that GC is for future employment and signing supplement J should not be an issue for the current employer as it is for future employment when RFE comes and beneficiary loses employment

Awesome guys thanks yet again to all the knowledgeful peeps on Qesehmk...
Best Regards
JP

And with an AP COMBO EAD card you can avoid travelling to embassies for stamping internationally.

[texas_]

I agree 100% Ace, going to embassies and have it stamped is not a good experience.
Last I visited India was a decade ago, since my parents are also in US on GC as my brother sponsored them.

[monsieur]

@Aceman, @idilliman I agree with your sentiments. I try to *ignore* folks who argue with me about EB1 vs EB2 vs EB3 argument. They don't know a shit abt immigration rule, these folks are like parrot who are repeating buzzwords just coz they heard it from their Lawyers (who I say a biggest culprit).

These guys are in situation where they can file for EB1/EB2 just because they worked outside of US for 1-2 yrs, lawyers will present them as Functional Mgr and file for EB1/2. Lawyers wants their shop to run so they will push envelope and get you GC faster. Just like CPA will tell you to take deduction even when its not allowed to get you bigger refund. EB1/2/3 will not make a person smarter, its just that they had lawyer who will represent them as EB1/2 (ahem just like whats going on in senate, Lawyer representing twisted case when we all saw what happened on Jan 6th on Live TV)

My college saying - Jab kismat hai gandu, to kya karega Pandu. I will wait for my GC and once it comes (sooner or later) will sit in my Bank Locker while I go to work in morning.

[rocketfast]

Did not see anyone post USCIS annual report for 2020.

https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/reports/2020-USCIS-Statistical-Annual-Report.pdf

Appendix A has summary of last year. In this report, USCIS claims that it approved 128,000 employment GCs last year. You add another 15,000 consular processing, you will see that USCIS wasted around 13,000 GCs.

[may2011]

Thats a lot of wastage!

[qesehmk]

Did not see anyone post USCIS annual report for 2020.

https://www.uscis.gov/sites/default/files/document/reports/2020-USCIS-Statistical-Annual-Report.pdf

Appendix A has summary of last year. In this report, USCIS claims that it approved 128,000 employment GCs last year. You add another 15,000 consular processing, you will see that USCIS wasted around 13,000 GCs.

If they couldn't allocate then those visas by law should have gone to FB - just like unused FB visas came to EB.

You may want to check if FB received any EB spillover, if so then your theory is correct. Also 15K CP sounds too low. I am sure it usually is 22K. But given COVID I don't want to predict how CP visas behaved.

[may2011]

Hello All,

I am new to this forum.My PD is May2011( EB2-India).I would like to thank every single one of the gurus here!Your posts and analyses really helped me understand the entire process of GC allocation.I even signed up for 'whereismygc'.

Prior to the spillover I had given up the hopes of getting a GC in my lifetime.I had almost made the decision to move to Canada for the sake of stability and the ease of traveling to India without worrying about visas.But the spillover and the predictions as per 'whereismygc' website have rekindled my hope again.I am confused about what I should do. I have applied for EAD/AP, but from what I read ,a GC can still be ages away if there is visa wastage or other issues. I would really appreciate some advice on pointers on my concerns;

1) Can my i485 be rejected due to errors in filing.In Oct 2020,my employer filed for 1000s of AOS applications.I am concerned about clerical errors on the lawyers parts due to sheer volume of applications.Does a rejection mean I lose my place in the GC line?

2)The flurry of executive orders wrt to H1Bs like wage levels etc have exposed the transient state of a temporary visa status in US.From a legal standpoint, can policy changes affect GC applications?The previous administration introduced the 'Public Charge Rule'.Most H1Bs should not be affected by it.But I am wary about what future conservative administrations can do.So I am concerned about continuing to stay in US on EAD or H1B.

3)Am I being overly paranoid or are my concerns valid?

4)In order to maintain my Canadian PR ,I have to move till Jan 2023.My current plan is to observe the PD movement till Dec2021 and then make a decision.Should I wait for the birds in a bush or pursue a bird in hand?

Sorry for my rant! Just confused

[may2011]

Hello All,

I am new to this forum.My PD is May2011( EB2-India).I would like to thank every single one of the gurus here!Your posts and analyses really helped me understand the entire process of GC allocation.I even signed up for 'whereismygc'.

Prior to the spillover I had given up the hopes of getting a GC in my lifetime.I had almost made the decision to move to Canada for the sake of stability and the ease of traveling to India without worrying about visas.But the spillover and the predictions as per 'whereismygc' website have rekindled my hope again.I am confused about what I should do. I have applied for EAD/AP, but from what I read ,a GC can still be ages away if there is visa wastage or other issues. I would really appreciate some advice on pointers on my concerns;

1) Can my i485 be rejected due to errors in filing.In Oct 2020,my employer filed for 1000s of AOS applications.I am concerned about clerical errors on the lawyers parts due to sheer volume of applications.Does a rejection mean I lose my place in the GC line?

2)The flurry of executive orders wrt to H1Bs like wage levels etc have exposed the transient state of a temporary visa status in US.From a legal standpoint, can policy changes affect GC applications?The previous administration introduced the 'Public Charge Rule'.Most H1Bs should not be affected by it.But I am wary about what future conservative administrations can do.So I am concerned about continuing to stay in US on EAD or H1B.

3)Am I being overly paranoid or are my concerns valid?

4)In order to maintain my Canadian PR ,I have to move till Jan 2023.My current plan is to observe the PD movement till Dec2021 and then make a decision.Should I wait for the birds in a bush or pursue a bird in hand?

Sorry for my rant! Just confused

[rocketfast]

If they couldn't allocate then those visas by law should have gone to FB - just like unused FB visas came to EB.

You may want to check if FB received any EB spillover, if so then your theory is correct. Also 15K CP sounds too low. I am sure it usually is 22K. But given COVID I don't want to predict how CP visas behaved.

FB allocation cannot exceed 226,000 with such small spillovers from EB.
See: https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/1217-EB2-3-Predictions-(Rather-Calculations)?p=64819&viewfull=1#post64819

Consular processing last year is indeed 15k.
See: https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2679-Consular-Processing-Data-Published-by-DOS-From-March-2017-Onwards?p=67475&viewfull=1#post67475

[qesehmk]

Hmm thanks. Looks like it's not the size of spillover, it's really IR category that is ballooning every year. So FB will realistically be 226K forever.

Regarding the 2020 CP number - thanks again. I assume the number is true and if so - what a shame for USCIS to have wasted so many visas when there are ample Desi folks waiting for decades.
FB allocation cannot exceed 226,000 with such small spillovers from EB.
See: https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/1217-EB2-3-Predictions-(Rather-Calculations)?p=64819&viewfull=1#post64819

Consular processing last year is indeed 15k.
See: https://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php/2679-Consular-Processing-Data-Published-by-DOS-From-March-2017-Onwards?p=67475&viewfull=1#post67475

[may2011]

Hello All,

I am new to this forum.First and foremost I would like all the gurus and pandits for your posts and analyses. They have really helped me understand the process of GC allocation.

I apologize for the long rant, but I would really appreciate some advice and suggestions.My PD is May 2011 (EB2-India)

Prior to Oct 2020, I had given up on getting a GC in my lifetime. I had made up my mind to move to Canada mainly for stability and the ease of travel to India.The spillover and the prediction by 'whereismygc' have rekindled some hope in me .I am mainly concerned about the following issues;

1) If my i485 is rejected due to clerical errors in the form, do I lose my line in the GC queue?In Oct 2020, my employer filed for 1000s of AOS and I am concerned about filing errors by the law firm due to sheer volume of applications.

2)Can an administration introduce more requirements for conversion from EAD to GC?The previous administration introduced the 'Public Charge Rule'.Most H1Bs won't be affected by it, but still I am wary about a future rule by a conservative administration.Basically I am worried about being on EAD for 5+ years and then being denied.

3)Am I being paranoid or are my concerns valid?I really don't understand what to do.Should I go for the bird in hand (Canadian PR) or pursue the two bird in the bush?I have to move to Canada by Jan 2023 to maintain my PR.

[Zenzone]

Hello All,

I am new to this forum.First and foremost I would like all the gurus and pandits for your posts and analyses. They have really helped me understand the process of GC allocation.

I apologize for the long rant, but I would really appreciate some advice and suggestions.My PD is May 2011 (EB2-India)

Prior to Oct 2020, I had given up on getting a GC in my lifetime. I had made up my mind to move to Canada mainly for stability and the ease of travel to India.The spillover and the prediction by 'whereismygc' have rekindled some hope in me .I am mainly concerned about the following issues;

1) If my i485 is rejected due to clerical errors in the form, do I lose my line in the GC queue?In Oct 2020, my employer filed for 1000s of AOS and I am concerned about filing errors by the law firm due to sheer volume of applications.

2)Can an administration introduce more requirements for conversion from EAD to GC?The previous administration introduced the 'Public Charge Rule'.Most H1Bs won't be affected by it, but still I am wary about a future rule by a conservative administration.Basically I am worried about being on EAD for 5+ years and then being denied.

3)Am I being paranoid or are my concerns valid?I really don't understand what to do.Should I go for the bird in hand (Canadian PR) or pursue the two bird in the bush?I have to move to Canada by Jan 2023 to maintain my PR.

I can say that you safely have two shots at your GC between this fiscal and the next one (due to continuing prospects of FB SO this year too). I would wait until atleast Sep 2022 if I were you considering all else being equal. Once you get your EAD/AP, you are at least 50% better off as your dependency on a non-immigrant visa is technically removed from the equation. For example, remember just by filing the I-485 you don't accrue unlawful presence if you lose your job and after 180 days you get the portability advantage too (see idliman's great summary above for more specifics). Answer to your first question - You don't lose your line in GC as you can re-apply correcting clerical errors (if any) as long as the underlying I-140 is intact. Lastly, I don't think anyone can predict and plan a scenario with future conservative admin etc. All we know is that the present admin. is definitely a positive development compared to the last one, therefore, next 4 years should be relatively calmer is a pragmatic expectation. Hope this helps.

[monsieur]

1) If my i485 is rejected due to clerical errors in the form, do I lose my line in the GC queue?In Oct 2020, my employer filed for 1000s of AOS and I am concerned about filing errors by the law firm due to sheer volume of applications.

Visa get denied, if some error you will get RFE to fix any issue or additional detail.



2)Can an administration introduce more requirements for conversion from EAD to GC?The previous administration introduced the 'Public Charge Rule'.Most H1Bs won't be affected by it, but still I am wary about a future rule by a conservative administration.Basically I am worried about being on EAD for 5+ years and then being denied.

There is always a chance fo rule changes for every aspect of life; you shouldn't be fearful of those. If needed be ready to reach out to Senator / Congressmen / Advocacy grp when adverse bill is on docket. Worst case Judicial branch will step in, just like what happened to DACA.




3)Am I being paranoid or are my concerns valid?I really don't understand what to do.Should I go for the bird in hand (Canadian PR) or pursue the two bird in the bush?I have to move to Canada by Jan 2023 to maintain my PR.

This is something you have to decide. I have spent 18+ years on Visa; moved jobs ,purchased cars, houses, Traveled when I liked. I didn't compromised on my way of living just because I didn't have piece of paper saying I am LPR of US. If moving to Canada gives you piece of mind then do it. Your health and piece of mind is much much imp than LPR of US.

PS: No I never thought of having PR of Canada or Other countries. I will stay in US till job is good, willing to move to any part of world if I get good opportunity and my piece of mind.

[may2011]

Thank you for your prompt reply.Waiting till Sep 2022 seems pragmatic. I think I will end up doing that.

Good to know that I won't lose my line incase of clerical errors.phew!

About the spillover for 2022, won't the spillover only happen if there are closures till Sept 2021?If there are closures till March 2021, won't those numbers will be utilized due by FB applicants waiting since 2020?Just trying to understand how the numbers are utilized.

[may2011]

I can say that you safely have two shots at your GC between this fiscal and the next one (due to continuing prospects of FB SO this year too). I would wait until atleast Sep 2022 if I were you considering all else being equal. Once you get your EAD/AP, you are at least 50% better off as your dependency on a non-immigrant visa is technically removed from the equation. For example, remember just by filing the I-485 you don't accrue unlawful presence if you lose your job and after 180 days you get the portability advantage too (see idliman's great summary above for more specifics). Answer to your first question - You don't lose your line in GC as you can re-apply correcting clerical errors (if any) as long as the underlying I-140 is intact. Lastly, I don't think anyone can predict and plan a scenario with future conservative admin etc. All we know is that the present admin. is definitely a positive development compared to the last one, therefore, next 4 years should be relatively calmer is a pragmatic expectation. Hope this helps.


Thank you for your prompt reply.Waiting till Sep 2022 seems pragmatic. I think I will end up doing that.

Good to know that I won't lose my line incase of clerical errors.phew!

About the spillover for 2022, won't the spillover only happen if there are closures till Sept 2021?If there are closures till March 2021, won't those numbers will be utilized due by FB applicants waiting since 2020?Just trying to understand how the numbers are utilized.

[may2011]

Visa get denied, if some error you will get RFE to fix any issue or additional detail.


Visa denied,Does that mean I can't reapply?

There is always a chance fo rule changes for every aspect of life; you shouldn't be fearful of those. If needed be ready to reach out to Senator / Congressmen / Advocacy grp when adverse bill is on docket. Worst case Judicial branch will step in, just like what happened to DACA.




This is something you have to decide. I have spent 18+ years on Visa; moved jobs ,purchased cars, houses, Traveled when I liked. I didn't compromised on my way of living just because I didn't have piece of paper saying I am LPR of US. If moving to Canada gives you piece of mind then do it. Your health and piece of mind is much much imp than LPR of US.

PS: No I never thought of having PR of Canada or Other countries. I will stay in US till job is good, willing to move to any part of world if I get good opportunity and my piece of mind.

Thanks for sharing your perspective

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Thank you for your prompt reply.Waiting till Sep 2022 seems pragmatic. I think I will end up doing that.

Good to know that I won't lose my line incase of clerical errors.phew!

About the spillover for 2022, won't the spillover only happen if there are closures till Sept 2021?If there are closures till March 2021, won't those numbers will be utilized due by FB applicants waiting since 2020?Just trying to understand how the numbers are utilized.

If the primary I-485 is rejected say after 2-3 months like what's happening right now, can it really be resubmitted when the Filing Dates are no longer being accepted?

[qesehmk]

Hello All,

I am new to this forum.First and foremost I would like all the gurus and pandits for your posts and analyses. They have really helped me understand the process of GC allocation.

I apologize for the long rant, but I would really appreciate some advice and suggestions.My PD is May 2011 (EB2-India)

Prior to Oct 2020, I had given up on getting a GC in my lifetime. I had made up my mind to move to Canada mainly for stability and the ease of travel to India.The spillover and the prediction by 'whereismygc' have rekindled some hope in me .I am mainly concerned about the following issues;

1) If my i485 is rejected due to clerical errors in the form, do I lose my line in the GC queue?In Oct 2020, my employer filed for 1000s of AOS and I am concerned about filing errors by the law firm due to sheer volume of applications.

2)Can an administration introduce more requirements for conversion from EAD to GC?The previous administration introduced the 'Public Charge Rule'.Most H1Bs won't be affected by it, but still I am wary about a future rule by a conservative administration.Basically I am worried about being on EAD for 5+ years and then being denied.

3)Am I being paranoid or are my concerns valid?I really don't understand what to do.Should I go for the bird in hand (Canadian PR) or pursue the two bird in the bush?I have to move to Canada by Jan 2023 to maintain my PR.

Welcome to forum. EAD to GC as in adj of status to GC is never a problem .. the only requirement is for your latest employer to fill out 485J. Your second concern is about public charge rule or similar things ... I think with Biden admin your should not worry about anything NEW that is against immigrants.

I do however want to caution you regarding your canadian PR. Do not leave US. Because if you try to come back on AP and while holding canadian PR then US immigration has in the past refused entry to people who applied and obtained canadian PR. Just google and read their experiences.

Nothing to overly worry about. But just wanted you to be aware of this.

[vsivarama]

If the primary I-485 is rejected say after 2-3 months like what's happening right now, can it really be resubmitted when the Filing Dates are no longer being accepted?

If it's a USCIS error, it can of course be filed even if Filing Dates are no longer accepted. Others may also want to consider litigation (not sure of the timeline it takes to get the decision), saying if the applications were rejected in a timely manner, the applicants could always have refiled their petition as the filing dates were accepted for 2-3 months based on their PD.

[may2011]

Welcome to forum. EAD to GC as in adj of status to GC is never a problem .. the only requirement is for your latest employer to fill out 485J. Your second concern is about public charge rule or similar things ... I think with Biden admin your should not worry about anything NEW that is against immigrants.

I do however want to caution you regarding your canadian PR. Do not leave US. Because if you try to come back on AP and while holding canadian PR then US immigration has in the past refused entry to people who applied and obtained canadian PR. Just google and read their experiences.

Nothing to overly worry about. But just wanted you to be aware of this.

Thanks for letting me know.I will check their experiences.

[H1b2006]

there are many folks in 2010/2011 went back to India, loosing hope of GC. they dont have latest w2's for last 2-3 yrs which they ask for GC interview or paystubs and might even changed employers WITCH to non WITCH and old H1Bs expired.

do these guys have a chance if thier old employers are not taking them back, find new emp and apply for H1b extension with new employer file perm,i140 and then file I485 J.

[inspired_p]

I love to rub on the Eb2 I guys just for the fun of it. Back in 2009 I had my Masters and all the qualifications for Eb2 however the position required only 3 years experience with a degree. So I had to take Eb3, while lot of my contract coworkers even with a lower salary got in Eb2. Call it jealousy or whatever, but one of the guys rubbed me in the wrong way. He stated money does not make it. Eb2 is exceptional and like Royals, Eb3 is a commoner and a plebeian. They are classified along with unskilled in pure Haryanvi language :-).

Very funny and highly impactful!!!

Fast forward 5 years and couple of promotions later around 2015 end, I wanted to upgrade to Eb2 and started collecting the details for the same. At the same time I started following Trackitt and found out people were moving heavily from Eb3 to Eb2. That was the same time when filing date was introduced and the changed the bulletin to pull back filing date. Later in 2016 Eb2 got only about 7000 visas. Eb1 was growing in popularity. It was during the peak time of Eb1 abuse claims by Eb2 guys along with Eb1B candidates egging them. I did my detailed research and found that 90% of the Eb2 applicants had their credentials and back ground which should have really been in Eb3.

So it makes me happy to see ghar vapasi by these prodigal children!!!! And lot of them still think they are going back to Eb2. The same attitude shown by my then co worker.

The icing in the cake was my chance to remind my Eb2 co worker who had a November 2010 PD about his words. Both of us applied for AOS at around same time and both of us are still waiting for finger print.

I love to add another anecdote here, the solution to fix a water leak is not adding more water to the problem!!!
I feel you on your frustration, and believe me , the frustration is not very unique to you. But statistics of 90% EB2 actually being EB3 is far fetched.
Anyways, I should have just let you vent out by your frustrations, instead of trying to argue on any points.

[inspired_p]

there are many folks in 2010/2011 went back to India, loosing hope of GC. they dont have latest w2's for last 2-3 yrs which they ask for GC interview or paystubs and might even changed employers WITCH to non WITCH and old H1Bs expired.

do these guys have a chance if thier old employers are not taking them back, find new emp and apply for H1b extension with new employer file perm,i140 and then file I485 J.

Question : what's a WITCH employer?

[H1b2006]

Indian Desi companies- Wipro/Infy/TCS/Cognizant/HCL

[inspired_p]

Indian Desi companies- Wipro/Infy/TCS/Cognizant/HCL

okay. Thank you for the clarification :)

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

If it's a USCIS error, it can of course be filed even if Filing Dates are no longer accepted. Others may also want to consider litigation (not sure of the timeline it takes to get the decision), saying if the applications were rejected in a timely manner, the applicants could always have refiled their petition as the filing dates were accepted for 2-3 months based on their PD.

So if it?s a user error like wrong filing fees or form or missing signature, are they out of luck until the FAD or DF becomes current again? I have a couple of acquaintances who are now in that situation having filed en masse with Fragomen and other firms.

[vsivarama]

So if it?s a user error like wrong filing fees or form or missing signature, are they out of luck until the FAD or DF becomes current again? I have a couple of acquaintances who are now in that situation having filed en masse with Fragomen and other firms.

Yes, litigation would be the only option for them and the decision could go either way. However I find it hard to believe the law firms would send a wrong filing fee as they are pretty standard. They ought to do better than that. It could also be a USCIS error, as usually the people who accept/scan and generate receipts for the applications are basic level employees like first level of support (sometimes newbies) who may not be well trained.

[vedu]

PS: No I never thought of having PR of Canada or Other countries. I will stay in US till job is good, willing to move to any part of world if I get good opportunity and my piece of mind.

Monsieur, after 18+ years of work in US, we shouldn't be willing to move to any part of world for another job opportunity. We should have saved/invested enough to have a couple of million dollars in bank and be willing to retire peacefully in India. That's the ultimate revenge!

[qesehmk]

Thanks for letting me know.I will check their experiences.
And as per your line in immigration queue, you never lose that. That is cemented. If there is error - just fix it.

Even if this GC application is completely withdrawn and a brand new is filed - your line in queue remains intact because it is based on your PERM approval (or 140 filing date in case of EB1).

[may2011]

And as per your line in immigration queue, you never lose that. That is cemented. If there is error - just fix it.

Even if this GC application is completely withdrawn and a brand new is filed - your line in queue remains intact because it is based on your PERM approval (or 140 filing date in case of EB1).

Thanks a lot for the clarification! It's a relief to know that I won't lose my place in the GC line.

[qesehmk]

Thanks a lot for the clarification! It's a relief to know that I won't lose my place in the GC line.
No worries. Spread the joy -- help others when opportunity presents!

[sstest]

Quick update for those who are still waiting for their receipt notice.

My packet was delivered to Lewisville, Texas on 29th October. I finally received 485, EAD and AP notice for myself and my spouse yesterday, after 3.5 months from filing. Notices came from NSC though.

P.D.: 12th July 2011, EB2. Downgrading to EB3.

One issue observed was that the PD marked on 485 notice was 17th July 2011 instead of 12th July 2011. Did anyone else notice a similar issue before? And the course of action to remedy this? Could this potentially cause any issues with processing?

[gc2021]

No worries. Spread the joy -- help others when opportunity presents!

Hello Guru's

I am seeing weird online case status update for my I-765 and 485 applications . My I-765 and I-131 were approved today afternoon. Around 7pm My i-765 CASE changed back to "Finger prints were Applied " message with case update date as 2/11 .
I-131 still shows approved. Also I see my 485 case was also showing updated on 2/11 . why it showing tomorrow's date? why my I-765 changed from approved status finger print status? Anybody faced this kind of issue?

[raradhya]

@gc2021,

what is your PD? and receipt date for your application.
the date issue could be due to the GMT timezone used in their system to update.

when did you last gave your fingerprint or traveled out of country?

[AceMan]

I feel you on your frustration, and believe me , the frustration is not very unique to you. But statistics of 90% EB2 actually being EB3 is far fetched.
Anyways, I should have just let you vent out by your frustrations, instead of trying to argue on any points.

Dude, I think you have completely missed the point. If it was my frustration I would have let it known in October/November 2020 when the downgrades were happening.

Right now we are waiting for March bulletin and I am telling people how the downgrades and mindless upgrades have screwed the people.

Another user claimed Eb2 would have been at 2011 and Eb3 at 2007 if people stayed in the queue.

I am repeating more than 90% of the people in EB2 from 2010 should have filed in EB3 in the first place including the people who downgraded now. They are good for 5K and 10 K. No where in the world a person runs 10K and awarded 5 K completion. That would have made Eb2 already with 2014-15 date and EB3 around 2009. Once the Eb2 dates passed his Eb3 PD he could have upgraded based on his skill and qualification for the job and run the additional 5K.

In future if people only apply in Eb3, this can help. I could see 80,000 applicants already from 2018 to 2020 with Eb2 140 when we already know there was more than 220 K 140 applicants.

[gc2021]

@gc2021,

what is your PD? and receipt date for your application.
the date issue could be due to the GMT timezone used in their system to update.

when did you last gave your fingerprint or traveled out of country?

My PD is Feb 2011 EB2 . Filed in Oct 2020 and done with finger prints in 1st week of December. As of today also still I-765 status showing Finger Prints taken and I-131 is approved status. But in I-765 case history still it's showing on Feb 9th "New card is being produced" and Feb 10th " Application is approved" messages . So am I going to receive combo card or Just AP ? Did anyone heard this kind of issue before?

[Zenzone]

Thank you for your prompt reply.Waiting till Sep 2022 seems pragmatic. I think I will end up doing that.

Good to know that I won't lose my line incase of clerical errors.phew!

About the spillover for 2022, won't the spillover only happen if there are closures till Sept 2021?If there are closures till March 2021, won't those numbers will be utilized due by FB applicants waiting since 2020?Just trying to understand how the numbers are utilized.

With vast majority of FB applicants coming in through CP, even (if) when consulates world wide open and start processing these applications, its extremely unlikely all those unused numbers for this fiscal will be used and hence expecting a good SO next year into EB is a pretty reasonable assumption according to me.

[vsivarama]

I am repeating more than 90% of the people in EB2 from 2010 should have filed in EB3 in the first place including the people who downgraded now. They are good for 5K and 10 K. No where in the world a person runs 10K and awarded 5 K completion. That would have made Eb2 already with 2014-15 date and EB3 around 2009. Once the Eb2 dates passed his Eb3 PD he could have upgraded based on his skill and qualification for the job and run the additional 5K.


Looks like you are trying your hardest to twist my example and not make sense of it. :D. Anyways that's besides the point. I believe people are smart enough to make their own decisions. They may think differently than you, but that does not make them mindless/headless chickens. I have a few friends with PD in late 2014. You know the reason they downgraded? To get EADs and be off H1. We all know how immigration friendly H1 policies were being put forward last year. They wanted to avoid the uncertainty of H1 and have some semblance of control in their lives (even with job changes). Their logic was simple rather than wait for GC on H1 it's better to wait on EAD. I don't see any mindless downgrades there. I partly downgraded because of this and one other reason. I will share my other reason if it turns out to be true as that's purely my opinion based on anecdotal evidence. I do not want to pass it off as a stat in this forum. Didn't we all want to migrate to this country because of the freedom it provides? In a free country people should be allowed to do what's in their best interest.

[Pundit Arjun]

vsivarama,

Nicely put.
I like and agree with your statement : "I believe people are smart enough to make their own decisions. They may think differently than you, but that does not make them"... better or stupid or evil or good.
Everyone has their own reasons and none of us have the right to judge others [Coz we will be wrong...].

Heres to hoping for a positive movement and approval for all [per the rules].

Stay Well and Stay Happy :)

[AceMan]

Looks like you are trying your hardest to twist my example and not make sense of it. :D. Anyways that's besides the point. I believe people are smart enough to make their own decisions. They may think differently than you, but that does not make them mindless/headless chickens. I have a few friends with PD in late 2014. You know the reason they downgraded? To get EADs and be off H1. We all know how immigration friendly H1 policies were being put forward last year. They wanted to avoid the uncertainty of H1 and have some semblance of control in their lives (even with job changes). Their logic was simple rather than wait for GC on H1 it's better to wait on EAD. I don't see any mindless downgrades there. I partly downgraded because of this and one other reason. I will share my other reason if it turns out to be true as that's purely my opinion based on anecdotal evidence. I do not want to pass it off as a stat in this forum. Didn't we all want to migrate to this country because of the freedom it provides? In a free country people should be allowed to do what's in their best interest.

We are discussing the possibilities my friend. You did the downgrade to EB2 with best interests in mind, in the same way many people till 12/2014 in EB2. The headless chickens are the ones (30,520 in 2018, 28,352 in 2019) in Eb2 I from 2018 till March 2020 after seeing more than 200,000 - 140 applicants already waiting in EB2.

I am saying come this October 2021, the same guys are going to jump back to EB2 I queue stating they had amended the petition when it should have been new.. we all know the drill.

Free choices, since we are all anecdotal, analogy experts, till the bodyline series in 1933-34 you can bowl any number of bouncers and any number of fielders on the leg side of a batsman. All it took is a captain like Jardine and a bowler like Larwood to get the rule changed. :-D

When your choice of best self interest involves adding a new application to the detriment of another applicant that has to be pointed out.

So if it has to be, join both Eb2 and 3 instead of letting people jump from one line to another!!!

[InbaMayam]

Hello Gurus and everyone , appreciate all of your valuable posts.

I am reposting due to initial approval for newcomer and went past date :)


I am eb3-I and my priority date is current since Jan2021 and my 485 is not approved yet, so far no status change after interview was completed in 2019. 485 was applied in Jan2019 , didn't use attorney's help. I am having EAD renewed until mid of 2022. My contract is ending with client in Feb 2021. My client and my current employer (485 sponsor) agreed to the full time employment conversion with client.
I have not changed jobs and currently working on h1 with my 485 sponsor last 15 years. I am planning to use EAD to join my client as full time and joining date would be March 1st.

If my 485 is approved before March 1st, then is it ok to use the GC and join my client, without making an I-9 entry of GC with my 485 sponsor.
Any valuable suggestions please. Sincere Thanks.

[idliman]

Hello Gurus and everyone , appreciate all of your valuable posts.

I am reposting due to initial approval for newcomer and went past date :)


I am eb3-I and my priority date is current since Jan2021 and my 485 is not approved yet, so far no status change after interview was completed in 2019. 485 was applied in Jan2019 , didn't use attorney's help. I am having EAD renewed until mid of 2022. My contract is ending with client in Feb 2021. My client and my current employer (485 sponsor) agreed to the full time employment conversion with client.
I have not changed jobs and currently working on h1 with my 485 sponsor last 15 years. I am planning to use EAD to join my client as full time and joining date would be March 1st.

If my 485 is approved before March 1st, then is it ok to use the GC and join my client, without making an I-9 entry of GC with my 485 sponsor.
Any valuable suggestions please. Sincere Thanks.
Your I485 has been pending for 180 days. So you are eligible for AC21 job portability. You have no problem joining FT. However to invoke AC21, it would be helpful to have a) SOC code b) Job Title and c)Job description. So try to get PERM / I-140 from your original employer. If it is lost, you can do a FOIA request. I would suggest you to apply for AC21 immediately after joining the job. Don't wait. This way you are covered for Citizenship form later on. Good luck fellow Oors.

Edit: I don't get your question about I-9. The moment you join any new employer, they will have to do compliance (E-Verify / I-9). The only way you can work with the new FT employer is either by using GC or EAD or by transferring H1B. You had indicated that you are going to use EAD or GC. So you have to file a I-9 with any new employer. If you are still in EAD/AP status, please make sure that you browse through our EAD/AP forum on the advantages and disadvantages of EAD & H1B. Also before travel on EAD/AP make sure you read the AP travel thread. Good Luck.