Elections, Results and Impact Discussions

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Excited or nervous about what's going to happen tomorrow and what it means for your immigration journey? Don't be, it will be fine. Everything will be alright in the end. If it's not alright, it's not the end. Just turn off the news for a day and a half and grab some popcorn tomorrow evening.

[longwaitgigu]

Excited or nervous about what's going to happen tomorrow and what it means for your immigration journey? Don't be, it will be fine. Everything will be alright in the end. If it's not alright, it's not the end. Just turn off the news for a day and a half and grab some popcorn tomorrow evening.
U know right
The results r not going to be in tomorrow night
It might take a week for finals due to mail in ballet

[monsieur]

U know right
The results r not going to be in tomorrow night
It might take a week for finals due to mail in ballet

It Depends; if its landslide then it will be over tomorrow.

FL, OH, NC goes in Dem direction then battleground state will loose their kingmaker role. Reps has to win these 3 + Battleground states to win presidency.

[gcconnect]

Looks like JB is reaching the finish line.
What are the significant changes in terms of predictions for the EB2I and EB3I with new admin.
Any thoughts..

[bodhi2000]

My concern is JB without a senate majority will have a hard time nominating Head of DHS. A legally valid appointment is critical to reduce the agency bias/roadblocks towards legal immigrants

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

My concern is JB without a senate majority will have a hard time nominating Head of DHS. A legally valid appointment is critical to reduce the agency bias/roadblocks towards legal immigrants

My take on these elections is that If everyone wins something, no one wins everything and nothing can get done. The only way there was any chance for any reforms were if Democrats took the WH + Senate and held the House. Biden seems like he may win but without the Senate, he will be a lame duck for 2 years, possibly 4 because the majority of Republican Senate races were fought this year and they resoundingly beat back all the Democrats even with a massive funding disadvantage. It's just mind-blowing in places like SC where Graham still won with the other guy raising like 100 million. All it means is that the Trump line of thinking is loudly resonating across the country and not going to go away.

What it means for backlogged folks like us is probably nuanced. If Biden wins, he will probably unroll some of the bans and other onerous paperwork like I-944, but he won't be able to reform anything which could be a good and bad thing. For example, they may not be able to touch the spillover for FY2022 unless there are other avenues. The bad thing is that we will be stuck with an antiquated Immigration system for more years with no relief. Democrats won't be able to work on their pet projects like DACA and Asylum etc. though they can pass more Executive Orders.

Looking at the massive early votes, I was also under the false impression that it could be a landslide for Biden but once again everyone was wrong again. Trump managed to turn out as many votes as Biden did and even if he loses, it will be so marginal that the mandate will not be there to get anything done. There will be a lot of nervous democrats going into the 2022 midterms.

[bodhi2000]

True, immigration reform is out of the question. At this point if they stop the harassment (pending Labor, H1 rules, ban on stamping etc.). I will take that over nothing

[inspired_p]

True, immigration reform is out of the question. At this point if they stop the harassment (pending Labor, H1 rules, ban on stamping etc.). I will take that over nothing

With Trump / Republican presidency for next 4 years, which still a possibility, what is already in the rules/laws is just fraction of concern. they have a whole lot planned which might not be for immigration. So Biden win, no harm done is best case scenario.

[bodhi2000]

If Trump wins it will be the end of H1B and they will find ways to make it harder for folks in the queue from greening

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

With Trump / Republican presidency for next 4 years, which still a possibility, what is already in the rules/laws is just fraction of concern. they have a whole lot planned which might not be for immigration. So Biden win, no harm done is best case scenario.

Don't think Republican Presidency is gonna happen, they called Michigan for Biden.

[bodhi2000]

Biden needs to win Nevada. At this time it seems to be a close race:(

[karanjohar]

Looks like the mandate is weak for Biden and he will enter as a lame duck president. Senate with Republicans and they gained house seats too. Also, won state elections which will pave for a house win in two years (re-districting). No hopes for CIR for the next four years and no country cap removal.

[bodhi2000]

Any takes on how Biden presidency will impact spillover from FB in 2021?

[monsieur]

Any takes on how Biden presidency will impact spillover from FB in 2021?

Good chance it will happen coz of gridlock in DC. How much will depend on consulate reopenings considering cases all across world is on upward trend.

[mcmilers]

Main benefit of Biden Presidency will be Miller going back to oblivion.

[bluelabel]

There's a remote possibility for Democrats to regain control of Senate. GA special election did not result anyone with over 50% so there will be another run off on Jan5th between top 2 candidates and also there's a very possibility of David Perdue slipping below 50% and it could also go for another special run off.

In the above scenario if Democrats manage to win both GA special elections, it will 50-50 in senate between Democrats and Republicans and Kamala Harris will be tie breaker

[inspired_p]

There's a remote possibility for Democrats to regain control of Senate. GA special election did not result anyone with over 50% so there will be another run off on Jan5th between top 2 candidates and also there's a very possibility of David Perdue slipping below 50% and it could also go for another special run off.

In the above scenario if Democrats manage to win both GA special elections, it will 50-50 in senate between Democrats and Republicans and Kamala Harris will be tie breaker

Let the election be over first - and all legal challenges completed. Biden is on his way to victory but not won yet!

[mcmilers]

pretty much all the legal challenges Trump team is throwing dont have much merit. Even Fox news is saying that. the problem is the rhetoric they are spewing, it just divides the country and makes us look bad to outside world. also, chances of violence go up when trump keeps making baseless claims.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

This is the fifth election since my time here and even without voting this one felt so personal and important to save the heart and soul of America. I don't think it was successful though as more than 60 million people still voted for one of the worst human beings on the planet and his cabal of corrupt and morally repugnant human beings. But hopefully it will be a small step forward.

[qesehmk]

This is the fifth election since my time here and even without voting this one felt so personal and important to save the heart and soul of America. I don't think it was successful though as more than 60 million people still voted for one of the worst human beings on the planet and his cabal of corrupt and morally repugnant human beings. But hopefully it will be a small step forward.
My sixth one! This was a battle to save the soul of this country and Americans indeed showed their character.

I think America has always been a confident and progressive society. Despite all the follies mistakes and experiments, America is moving forward. I actually sympathize with a lot of American middle class - particularly from the industrial / rust belt. Their plight is real. Trump - although a conman- gave voice to them. I think democrats will do well to do something for the industrial belt.

As per Biden, imagine this - FIRST WOMAN VP - FIRST BLACK VP - FIRST INDIAN AMERICAN VP! In Biden's own words - that's a big f----g deal.

[AceMan]

My sixth one! This was a battle to save the soul of this country and Americans indeed showed their character.

I think America has always been a confident and progressive society. Despite all the follies mistakes and experiments, America is moving forward. I actually sympathize with a lot of American middle class - particularly from the industrial / rust belt. Their plight is real. Trump - although a conman- gave voice to them. I think democrats will do well to do something for the industrial belt.

As per Biden, imagine this - FIRST WOMAN VP - FIRST BLACK VP - FIRST INDIAN AMERICAN VP! In Biden's own words - that's a big f----g deal.

One thing I have noticed is how Republican party stays silent on Trump's accusations. Many are really happy Trump is on the way out. They are more concerned about not guaranteed a majority in Senate.

Unlike India, the loser leader of every party holds on to the position under one pretext or another.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

I am starting to alter my expectations for the Senate based on what has happened and is happening in Georgia. If somehow Biden pulls off winning Georgia, and both the Senate races go into runoffs, Stacey Abrams is waiting. She single-handedly would have won Georgia for Biden if it happens. Millions of dollars will flow into Georgia to turn out the vote for a runoff which may just about work.

[qesehmk]

One thing I have noticed is how Republican party stays silent on Trump's accusations. Many are really happy Trump is on the way out. They are more concerned about not guaranteed a majority in Senate.

Unlike India, the loser leader of every party holds on to the position under one pretext or another.
They have always been spineless. I have been watching them being accomplice to the Iraq war, anti muslim sentiment, anti immigrant sentiment, unnecessary tax beneifts (estate tax / dividend tax ), abolition of glass steagall limitation ... I mean there are way too many things to list. And the reason this nonsense goes on is because the interior states are bigger in numbers and get 2 senators each no matter what. All these backwards ass republican states are poor and GOP fully leverages their ignorance and helplessness to rile them up on useless issues that matter to no one. All the while profiting GOPs rich donors in arms, oil, financial industry.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

I know Kamala Harris has not exactly been a torch bearer for Indian immigrants and she has identified as Black (for obvious political purposes) which has rubbed a lot among the Indian diaspora the wrong way. But it's still incredible that we are on the cusp of having a first generation Indian-American being the VP of the most powerful country in the world. I think there is going to be a lot of friction between US and India in a Biden administration. Harris, with her prosecutorial background, is not going to give the time of day to Modi and will be quick to condemn any actions from a human rights angle.

[h1bh1bh1b]

Kamala already raised her voice for Kashmir.. and she is in a position to prove she is loyal to usa then India in every issue concerning India.

Indian media and politicians are watching. Stirring minority people and creating a stampede Of votes is a way to comeback. Fake Gandhi and groups will stir lots of issues in India and make India hell for next 4 years. India is ripe for clash.

God bless India from politicians!

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Kamala already raised her voice for Kashmir.. and she is in a position to prove she is loyal to usa then India in every issue concerning India.

Indian media and politicians are watching. Stirring minority people and creating a stampede Of votes is a way to comeback. Fake Gandhi and groups will stir lots of issues in India and make India hell for next 4 years. India is ripe for clash.

God bless India from politicians!

Kamala Harris doesn't have to prove anything to anyone. She will be the first Asian-American-Woman Vice President of the USA if they win. In fact, it's the Indian Government who needs to be more careful with their nationalistic ideals if they want the US to be a partner in counter-balancing China. This is already going to be tough given that Democratic governments have usually had a softer stance toward China but they could have a different approach keeping in mind all of China's ambitions especially in the South China sea.

[suninphx]

Kamala already raised her voice for Kashmir.. and she is in a position to prove she is loyal to usa then India in every issue concerning India.

Indian media and politicians are watching. Stirring minority people and creating a stampede Of votes is a way to comeback. Fake Gandhi and groups will stir lots of issues in India and make India hell for next 4 years. India is ripe for clash.

God bless India from politicians!

Don't worry mate. PM Modi and team is more than capable to handle fake narrative from leftist fake media. People with ZERO knowledge on ground reality keep blaming Modi for every thing that's wrong in the world. But better days are ahead for India in my opinion. I don't understand why people have objection for the nation first approach of any leader of any country? That's how it should be always. And BTW Indi-US relationship is bidirectional now as India has grown much much stronger.

[vedu]

I believe Joe Biden will become the most successful long lasting US politician (even better record than Obama) by the time he will hang up his boots considering the following facts:

1. He was the US Senator for whooping 36 years.
2. Vice President for 8 years
3. Hopefully President for next 8 years
4. He was the recipient of Presidential Medal of Freedom
5. He just needs a Nobel Prize to add another feather to his hat.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

I believe Joe Biden will become the most successful long lasting US politician (even better record than Obama) by the time he will hang up his boots considering the following facts:

1. He was the US Senator for whooping 36 years.
2. Vice President for 8 years
3. Hopefully President for next 8 years
4. He was the recipient of Presidential Medal of Freedom
5. He just needs a Nobel Prize to add another feather to his hat.

He has already indicated he may not contest for a second term when he will be 81.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Don’t worry mate. PM Modi and team is more than capable to handle fake narrative from leftist fake media. People with ZERO knowledge on ground reality keep blaming Modi for every thing that’s wrong in the world. But better days are ahead for India in my opinion. I don’t understand why people have objection for ‘nation first’ approach of any leader of any country? That’s how it should be always. And BTW Indi-US relationship is bidirectional now as India has grown much much stronger.

Yeah he has been globally reported to be actively suppressing any news which are critical of him or his administration. That's how he is capable of handling 'fake narrative from leftist fake media'. Modi has no global clout to be blamed for anything in the world, but yeah his human rights record in India is not exactly rosy. 'Nation First' is not a problem as long as every citizen is treated as a human being, and not a pariah.

Anyways, I don't track local politics in India and uninformed, so do not expect me to keep providing rebuttals to any arguments you have on my views.

[suninphx]

Yeah he has been globally reported to be actively suppressing any news which are critical of him or his administration. That's how he is capable of handling 'fake narrative from leftist fake media'. Modi has no global clout to be blamed for anything in the world, but yeah his human rights record in India is not exactly rosy. 'Nation First' is not a problem as long as every citizen is treated as a human being, and not a pariah.

Anyways, I don't track local politics in India and uninformed, so do not expect me to keep providing rebuttals to any arguments you have on my views.

If you don’t understand Indian politics why bother answering to my post at first place?Modi admin Suppressing news? LOL Are you even real? Do you ever read Indian newspapers?
Oh I get it - ‘fake leftist media’ remark has hit hard and right place

And BTW - I don’t waste my time arguing with people who are either misinformed or have extreme one sided views (right or left).

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

If you don’t understand Indian politics why bother answering to my post at first place?Modi admin Suppressing news? LOL Are you even real? Do you ever read Indian newspapers?
Oh I get it - ‘fake leftist media’ remark has hit hard and right place

And BTW - I don’t waste my time arguing with people who are either misinformed or have extreme one sided views (right or left).

Sounds good, bud. Have a good day.

By the way, all of these people are lying:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/02/world/asia/modi-india-press-media.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/06/01/india-pandemic-is-cover-modis-war-journalists/

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-politics-media-analysis/indian-journalists-say-they-intimidated-ostracized-if-they-criticize-modi-and-the-bjp-idUSKBN1HX1F4

https://qz.com/india/1570899/how-narendra-modi-has-almost-killed-indian-media/

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/08/02/indias-media-cant-speak-truth-to-power-modi-bjp-journalism/

https://rsf.org/en/news/how-indias-government-tries-suppress-all-covid-19-reporting

https://scroll.in/latest/976468/stop-harassment-of-journalists-drop-sedition-cases-against-them-global-press-bodies-tell-modi

https://time.com/5856163/india-press-freedom-covid-19/

https://www.thequint.com/news/india/modi-20-india-shrinking-press-freedom-explained

https://ipi.media/india-press-freedom-rapidly-deteriorating/

https://thewire.in/media/indian-media-freedom-mark-tully

https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/articles/28863/in-modi-s-india-rights-and-freedoms-erode-further-amid-covid-19

https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/jul/31/india-arrests-50-journalists-in-clampdown-on-critics-of-covid-19-response

[h1bh1bh1b]

Dragon you are trying to judge based on the narratives and arguments ( which can be manipulated with fallacies) rather than your own fair assessment of the situation. When i saw New York Times as reference I understood your position :)

No more arguments

[suninphx]

Sounds good, bud. Have a good day.

By the way, all of these people are lying:

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/02/world/asia/modi-india-press-media.html

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/06/01/india-pandemic-is-cover-modis-war-journalists/

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-india-politics-media-analysis/indian-journalists-say-they-intimidated-ostracized-if-they-criticize-modi-and-the-bjp-idUSKBN1HX1F4

https://qz.com/india/1570899/how-narendra-modi-has-almost-killed-indian-media/

https://foreignpolicy.com/2019/08/02/indias-media-cant-speak-truth-to-power-modi-bjp-journalism/

https://rsf.org/en/news/how-indias-government-tries-suppress-all-covid-19-reporting

https://scroll.in/latest/976468/stop-harassment-of-journalists-drop-sedition-cases-against-them-global-press-bodies-tell-modi

https://time.com/5856163/india-press-freedom-covid-19/
Mate, By providing all these links you just proved my point of fake narrative. I suggest you read articles from all political angles that will do good for you.
Just read any recognized Indian news paper. You will find plenty of articles criticizing PM Modi and his govt policies. So there goes your claim about news suppression.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Dragon you are trying to judge based on the narratives and arguments ( which can be manipulated with fallacies) rather than your own fair assessment of the situation. When i saw New York Times as reference I understood your position :)

No more arguments

I mentioned in my post that I am 'uninformed', not misinformed. I do have the ability to look at reporting from around the world to draw my own conclusions rather than depend on 'narrative fallacies' from one source or even a couple of sources. In my view, if a hundred people stand around and tell me that it's a Donkey, I am not going to insist it's a Zebra.

[h1bh1bh1b]

On a second thought, if you are interested in understanding economy , I suggest econtalk podcast and follow Russ Roberts. You will get knowledge instead of opinions

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Mate, By providing all these links you just proved my point of fake narrative. I suggest you read articles from all political angles that will do good for you.
Just read any recognized Indian news paper. You will find plenty of articles criticizing PM Modi and his govt policies. So there goes your claim about news suppression.

I updated and provided 13 links from all over. How many more 'political angles' do I need to look at it from? If you can't make up your mind that press suppression is taking place in India even after it being objectively reported all over the world, I can't help you. Will end the topic here and pivot to the US Election which we are discussing in this thread.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

I hope Pennsylvania and Nevada bring it home today evening. This is like a three day root canal...

[suninphx]

I updated and provided 13 links from all over. How many more 'political angles' do I need to look at it from? If you can't make up your mind that press suppression is taking place in India even after it being objectively reported all over the world, I can't help you. Will end the topic here and pivot to the US Election which we are discussing in this thread.
You are still missing the point. Why rely on articles written by someone else. Why not browse countless articles criticizing PM Modi. If there was news suppression would those articles still exist on news site? Its that simple. Anyways my last on this.

Hopefully we have a functional govt in the US soon. There are millions of people who need help from the govt. in form of some stimulus or such

[idliman]

Without flaming this thread, there is a great difference in perception of BJP (Modi) Vs anti-Modi sentiment when you move from North to South of India. I had seen the difference in arguments between some of my college who are from Gujarat, Non-Gujarat and South India. Also this difference is marked based on their background (upbringing, environment, locality). I have talked to some people on the ground, who are worried that Modi government is pushing reforms which primarily benefit the privileged. Kerala, TN and KA have greatly benefited by affirmative action to bring many people out of poverty and domination by a select few. In my school group, there is a great divide between pro-Modi and anti-Modi factions. There is a perception that Modi had brought in some reforms that is benefiting big-business. This may be globalization. Of course I don't have a feel for the ground reality in India as I left India about 20 years back. I can definitely say that in the last 2 years or so, the support for BJP and Modi had dramatically reduced in the school groups (high school, UG and PG groups).

I don't want to see members attacking fellow members here. Without getting personal, discussing policies will be great.

[qesehmk]

Great post. I echo Idli's sentiment.

In the same spirit I think everybody will agree that we all will be happy if ALL indians flourish and live happy and peaceful lives won't we?

I think US has great lessons that India can shamelessly copy. My own observation is that we ALL love USA for its freedom justice and equality and non-discrimination but we are very poor when it comes to applying the same to our brothers and sisters!!

So here are some questions I have that I would like to really ask all of you to ponder over:

1. If we love USA to be so much charitable to all of us irrespective of our country of origin or religion then shouldn't we insist on India being charitable to at least our own very neighbors which in many ways are our own flesh and blood even though they are muslims in name.
2. If we love USA for being the country with "arguably" the least discrimination on planet and being a reasonably merit based system then shouldn't we insist on non-discrimination in India not just in school admissions or government jobs but also in private companies. e.g. CISCO recently had a lawsuit for discriminating against so called lower caste people from India.
3. If we love USA for freedom, and I am 99.99% sure your own wives are wearing shorts skirts and whatever they please here and so on, then shouldn't we afford the same freedom to women in India without blaming them for rape. In other words, do you agree that a woman shouldn't be raped and then accused of wearing skimpy clothes are any reason whatsoever!

I think perhaps talks along these line might bring out more consensus and less rancor.

[suninphx]

Without flaming this thread, there is a great difference in perception of BJP (Modi) Vs anti-Modi sentiment when you move from North to South of India. I had seen the difference in arguments between some of my college who are from Gujarat, Non-Gujarat and South India. Also this difference is marked based on their background (upbringing, environment, locality). I have talked to some people on the ground, who are worried that Modi government is pushing reforms which primarily benefit the privileged. Kerala, TN and KA have greatly benefited by affirmative action to bring many people out of poverty and domination by a select few. In my school group, there is a great divide between pro-Modi and anti-Modi factions. There is a perception that Modi had brought in some reforms that is benefiting big-business. This may be globalization. Of course I don't have a feel for the ground reality in India as I left India about 20 years back. I can definitely say that in the last 2 years or so, the support for BJP and Modi had dramatically reduced in the school groups (high school, UG and PG groups).

I don't want to see members attacking fellow members here. Without getting personal, discussing policies will be great.

Lived multiple years in Bangalore and can relate to it as much as I can relate to my native place Pune. And I love idali sambar with coffee.

So no arguments with you idaliman! Have a great weekend!

[jimmys]

I am starting to alter my expectations for the Senate based on what has happened and is happening in Georgia. If somehow Biden pulls off winning Georgia, and both the Senate races go into runoffs, Stacey Abrams is waiting. She single-handedly would have won Georgia for Biden if it happens. Millions of dollars will flow into Georgia to turn out the vote for a runoff which may just about work.

Imagine this. If Trump is ousted, there's no race equation attached to GOP in Senators' races in GA. Perdue got more votes than Trump and Ossoff got less votes than Biden. Besides, if GA's two Senators stand between multi millionaires and 4(possibly 8) years of higher taxes, I expect millions and millions dollars to pour in favor of GOP. For Dems, it's going to be Soros and Zuckerberg. It's going to be interesting. Let's see.

[jimmys]

Hope Biden/Harris team is appointing AOC as Treasury Secretary and Bernie Sanders as Labor Secretary. Maybe Omar as Secretary of State? Love to see such team working for next 4 years. ;)

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Great post. I echo Idli's sentiment.

In the same spirit I think everybody will agree that we all will be happy if ALL indians flourish and live happy and peaceful lives won't we?

So taking lessons from United States I would like to really ask all of you to ponder following things:

1. If we love USA to be so much charitable to all of us irrespective of our country of origin or religion then shouldn't we insist on India being charitable to at least our own very neighbors which in many ways are our own flesh and blood even though they are muslims in name.
2. If we love USA for being the country with "arguably" the least discrimination on planet and being a reasonably merit based system then shouldn't we insist on non-discrimination in India not just in school admissions or government jobs but also in private companies. e.g. CISCO recently had a lawsuit for discriminating against so called lower caste people from India.
3. If we love USA for freedom, and I am 99.99% sure your own wives are wearing shorts skirts and whatever they please here and so on, then shouldn't we afford the same freedom to women in India without blaming them for rape. In other words, do you agree that a woman shouldn't be raped and then accused of wearing skimpy clothes are any reason whatsoever!

I have many such questions where we ALL love USA for its freedom justice and equality and non-discrimination but we are very poor when it comes to applying the same to our brothers and sisters!!

I think perhaps talks along these line might bring out more consensus and less rancour.

Hit the nail on the head there, Q. I face this in my own household in India. My wife who has a PhD in Engineering and does work with three and four letter government agencies, has to wear a chudidhar in my home so that she does not offend them or our neighbors by showing her legs. And this type of restrictions and censure has only increased in the past few years. I don't blame anything on the government because it's people who are close-minded but an administration obviously impacts and influences the behavior of it's people by it's words and actions. The US is a shining example of that now.

It was never my intent to leave India because I disliked the conservative attitude or customs or traditions and I actually enjoyed some of them especially the festivals. But I was also caught in the middle of riots in 1992 when I was just 13. We lived in a Shiv Sena stronghold and their members came and indoctrinated us behind our parents back and taught us youngsters to fight with hockey sticks, bicycle chains and bamboo sticks so that we will be 'ready to fight' when the time comes. Myself and my friends were also witnesses to the lynching of a group of people in our area, two of whom ultimately died which are seared in our memories. So I am not talking without perspective when I say what is going in India now is not how a democracy should be.

[qesehmk]

BTW - many of you may not be sold on Biden hence here is a small fact for your consideration. If you are a backlogged EB-I and working in california you have much more networth today than Biden had after 35 years of working in senate in 2008!!

In 2008 Biden's net worth was 400K USD. That one fact alone might tell you something about his character. Imagine how many senate committees he chaired. How many big corporations he took upon. When as VP his son Bo died of cancer (and I hope none of you ever know how much it costs to cure a family member of cancer) Biden ran out of money and Obama lent him money.

Biden's net worth became 12 million after he retired as VP and went on a speech circuit (which every single VP and President does - no surprise there) and wrote a book or two.

[vedu]

He has already indicated he may not contest for a second term when he will be 81.

Honestly, I think it all depends on whether he will be able to fulfill his agenda in the current term or not. If not, then he will go for the second term in order to fulfill the promises he made to the people of this land. And that's the honorable thing to do. And as a byproduct of that, he will break the records.

[suninphx]

BTW - many of you may not be sold on Biden hence here is a small fact for your consideration. If you are a backlogged EB-I and working in california you have much more networth today than Biden had after 35 years of working in senate in 2008!!

In 2008 Biden's net worth was 400K USD. That one fact alone might tell you something about his character. Imagine how many senate committees he chaired. How many big corporations he took upon. When as VP his son Bo died of cancer (and I hope none of you ever know how much it costs to cure a family member of cancer) Biden ran out of money and Obama lent him money.

Biden's net worth became 12 million after he retired as VP and went on a speech circuit (which every single VP and President does - no surprise there) and wrote a book or two.
For comparison sake Mr Modi’s net worth is around 200K max after being CM 3 times and PM 2 times. Plus none of his relatives got a job paying 83k/month with no experience in that field of work.
Btw- I am no bhakt and not happy with how GST and demonetization was implemented. They should accept mistakes and do much better. None the less wanted to put the things in context.
To my mind not being corrupt is basic qualification for any politician. But only that quality won’t help. Ability to take bold decisions and steer nation in right direction (right for most of the people) are other qualities which are must IMO

[AceMan]

Without flaming this thread, there is a great difference in perception of BJP (Modi) Vs anti-Modi sentiment when you move from North to South of India. I had seen the difference in arguments between some of my college who are from Gujarat, Non-Gujarat and South India. Also this difference is marked based on their background (upbringing, environment, locality). I have talked to some people on the ground, who are worried that Modi government is pushing reforms which primarily benefit the privileged. Kerala, TN and KA have greatly benefited by affirmative action to bring many people out of poverty and domination by a select few. In my school group, there is a great divide between pro-Modi and anti-Modi factions. There is a perception that Modi had brought in some reforms that is benefiting big-business. This may be globalization. Of course I don't have a feel for the ground reality in India as I left India about 20 years back. I can definitely say that in the last 2 years or so, the support for BJP and Modi had dramatically reduced in the school groups (high school, UG and PG groups).

I don't want to see members attacking fellow members here. Without getting personal, discussing policies will be great.

First things first, I am a Dosa fan, so much that I skipped a booze filled dinner at a tech workshop DC to go and have a creep presented as Dosa at some Mexican joint. The masala was so bad that it had raw potatoes. But my love for dosa overcame the bad masala and ordered another Creep without masala. I just told this incident because as a person aspiring to be a permanent resident/USC at some point of life, I went looking for things I love in other cultures. When I take the morning breakfast, I make pancakes generally the breakfast bar take some scrambled eggs, add some hot sauce to get some taste equivalent for chatni/melagai podi.

The second part of your point, while school groups, college groups were fun initially we see a rerun of same junk forwards in multiple groups, some in the family group, some in laws group. The lull you are seeing with BJP/Modi is just because the elections are not there. When the elections are nearby these dormant groups just churn out junk information, and I exit group stating busy nature of work and join back only after the election results are announced. I have never been to Modi's India as my last visit was 7-8 years back.

[qesehmk]

India seems to have gone backwards socially without a doubt. I am as marathi as it gets. I remember Maharashtrian culture never really glorified Baba Swami etc thanks to 800 years of reformist saint tradition starting with Dnyaneshwar. Today I don't recognize what's going on in Maharashtra. People are more religious, superstitious, and all kinds of gundas are claiming to be Hindutva champions.

People are very passionate about Hindutva and they think that is same as nationalism. My question is - is it really? Because if so then we should be talking about PEOPLE and their problems rather than religion or culture. A nation can live without culture and religion. Can it live without PEOPLE?

Hit the nail on the head there, Q. I face this in my own household in India. My wife who has a PhD in Engineering and does work with three and four letter government agencies, has to wear a chudidhar in my home so that she does not offend them or our neighbors by showing her legs. And this type of restrictions and censure has only increased in the past few years. I don't blame anything on the government because it's people who are close-minded but an administration obviously impacts and influences the behavior of it's people by it's words and actions. The US is a shining example of that now.

It was never my intent to leave India because I disliked the conservative attitude or customs or traditions and I actually enjoyed some of them especially the festivals. But I was also caught in the middle of riots in 1992 when I was just 13. We lived in a Shiv Sena stronghold and their members came and indoctrinated us behind our parents back and taught us youngsters to fight with hockey sticks, bicycle chains and bamboo sticks so that we will be 'ready to fight' when the time comes. Myself and my friends were also witnesses to the lynching of a group of people in our area, two of whom ultimately died which are seared in our memories. So I am not talking without perspective when I say what is going in India now is not how a democracy should be.

[qesehmk]

I agree that being clean should be primary quality not differentiation. I don't think Modi is clean though. Just look at his clothes. How does he afford it with his government salary? Remember once he wore the Rs10 lakh suit? How is that ethical and clean?
For comparison sake Mr Modi’s net worth is around 200K max after being CM 3 times and PM 2 times. Plus none of his relatives got a job paying 83k/month with no experience in that field of work.
Btw- I am no bhakt and not happy with how GST and demonetization was implemented. They should accept mistakes and do much better. None the less wanted to put the things in context.
To my mind not being corrupt is basic qualification for any politician. But only that quality won’t help. Ability to take bold decisions and steer nation in right direction (right for most of the people) are other qualities which are must IMO

[suninphx]

I agree that being clean should be primary quality not differentiation. I don't think Modi is clean though. Just look at his clothes. How does he afford it with his government salary? Remember once he wore the Rs10 lakh suit? How is that ethical and clean?
Q come on - तू आत्ताच म्हणाला की लोकांना आवडीचे कपडे घालू दे :) :)
Salaries are not that bad. Here is the link and they seem to be base salary per month:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salary_of_Government_Officials_in_India

[qesehmk]

I did not object his choice of clothes but his ability to afford it on his own. We already know one suit was given to him by a businessman and cost 10lakh per piece! A lot of people in India earn 40 lakh per year can not afford Modi's wardrobe believe me. :o
Q come on - तू आत्ताच म्हणाला की लोकांना आवडीचे कपडे घालू दे :) :)
Salaries are not that bad. Here is the link and they seem to be base salary per month:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salary_of_Government_Officials_in_India

[suninphx]

I did not object his choice of clothes but his ability to afford it on his own. We already know one suit was given to him by a businessman and cost 10lakh per piece! A lot of people in India earn 40 lakh per year can not afford Modi's wardrobe believe me. :o

I think we have to agree to disagree. Have a good one!

[vedu]

I liked/like both PMs of India, Manmohan Singh and Modi. But if you force me to pick one favorite, that will definitely be "Manmohan". While people kept calling him weak PM, he kept a single-minded focus on one metric that matters a lot to pull millions of people out of poverty, i.e. GDP GROWTH. After all, he was an economist. As for Modi, his focus seems to be on ONE NATION with STRONG BORDERS. That's a good thing, but when it comes to economy, he gets close to zero points in my book. And Manmohan Singh was not weak in my books. Yes, he was a man of few words, but India progressed a lot under his 10 years. Today, if you look around for different politicians of India as a possible PM candidate, you will realize that Modi is hundred times better than any of those corrupt politicians. Only other person that comes to my mind is Kejriwal, who is well-educated and most importantly an honest man. AAP did great work in Delhi in last few years.

[qesehmk]

I think we have to agree to disagree. Have a good one!
Indeed sun. Let's speak about freedom justice equality for all. I think most people on forum will be aligned on these topics.

[longwaitgigu]

Will the interview mandate go under new president?

[vsivarama]

Will the interview mandate go under new president?

This most likely will be waived. JB was elected that he will take the pandemic seriously. Cancelling unnecessary interviews in a pandemic seems like a no brainer to me.

[HappyUSA]

I am sorry , but I find it funny . Prime minister and president and for that matter chief minister can buy clothes and submit as reimbursement , It's not a valid argument . He is the Prime minister of largest democracy in the world and India is not a poor country .

[HappyUSA]

I liked/like both PMs of India, Manmohan Singh and Modi. But if you force me to pick one favorite, that will definitely be "Manmohan". While people kept calling him weak PM, he kept a single-minded focus on one metric that matters a lot to pull millions of people out of poverty, i.e. GDP GROWTH. After all, he was an economist. As for Modi, his focus seems to be on ONE NATION with STRONG BORDERS. That's a good thing, but when it comes to economy, he gets close to zero points in my book. And Manmohan Singh was not weak in my books. Yes, he was a man of few words, but India progressed a lot under his 10 years. Today, if you look around for different politicians of India as a possible PM candidate, you will realize that Modi is hundred times better than any of those corrupt politicians. Only other person that comes to my mind is Kejriwal, who is well-educated and most importantly an honest man. AAP did great work in Delhi in last few years.

Manmohan Singh is not a PM at all , He is not elected by people and he is puppet (whether he is economist or intelligent doesn't count) .Modi is like Jawaharlal Nehru , Indira Gandhi and Vajpey , elected by people .

[vedu]

Manmohan Singh is not a PM at all , He is not elected by people and he is puppet (whether he is economist or intelligent doesn't count) .Modi is like Jawaharlal Nehru , Indira Gandhi and Vajpey , elected by people .

I respect your views! So, I googled a question, "Who was the 13th Prime Minister of India?" the answer comes quickly, "Dr. Manmohan Singh". Same is reported by all official sources. And you may not know, but the Prime Minister of India is never directly elected by the people. For his second term, he was announced the prime ministerial candidate by the party and the whole election campaign was based on his name.

[HappyUSA]

I respect your views! So, I googled a question, "Who was the 13th Prime Minister of India?" the answer comes quickly, "Dr. Manmohan Singh". Same is reported by all official sources.

Well , I don't think you have to google for it , He is a nominated prime minister not elected by people , That's not how democracy works (it was a loop hole in democracy), there are so many chief ministers who are nominated during the time of Indira Gandhi . If Manmohan Singh contests election on his own he won't even get deposit . To give you recent example Chief minister of Andhra Pradesh (undivided ) Kiran Kumar Reddy floated new party and got 0 seats .

Manmohan Singh did not take single decision on his own .People like Manmohan Singh are threat to democracy (At least he should have stepped down in the 2nd term after all the corruption allegations instead he was loyal to Gandhi family stayed as PM .

[vedu]

He is a nominated prime minister not elected by people.

Like I said before, the Prime Minister of India is never directly elected by the People of India. This is the FACT!

[HappyUSA]

Like I said before, the Prime Minister of India is never directly elected by the People of India. This is the FACT!

I agree , But He is not even elected by MP's , he was nominated by Sonia Gandhi .

[vedu]

Manmohan Singh did not take single decision on his own .

He did! He put his PM position at stake for the Nuclear deal with the United States! And in response, the people of India reelected the congress party with an increased mandate for the second term.

[vedu]

I agree , But He is not even elected by MP's , he was nominated by Sonia Gandhi .

The Prime Minister must be a member of the Lok Sabha or the Rajya Sabha. And Rajya Sabha MPs are elected by the electoral college of the elected members of the State Assembly with a system of proportional representation by a single transferable vote. You can't just nominate somebody.

[HappyUSA]

The Prime Minister must be a member of the Lok Sabha or the Rajya Sabha. And Rajya Sabha MPs are elected by the electoral college of the elected members of the State Assembly with a system of proportional representation by a single transferable vote. You can't just nominate somebody.

End of the day he is a puppet and puppets are not good for democracy, I hope you agree to that .

[vedu]

End of the day he is a puppet and puppets are not good for democracy, I hope you agree to that .

You are entitled to your own opinions, but not your own facts!;)

[HappyUSA]

You are entitled to your own opinions, but not your own facts!;)

You seem to believe google a lot , please google ' puppet prime minister of India ' you get below links

https://www.thedailybeast.com/farewell-to-manmohan-singh-indias-puppet-prime-minister

https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/topic/puppet-Prime-Minister

https://www.quora.com/Why-was-Dr-Manmohan-Singh-called-a-puppet-prime-minister

[vedu]

I am sorry , but I find it funny . Prime minister and president and for that matter chief minister can buy clothes and submit as reimbursement , It's not a valid argument . He is the Prime minister of largest democracy in the world and India is not a poor country .

The FACT is, Prime Minister Modi spends on his own clothing. He doesn't charge government for that.

[HappyUSA]

The FACT is, Prime Minister Modi spends on his own clothing. He doesn't charge government for that.

so what's the problem ?

[vedu]

so what's the problem ?

Who said it's a problem? It's a good thing and a shining example of his personal integrity.

[HappyUSA]

sounds good !

[gc_dedo]

Not surprised to see some BHAKTS here.
Hey Q, you run this amazing forum. You must be working 18 hrs a day to have some day time job and running this forum too. I have to say this - "Ek fakiri hai aap mein".

[Positive]

Kamala already raised her voice for Kashmir.. and she is in a position to prove she is loyal to usa then India in every issue concerning India.

Indian media and politicians are watching. Stirring minority people and creating a stampede Of votes is a way to comeback. Fake Gandhi and groups will stir lots of issues in India and make India hell for next 4 years. India is ripe for clash.

God bless India from politicians!

Criticizing India while in the opposition is different from doing so when number two in the government. They will not be any different than Obama admin was to Modi government. In fact rising Chinese power just makes common cause for US and India. There will be occasional pandering to the Muslim hot button issues from the Biden administration but that will not be the defining feature of the relationship. And that is a good thing. Having supported Modi's good governance agenda I am dismayed at his increasing reliance on divisive issues and Muslim baiting for political success, even when it is uncalled for and unnecessary. Modi ha enough political capital to steer the country to success instead of getting bogged down by parochial score settling.

[Positive]

They have always been spineless. I have been watching them being accomplice to the Iraq war, anti muslim sentiment, anti immigrant sentiment, unnecessary tax beneifts (estate tax / dividend tax ), abolition of glass steagall limitation ... I mean there are way too many things to list. And the reason this nonsense goes on is because the interior states are bigger in numbers and get 2 senators each no matter what. All these backwards ass republican states are poor and GOP fully leverages their ignorance and helplessness to rile them up on useless issues that matter to no one. All the while profiting GOPs rich donors in arms, oil, financial industry.

This is my 4th presidential election, having worked here for 14+ years and not sure I will ever be voting in one but it was painful to see the country marching towards Trumpocracy. Luckily, enough Americans weren't blinded by greed, racism, misogyny or willful ignorance/herd/cult mentality and showed up for American democracy. The distortions in American democracy are manifold. Some are foundational -the allocation of senate seats and electoral college based on the compromise necessary for forming the republic, the high threshold in amending the constitution drafted by slave owners, political appointment of judges; others are driven by shortsighted self interest of the political class -partisan gerrymandering, voter suppression, legalized corruption called lobbying, unfettered accommodation of money and moneyed in the political process which has corrupted all branches of government-the courts, the congress and the presidency (depending on the person occupying the position)... Until enough Americans realize that letting rich individuals and corporations unlimited power to influence/pick legislators, draft legislations, select judges, mold case law is not going to work out for most of the people. Until then, corporations are people, and money is speech in America.

[qesehmk]

This is my 4th presidential election, having worked here for 14+ years and not sure I will ever be voting in one but it was painful to see the country marching towards Trumpocracy. Luckily, enough Americans weren't blinded by greed, racism, misogyny or willful ignorance/herd/cult mentality and showed up for American democracy. The distortions in American democracy are manifold. Some are foundational -the allocation of senate seats and electoral college based on the compromise necessary for forming the republic, the high threshold in amending the constitution drafted by slave owners, political appointment of judges; others are driven by shortsighted self interest of the political class -partisan gerrymandering, voter suppression, legalized corruption called lobbying, unfettered accommodation of money and moneyed in the political process which has corrupted all branches of government-the courts, the congress and the presidency (depending on the person occupying the position)... Until enough Americans realize that letting rich individuals and corporations unlimited power to influence/pick legislators, draft legislations, select judges, mold case law is not going to work out for most of the people. Until then, corporations are people, and money is speech in America.
Very well said!

[qesehmk]

Criticizing India while in the opposition is different from doing so when number two in the government. They will not be any different than Obama admin was to Modi government. In fact rising Chinese power just makes common cause for US and India. There will be occasional pandering to the Muslim hot button issues from the Biden administration but that will not be the defining feature of the relationship. And that is a good thing. Having supported Modi's good governance agenda I am dismayed at his increasing reliance on divisive issues and Muslim baiting for political success, even when it is uncalled for and unnecessary. Modi ha enough political capital to steer the country to success instead of getting bogged down by parochial score settling.
I agree with most of your post except the reference to Muslim pandering. My view is that Muslims are hardly pandered. If they were they wouldn't be under represented in administration business and white collar jobs. Who else is under represented ? Dalits women and most of India's martial castes. I think it is important India fixes this under representation that IMHO systemic in nature.

[qesehmk]

Not surprised to see some BHAKTS here.
Hey Q, you run this amazing forum. You must be working 18 hrs a day to have some day time job and running this forum too. I have to say this - "Ek fakiri hai aap mein".

Are yaar kuch bhi bolo "fakir" mat bolo. India kaa satyanash jitana fakir swami baba logone kiya hai utana kisine nahi kiya hai.

Thank you for your kind words. Initially this started as personal quest that turned into social service + therapy and later on as a side business i.e. WhereismyGC. This forum though is run in a free fair and independent way and will remain so as long as people find it valuable.

[AceMan]

Not surprised to see some BHAKTS here.


Bhakt means a devotee. If you are using it as a slang to refer to people who support the Modi, you are pushing down the chance for a decent debate with the cheap shots.

[longwaitgigu]

This most likely will be waived. JB was elected that he will take the pandemic seriously. Cancelling unnecessary interviews in a pandemic seems like a no brainer to me.

Was the interview mandate via executive order

[gc_dedo]

Bhakt means a devotee. If you are using it as a slang to refer to people who support the Modi, you are pushing down the chance for a decent debate with the cheap shots.

By Bhakt I meant blind supporter of a leader, doesn't matter which leader. Also not interested in a debate here. When it comes to debate on politics, most people have already chosen sides. There is no crossover, at least in short term. In longer term, some people have reckoning. Also, few percentage of people are independent, so there is hope.

[smuggymba]

By Bhakt I meant blind supporter of a leader, doesn't matter which leader.

Bhakt - Devotee

Andh-Bakht - Blind Devotee.

I'm modi supporter but pissed off at this arnab thing and many others since he hasn't done much so I'm a bhakt and not andh-bhakt :)

[qesehmk]

Beautiful article by Forbes. Folks I have been saying this since 2009 that immigration is not just vote bank politics. It makes great economic sense and is a strategic goal of United States. Do read ....

https://www.forbes.com/sites/stuartanderson/2020/11/08/a-biden-immigration-policy-new-hope-for-immigrants-and-businesses/?sh=271bac907842

[Positive]

I agree with most of your post except the reference to Muslim pandering. My view is that Muslims are hardly pandered. If they were they wouldn't be under represented in administration business and white collar jobs. Who else is under represented ? Dalits women and most of India's martial castes. I think it is important India fixes this under representation that IMHO systemic in nature.

The Muslim pandering I mentioned here, "there will be occasional pandering to the Muslim hot button issues from the Biden administration," is that which democrats indulge in in their foreign policy position towards India (and Pakistan) generally, such as during the Obama administration, positions likely to be reflected in Biden administration.

As it comes to internal Indian politics, it is undeniable that congress has long pandered to Muslims for its own political expediency. That includes partition of India to carve out a Muslim nation and subsequent coddling of fundamentalism of the Muslim community leadership. For example, state sanction of triple talaq in India when it did not exist in a majority of Muslim countries. Whether that pandering has helped Muslims is obviously a completely different subject. Politicians see a virtue in perpetuating what works for them not the people. The congress perpetuated grievance politics among Muslims as much as they did among the poor without actually putting in action policies that would have helped betterment of Muslims or the eradication of poverty notwithstanding the sloganeering.

I think India has tried to much in terms of affirmative action to uplift the historically exploited. Unfortunately, affirmative action has been cornered/exploited by just a few within those communities. In my view, affirmative action should be based on economic parameters alone to deliver relief in a targeted manner without creating perverse incentives. I think when people are economically secure, they are better placed to overcome social prejudices.

[vedu]

When it comes to debate on politics, most people have already chosen sides. There is no crossover, at least in short term. In longer term, some people have reckoning. Also, few percentage of people are independent, so there is hope.

Agreed! People unnecessarily get worked up and emotional when it comes to choosing sides in politics. In reality, all politicians from all parties in India as well as in US are greedy and can change sides easily when it benefits them. Shivsena showed us a good example of that in Maharashtra. And now let's wait for the Bihar election results. You will see how these politicians change sides if no party gets clear majority. Same is here in US. Politicians here mostly work for the corporate interests. Here is an example of an honest political ad. Do watch it and have a good laugh!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdZ5ThrtTtM

[qesehmk]

The Muslim pandering I mentioned here, "there will be occasional pandering to the Muslim hot button issues from the Biden administration," is that which democrats indulge in in their foreign policy position towards India (and Pakistan) generally, such as during the Obama administration, positions likely to be reflected in Biden administration.

As it comes to internal Indian politics, it is undeniable that congress has long pandered to Muslims for its own political expediency. That includes partition of India to carve out a Muslim nation and subsequent coddling of fundamentalism of the Muslim community leadership. For example, state sanction of triple talaq in India when it did not exist in a majority of Muslim countries. Whether that pandering has helped Muslims is obviously a completely different subject. Politicians see a virtue in perpetuating what works for them not the people. The congress perpetuated grievance politics among Muslims as much as they did among the poor without actually putting in action policies that would have helped betterment of Muslims or the eradication of poverty notwithstanding the sloganeering.

I think India has tried to much in terms of affirmative action to uplift the historically exploited. Unfortunately, affirmative action has been cornered/exploited by just a few within those communities. In my view, affirmative action should be based on economic parameters alone to deliver relief in a targeted manner without creating perverse incentives. I think when people are economically secure, they are better placed to overcome social prejudices.

Ok. Thanks. If we are talking about American geopolitical bend towards Pakistan we should call it as such. It is not muslim pandering.

When it comes to Indian politics and history, carving out Pakistan was more of need of Congress leaders rather than muslims. Muslims viewed entire India as their playground and home. They viewed themselves as owners of India. They were never happy with half of India. It was insecure congress that had to create a "Hindu" piece for their own benefit. It was their insecurity that led to abolition of native rulers, their private estates, their private enterprises and thus destroying India's ability to rule itself in a wise manner. Now I don't exactly lament loss of rulers in India. But I do lament rise of English aligned pseudo ruling class in India that arose out of clerical and religious ranks and had no real experience or interest in governance. Instead they quickly got busy in same old caste politics, and corruption.

There are some elements like Shah Bano that are thrown around to appease extremists within Muslim community but the reality of modern India is that Muslims in India were a progressive and ruling class society that is now a backward society due to systemic discrimination. I personally knew one guy who studied at Aligarh and couldn't find a job in independent India and had to eventually migrate to Pakistan in mid 50s, and went on to become CEO of a public sector company in Pakistan. His wife was from Nagpur, speaks fluent marathi. She can't visit her mothers place because India doesn't give her a visa.

See this is not really about muslims. This is really about justice. We have been unable to give justice not just to muslims but to Hindus too. We have this small clerical religious class that has f'd us up very well for 70-80 years. Earlier it was called congress, today they have all migrated to BJP. Just look at UP and Delhi and you will see congress is empty. All of them have moved over to BJP.

Muslim pandering is a cliche term. Sorry I can't buy it. That terms masks our unjust system that has systemically kept farmers, dalits, all martial races, and muslims and women permanently disadvantaged.

[Zenzone]

This is my 4th presidential election, having worked here for 14+ years and not sure I will ever be voting in one but it was painful to see the country marching towards Trumpocracy. Luckily, enough Americans weren't blinded by greed, racism, misogyny or willful ignorance/herd/cult mentality and showed up for American democracy. The distortions in American democracy are manifold. Some are foundational -the allocation of senate seats and electoral college based on the compromise necessary for forming the republic, the high threshold in amending the constitution drafted by slave owners, political appointment of judges; others are driven by shortsighted self interest of the political class -partisan gerrymandering, voter suppression, legalized corruption called lobbying, unfettered accommodation of money and moneyed in the political process which has corrupted all branches of government-the courts, the congress and the presidency (depending on the person occupying the position)... Until enough Americans realize that letting rich individuals and corporations unlimited power to influence/pick legislators, draft legislations, select judges, mold case law is not going to work out for most of the people. Until then, corporations are people, and money is speech in America.

WOW! Very eloquently put mate!

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

One thing I am tired of is how the older generation politicians keep holding on to the power levers. And it's pretty bipartisan too. We are staking our lives and livelihoods on the views of 75+ year old buddas up and down on both sides of the aisle starting from the President down.... I mean Patrick Leahy (80), Chuck Grassley (87!!), Mitch (78), Dianne Feinstein (87!!). These people just keep getting re-elected over and over again. Term limits which I know will never happen is the only way to ensure that the younger generation gets to participate in governance. Sure, they will make some mistakes, but it will also bring some fresh perspectives to the table.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Trump finally concedes so this post election sham can finally end and we can move on to actually tackling serious issues like getting the Covid vaccine, repairing the economy and putting people back to work and repairing the bonds all over the world.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

ICYMI, Dick Durbin is positioning himself as the Democratic lead on the Senate Judiciary Committee after Diane Feinstein essentially got booted out for not resisting the ACB nomination. He could become Chairman if the Democrats win both runoff races in Georgia and could bring about a sea change of reform. But the Georgia races are going to be very tight. The prevailing thought is that Biden winning so narrowly indicates that there were many split ticket voters who chose Biden but voted R on Senate races. It's going to be a massive challenge for the Democrats. Stacey Abrams is working hard, but it may just barely be not enough. Georgia is that Red unfortunately.

[qesehmk]

ICYMI, Dick Durbin is positioning himself as the Democratic lead on the Senate Judiciary Committee after Diane Feinstein essentially got booted out for not resisting the ACB nomination. He could become Chairman if the Democrats win both runoff races in Georgia and could bring about a sea change of reform. But the Georgia races are going to be very tight. The prevailing thought is that Biden winning so narrowly indicates that there were many split ticket voters who chose Biden but voted R on Senate races. It's going to be a massive challenge for the Democrats. Stacey Abrams is working hard, but it may just barely be not enough. Georgia is that Red unfortunately.
Trump's legal shenanigans just might be the thing that energizes dems and demoralizes republicans in GA.

[inspired_p]

Trump's legal shenanigans just might be the thing that energizes dems and demoralizes republicans in GA.

demoralize Republicans ? I doubt it. Loosing Senate majority and hence giving trifecta of power to Democrats is something that will energize the republican voters. with political rhetoric having "stick it to them" , "democrats are the enemy", " Democratic party is party of satan worshippers and pedophiles who also drink children's bloood" ,, there is no way to demoralize the electorate against the DEMs

[qesehmk]

demoralize Republicans ? I doubt it. Loosing Senate majority and hence giving trifecta of power to Democrats is something that will energize the republican voters. with political rhetoric having "stick it to them" , "democrats are the enemy", " Democratic party is party of satan worshippers and pedophiles who also drink children's bloood" ,, there is no way to demoralize the electorate against the DEMs
:o Yes. I misspoke. I should have said independents leaning republican.

[monsieur]

GA senate race will be turned out like NC and SC races. False hopes for Dems that they have chance.

Keep in mind David Perdue already scored 49.73% and missed it by just 0.27% margin which he will overcome as LIB candidate is out of picture now. He also has 85K lead over Dem candidate. As for Kelly Loeffler race, again if you remove other Rep candidate she will cross 50% mark. Warnock was the only Dem and he got only 33% where as Reps vote where split in 2 or more.

Another data point - Special election turnouts are generally lower which help Reps. Ppl over 40-50+ age reliably vote and they vote for Rep. Senate control is as good as gone. This realty shows (so far) in Biden admin picks at cabinet level.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Biden/Harris officially voted by the Electoral College as the President/Vice President of the US.

It's a great day for democracy and also inspirational for first generation American children like many of our own to have an Indian American become VP of the US. I never thought in my lifetime there would be a (half) Tamil Maami who would become VP!

[qesehmk]

Biden/Harris officially voted by the Electoral College as the President/Vice President of the US.

It's a great day for democracy and also inspirational for first generation American children like many of our own to have an Indian American become VP of the US. I never thought in my lifetime there would be a (half) Tamil Maami who would become VP!
Absolutely. Happy that the racist guy will be gone. A moderate sane person will be the president. And a first woman VP and a first desi person VP. I couldn't ask for more.

[Zenzone]

Absolutely. Happy that the racist guy will be gone. A moderate sane person will be the president. And a first woman VP and a first desi person VP. I couldn't ask for more.

You are very tamed and polished! I have very many choice words for the person leaving the WH now ;) But keeping the sanctity of this forum intact!!

[qesehmk]

You are very tamed and polished! I have very many choice words for the person leaving the WH now ;) But keeping the sanctity of this forum intact!!
I am afraid this joy is not going to last Zen. It took a super crazy guy and a mammoth pandemic to dislodge this Trump phenomena. And even then Biden didn't win landslide at all.

Next guy who will replace Trump will be much more savvy, his actions will be meaner and sophisticated and more effective against minorities, non-whites, and immigrants.

It's a shitty time period in our lives when both the countries we love - viz US and India are being ruled by opportunistic dictatorial fake nationalists. Next 10 years are going to be tumultuous.

[Zenzone]

I am afraid this joy is not going to last Zen. It took a super crazy guy and a mammoth pandemic to dislodge this Trump phenomena. And even then Biden didn't win landslide at all.

Next guy who will replace Trump will be much more savvy, his actions will be meaner and sophisticated and more effective against minorities, non-whites, and immigrants.

It's a shitty time period in our lives when both the countries we love - viz US and India are being ruled by opportunistic dictatorial fake nationalists. Next 10 years are going to be tumultuous.

True that! But I still believe in the center right leaning people of this country who will not fully align with the right wing GOP (Example - The Lincoln Project folks). Hence I see this election a bit differently and here is my quick take -

75M + 81M people voted this time which is probably everyone we have in the system. All the ppl. who could have shown up actually showed up and every eligible voter in the Trump train as well as in the Biden camp came out and still the arithmetic didn't work for a classic Trumpian political agenda. This simple fact gives me hope for the future that for anyone who aspires to succeed DT should need to do something to make that raw arithmetic to work for them. For them to achieve it they need to tone it down a notch so that those priced Center-leaning right GOP/Independents are sold for that GOP ticket in the future. Call me an eternal optimist or a contrarian and I would say that's not an understatement :)

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

True that! But I still believe in the center right leaning people of this country who will not fully align with the right wing GOP (Example - The Lincoln Project folks). Hence I see this election a bit differently and here is my quick take -

75M + 81M people voted this time which is probably everyone we have in the system. All the ppl. who could have shown up actually showed up and every eligible voter in the Trump train as well as in the Biden camp came out and still the arithmetic didn't work for a classic Trumpian political agenda. This simple fact gives me hope for the future that for anyone who aspires to succeed DT should need to do something to make that raw arithmetic to work for them. For them to achieve it they need to tone it down a notch so that those priced Center-leaning right GOP/Independents are sold for that GOP ticket in the future. Call me an eternal optimist or a contrarian and I would say that's not an understatement :)

The best thing to happen would be for Trump to hang around and suck all the oxygen and the donations from other GOP hopefuls for 2024 and then soundly get his arse beat again in 2024. He is going to be a destructive influence for the next four years unfortunately so mentally get prepared for it. Unless there is some concrete evidence that SDNY has on the Trump Org financials to nail them to the wall, he will be running around mucking stuff up non-stop.

[qesehmk]

True that! But I still believe in the center right leaning people of this country who will not fully align with the right wing GOP (Example - The Lincoln Project folks). Hence I see this election a bit differently and here is my quick take -

75M + 81M people voted this time which is probably everyone we have in the system. All the ppl. who could have shown up actually showed up and every eligible voter in the Trump train as well as in the Biden camp came out and still the arithmetic didn't work for a classic Trumpian political agenda. This simple fact gives me hope for the future that for anyone who aspires to succeed DT should need to do something to make that raw arithmetic to work for them. For them to achieve it they need to tone it down a notch so that those priced Center-leaning right GOP/Independents are sold for that GOP ticket in the future. Call me an eternal optimist or a contrarian and I would say that's not an understatement :)

The reason I am concerned is because all that fascism requires is a tiny but vocal and violent minority while the majority watches silently. Over long term things will snap back to middle path. But it's the short term that we should be concerned.

I hope that your optimism about America is well placed! The system at least withstood all the shocks so far it seems.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Guesses on what's going to happen with the runoff? My estimate is that the scumbags Perdue and Loeffler will easily defeat their challengers.

I am trying to see the glass as half-full in that even with a 52-48 majority, the Democrats only need a couple of Republicans to get some things done and it will also prevent the Democrats from doing outlandish things so kinda keep both parties in check. Mitch McConnell will again be king for another 2 years though.

[inspired_p]

Guesses on what's going to happen with the runoff? My estimate is that the scumbags Perdue and Loeffler will easily defeat their challengers.

I am trying to see the glass as half-full in that even with a 52-48 majority, the Democrats only need a couple of Republicans to get some things done and it will also prevent the Democrats from doing outlandish things so kinda keep both parties in check. Mitch McConnell will again be king for another 2 years though.

Agree on who will win the seats.. But do not agree that anything of value will get done , even if democrats have 10 republicans ready to vote with them, any bill can be crushed by just not tabling for a vote, and that has been happening all the while. Do not expect anything to come out of congress. Expect more EOs from Biden administration.

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Agree on who will win the seats.. But do not agree that anything of value will get done , even if democrats have 10 republicans ready to vote with them, any bill can be crushed by just not tabling for a vote, and that has been happening all the while. Do not expect anything to come out of congress. Expect more EOs from Biden administration.

I feel for the guys with PDs in the late 2010s. For us at least, the end seems to be close (by that I mean another 12-18 months, sigh...!). I can't imagine the backlogs that are going to build up over the next 4 years and beyond once the pandemic is over...

[inspired_p]

I feel for the guys with PDs in the late 2010s. For us at least, the end seems to be close (by that I mean another 12-18 months, sigh...!). I can't imagine the backlogs that are going to build up over the next 4 years and beyond once the pandemic is over...

I am a guy with a PD in the late 2010 .. don't you even hope the FAD will will reach end of 2010 in this fiscal year ? That's very pessimistic prediction :(

[qesehmk]

Looks like Dem win both seats. If so - Country caps are going to be history within a year or two.

[inspired_p]

Looks like Dem win both seats. If so - Country caps are going to be history within a year or two.

AWESOME SAUCE ! .. I believe they are counting 'on the day' votes first .. so the current lead seems ominous for the republicans, early voting and mail in ballots are expected to be democratic leaning similar to Nov 3rd election

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Oh my goodness..... MY BOIS..... looks like it's happening!!!!

[Turbulent_Dragonfly]

Democrats take control of the Senate for two years!!!