Discussion of Bills that remove the Per Country Limits - H.R.3012, H,R. 213

[gcq]

The questions is what should be given priority, country cap or EB preference category ?

country cap had the upper hand till 2000. When AC21 was signed into law by Bill Clinton, it gave priority to EB preference category over country cap.

[nostwal]

Will this bill Help

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705391307/Chaffetz-introduces-bill-to-lift-per-country-percentage-caps-on-employment-based-visas.html

[rdsingh79]

If this bill is passed, it would be great relief for all backlogged applicants. It would mean GC on first-in first-out basis regardless of country of birth of the applicant (within each EB category). This means very fair and just system than the existing one.



Will this bill Help

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/705391307/Chaffetz-introduces-bill-to-lift-per-country-percentage-caps-on-employment-based-visas.html

[July2007PD]

this bill is very very important I was involved in this bill in my company 6 months ago .... We had made any lobbying efforts and has high chances of passing ... Let's keep fingers crossed .... Last major bill before elections fellas

[stillanoptimist]

Thanks for the link. I hope this bill passes too.
only hope for folks with EB2 PDs 2008 and beyond and especially EB3IC.
would have been good to get other measures like visa recapture, stem exemption etc but frankly those have no chance in the current Republican held House so we will take wht we can get.
I strongly support this bill




this bill is very very important I was involved in this bill in my company 6 months ago .... We had made any lobbying efforts and has high chances of passing ... Let's keep fingers crossed .... Last major bill before elections fellas

[immitime]

my view on this. this is only my view people can differ and I accept that is their veiw.. no fights regarding this.

More than Country cap more than EB preference, GC should be issued on a First come First Serverd basis immateiral of country, category.

[qesehmk]

The situation today is as follows:

The country cap exists @7% of EB+FB limit. The only exception to country cap is spillovers / unused visas from other countries/categories. The unused visas are allocated by category rather than by country - the preference being EB5 ->EB1 -> EB2 -> EB3.

I think the best solution is to have a first in first out by category. This preserves the purpose of category while not discriminating based on country origin. There are multiple things additionally that can be done:
1. Do not require any quota for dependents
2. Do not require any quota for EB1A EB1B
3. Double the immigration limit.
4. If not FIFO, at least make country quota proportionate to the population of that country. Madagascar and China shouldn't have same limits!!

There could be many others..but these are pretty much key ones.

[geterdone]

H.R.3012 - To amend the Immigration and Nationality Act to eliminate the per-country numerical limitation for employment-based immigrants, to increase the per-country numerical limitation for family-sponsored immigrants, and for other purposes.

This was introduced on 09/21/2011 by 2 republicans. if this gets passed, (yes the big 'IF') will it be good or bad for EB2I?

[immitime]

Thanks Q,

there are two bills in congress one Rep. Jason Chaffetz from Utah and Rep. Lamar Smith introduced H.R.3012 and one Rep Zoe Lofgrens H.R. 2161.. if both of them passes the house and senate and becomes law, which is a dream and lot of pulling and pushing may occur if at all those comes for the floor votes. but Hypothetically what you have posted are there in those bills. Even though it is a political game by two parties but as election year any thing can happen.

These are the only scope for Eb-3 India who filed before Year 2006.

If anyone have any ohter way for EB-3 India people who are terribly backlogged Please spill some light. and I am sure with the existing laws, EB-3 India will never ever move more than a week or a month each VB!

[nishant2200]

Will be good.

This is a very contention point issue though, and if you see trackitt, most other nationalities are bashing this idea. This is a main bullet point being lobbied for by IV also.

I personally feel the biggest non controversial relief can be:
1. Capture unused visas from previous years.
2. Do not count dependents towards visa number limitation in Employment Based.

1 would be least controversial. 2 will still generate debate.

1 will give relief to huge backlog of people currently waiting, while 2 will ensure a good degree of waiting time relief to new incoming.

Further:
1. A memo similar to Kazarian for EB1C



H.R.3012 - To amend the Immigration and Nationality Act to eliminate the per-country numerical limitation for employment-based immigrants, to increase the per-country numerical limitation for family-sponsored immigrants, and for other purposes.

This was introduced on 09/21/2011 by 2 republicans. if this gets passed, (yes the big 'IF') will it be good or bad for EB2I?

[Pedro Gonzales]

Will be good.
This is a very contention point issue though, and if you see trackitt, most other nationalities are bashing this idea.
I personally feel the biggest non controversial relief can be:
1. Capture unused visas from previous years.
2. Do not count dependents towards visa number limitation in Employment Based.


I disagree. The contention on this bill is between two sets of immigrants. Both sets of immigrants are relatively unimportant to the legislators compared to the unemployed citizens and businesses.

The way I see it,
This bill Benefits: EB I & C immigrants and businesses; Disadvantages: Non I & C EB immigrants; Unaffected: Average American citizens
Both options 1 (recapturing old visa numbers) and 2 (not counting dependents) accelerates the # of permanent residents in the US. So they Advantage: EB I & C immigrants, Non I & C immigrants and businesses; Disadvantage: average American citizens (at least is seen this way by the anti immigration lobby);

As far as legislators are concerned, this bill is a whole lot more palatable to their constituents.

Btw, is there any site that describes the status of all the different legal immigration bills that have been floating around?

[nishant2200]

Sure, there can be debates on all this.

http://www.opencongress.org/ is a good website.


I disagree. The contention on this bill is between two sets of immigrants. Both sets of immigrants are relatively unimportant to the legislators compared to the unemployed citizens and businesses.

The way I see it,
This bill Benefits: EB I & C immigrants and businesses; Disadvantages: Non I & C EB immigrants; Unaffected: Average American citizens
Both options 1 (recapturing old visa numbers) and 2 (not counting dependents) accelerates the # of permanent residents in the US. So they Advantage: EB I & C immigrants, Non I & C immigrants and businesses; Disadvantage: average American citizens (at least is seen this way by the anti immigration lobby);

As far as legislators are concerned, this bill is a whole lot more palatable to their constituents.

Btw, is there any site that describes the status of all the different legal immigration bills that have been floating around?

[iamdeb]

How long will it take the Chaffetz & Smith bill to be passed and implemented?

[Pedro Gonzales]

How long will it take the Chaffetz & Smith bill to be passed and implemented?

If it garners support (which is questionable, since it isn't a hot issue for anyone, Democrat or Republican) it may well take 8 months. Check out this page which describes the legislative process: http://www.murthy.com/news/UDlegpro.html
In particular pay attention to all the stages that the bill could die.

[imdeng]

All the bills floating right now are just political posturing - I don't think anything will get passed until we are out of the recession and unemployment drops. This bill, although, will greatly help EB2IC if it passes. I really have no hope of legislative relief, no faith in the legislative system (Congress/Presidency) to take up our cause - we are too insignificant in their plans.

The best option for us is to keep our noses clean, hold on to our jobs, keep renewing your H1B (thank you AC21!) and wait until your date becomes current. Meanwhile, forums like this provide us with a semblance of transparency in the process. I know I sound pessimistic but that's where I am.

BTW - I don't wish to get politics in the discussion - but seems like Republicans are more of a friend of legal employment based immigration than Democrats are. It sucks that Republicans are also against almost every other issues of priority for me. No that it matters - I don't have a vote anyways.



I disagree. The contention on this bill is between two sets of immigrants. Both sets of immigrants are relatively unimportant to the legislators compared to the unemployed citizens and businesses.

The way I see it,
This bill Benefits: EB I & C immigrants and businesses; Disadvantages: Non I & C EB immigrants; Unaffected: Average American citizens
Both options 1 (recapturing old visa numbers) and 2 (not counting dependents) accelerates the # of permanent residents in the US. So they Advantage: EB I & C immigrants, Non I & C immigrants and businesses; Disadvantage: average American citizens (at least is seen this way by the anti immigration lobby);

As far as legislators are concerned, this bill is a whole lot more palatable to their constituents.

[manubhai]

This is probably the only bill out there that truly has any chance of becoming a law - because it does NOT change the total number of green cards issued per year.

You can spend about 2 minutes to login and vote in its support here:
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show
and here...
https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/112/hr3012

And you can read about it here:
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h112-3012

Go and press the Support button NOW!!!

[kd2008]

This was my letter:

I am writing as your constituent in the 1st Congressional district of xyz. I support H.R.3012 - To amend the Immigration and Nationality Act to eliminate the per-country numerical limitation for employment-based immigrants.

The Immigration and Nationality Act generally provides that the total number of employment-based immigrant visas made available to natives of any foreign country in a year cannot exceed 7% of the total number of such visas made available in that year. The bill eliminates this per country percentage cap.

The current percentage cap has created a backlog of qualified workers. American companies view all highly skilled immigrants as the same regardless of where they are from, and our immigration policy should do the same.

HR 3012 creates a fair and equitable, “first come, first serve” system. Under this system, US companies will be able to focus on what they do best – hiring smart people to create products, services, and jobs for Americans.

Current law prohibits US employers from hiring foreign workers to fill these jobs unless there are not sufficient US workers who are able, willing, qualified, and available. The employment of the immigrant will not adversely affect the wages and working conditions of similarly employed workers in the US. HR 3012 does not change this, but it does encourage high skilled immigrants who were educated in the US to stay and contribute to our economy, rather than taking the skills they learned and aiding our competitor nations.

I urge you to support this bill and ensure its quick passage into law.

Sincerely,
xxx yyy

[kd2008]

Also support White House petitions:

https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/legal-employment-based-immigration-petitioners-help-us-companies-and-should-not-be-heavily/1NLS8G5c

https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/allow-seriously-backlogged-eb2eb3-beneficiaries-their-i-140-approved-file-i-485-and-apply-ead-ap/d3D62yTt

[manubhai]

Signed. Thanks for the links KD.


Also support White House petitions:

https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/legal-employment-based-immigration-petitioners-help-us-companies-and-should-not-be-heavily/1NLS8G5c

https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/petition/allow-seriously-backlogged-eb2eb3-beneficiaries-their-i-140-approved-file-i-485-and-apply-ead-ap/d3D62yTt

[manubhai]

For folks wondering how to send a letter... you could use the same opencongress.org link as mentioned above:
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show

[immitime]

This is not going to harm anyone. Just need another signature. If you get Ciitzenship like this, this will save another 5 years of your wait time to this long journey...

Short URL: http://wh.gov/4ki
Save and Share this URL: https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions/!/petition/citizenship-people-who-are-legally-living-usa-more-10-years-who-has-bought-house-and-paid-tax/mQXpMRDb

[gc0907]

I don't understand this clearly if anyone can explain:

1: How will this save 5 years of wait time? At the end of the year, the unused visas are still available to IC as spill over.
2: What about the countries the underutilized countries? If there is no limit won't the over demanding countries IC eat up all the visas and countries with less demand might not get enough.

May be I might be misunderstanding but I don't see it making a major difference and also it might harm under utilized countries.

[gcq]

I don't understand this clearly if anyone can explain:

1: How will this save 5 years of wait time? At the end of the year, the unused visas are still available to IC as spill over.
2: What about the countries the underutilized countries? If there is no limit won't the over demanding countries IC eat up all the visas and countries with less demand might not get enough.

May be I might be misunderstanding but I don't see it making a major difference and also it might harm under utilized countries.

Country of birth should not be a factor in EB green cards. This will award green cards based on "first come first served'. If a ROW candidate applies for his GC before I/C guy, ROW guy will get it first. This brings fairness to the system.

[gc0907]

Country of birth should not be a factor in EB green cards. This will award green cards based on "first come first served'. If a ROW candidate applies for his GC before I/C guy, ROW guy will get it first. This brings fairness to the system.

I think it will be unfair to the countries from which demand is less. Most of the visas will be used by IC due to high demand.

[gcq]

I think it will be unfair to the countries from which demand is less. Most of the visas will be used by IC due to high demand.
If a candidate from country with low demand (ROW) applies before a candidate from I/C, ROW candidate will get his GC first. If I/C candidate applies first, he will get it first. There won't be any preferential treatment for anyone ( which is happening as per the current rules). Employer doesn't care about the country of birth of a candidate, they only care about the skills that the candidate brings to the table.

[kd2008]

Like the earlier poster said, visas will be given on a first come, first serve basis. So if in a year India and China are 80% of the applications then they will get 80% of the visas and ROW be 20%. Right now even if India and China are 80% they get 7% each and then spillover if any remaining. Isn't this unfair to India and China? This unfairness is fixed by this bill.

Of course, ROW won't be current & retrogress because of this bill and they have to wait longer than before - but it will be still much less than India and China who wait over 5 yrs on average right now.

[manubhai]

Folks,
I urge you to vote in support of the bills and petitions.

As many have already stated, this forum is an amazing collection of people who are united behind a cause that effects them greatly. However, it is one thing for us to talk, and something else for us to take an action, however small it may be.

These bills and petitions you may have seen floating around in the last few days, if you choose to show your support for them, require a time "loss" of about 3-4 minutes (including registration or login and voting).

Please sleep 4 minutes late tonight and wake up at the usual time tomorrow to cover up the "loss". If half of the people who visit this board regularly do that, we'll get a good amount of attention to a very fair and just cause that truly does assist the US economy.

And a personal note on the difference between the bill (HR 3012) and the petitions - Please remember that the petitions cannot be converted into a law by a Presidential executive order. These petitions will require some congressman to put into a bill some time in the future. A "bill", like HR 3012, is already set in motion. I get that it has a long way to go, but its still less than something that might just ONLY get 6000 votes and will then need to start its long road ahead. Having 10-15 congressmen take note of HR 3012 because of your going to opencongress.org and spending 5 minutes writing will be a huge move forward.

The strength of HR 3012 is that it is something that is palatable to immigration hawks. It does NOT increase the number of green cards per year. It does NOT try to get more aliens to "steal" American jobs. It basically says one thing: First come, First served. (And anti-immigration media has already started labeling it as another job killer in the making)

Also note that non-Indians and non-Chinese are effected by this bill negatively and will try to oppose it. My only statement is that things are so unfair today and that the leveling of this playing field should not be considered as unfair by non-IC beneficiaries. Also, if both the immigration hawks AND non-IC beneficiaries are going to be opposing this, it is even more important for IC beneficiaries to show their support.

It is my opinion that this bill is the strongest and most "passable" bill we have seen in years. Its sponsors Jason Chaffetz and especially Lamar Smith are serious heavyweights in the Republican party. Given the breakdown and deadlocks in DC, having a real law passed to make wait times bearable is really a fantasy. This thing is the closest to fantasy we have.

The links for HR. 3012:
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show
and here...
https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/112/hr3012

Please make sure you show your support on both of them, and write to your congressman via opencongress.

Thank you and Good luck!!

[manubhai]

This is the White House petition for supporting HR 3012: Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act.

The summary of this bill is: FIRST COME, FIRST SERVED - If your priority date is before mine, you should get your green card before I do, regardless of your or my country of origin.

Please sign the petition here: http://wh.gov/4d1

Please remember: At the end of the day, even if this bill does not pass, it is extremely important to bring to the attention of the people and the administration, the years of wait that some of us have to go through. Your vote on this petition and the bill, along with writing to your congressmen, could be the push that makes LEGAL immigration an urgent and important enough issue for people to consider more seriously.

I urge you to do your little part in this process by signing that petition.

You can also write to your congressmen:http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show

You can also show your support for HR 3012 by pressing the support button on POPVOX: https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/112/hr3012

[longgcque]

done .. spread the word too on other forums and facebook ..

[manubhai]

done .. spread the word too on other forums and facebook ..


+1. Also spread on facebbok.

Thank you! I am trying what I can. I am thoroughly confused why this bill is not getting as much attention as it should in the Indian and Chinese community. Instead of an in-the-air fantasy petition that will have to be "pushed" by the white house, this is a real bill that already exists and has the support of - at least - two heavy weight congressmen (that too Republicans). I hope people take the time to read and recognize what this bill proposes.

[Kanmani]

Friends

When we look into the text of H.R.3012 Bill here..http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr3012ih/pdf/BILLS-112hr3012ih.pdf,

it speaks about the transition rules ( If the bill enacted ) for EB based in the years 2012, 13,14 ... how the visas should be split among ROW and backlogged countries........ After 2014 it is first come first serve

I think the house reps have already discussed abt moving forward with this bill....and has a good chance of passing in the House. But the Senate passage has no clue ......

I am hoping for the best.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Friends

When we look into the text of H.R.3012 Bill here..http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-112hr3012ih/pdf/BILLS-112hr3012ih.pdf,

it speaks about the transition rules ( If the bill enacted ) for EB based in the years 2012, 13,14 ... how the visas should be split among ROW and backlogged countries........ After 2014 it is first come first serve

I think the house reps have already discussed abt moving forward with this bill....and has a good chance of passing in the House. But the Senate passage has no clue ......

I am hoping for the best.

Here's a quick summary of the bill.

a) It eliminates per country limits for EB by FY 2015, but it drastically increases it right away.
b) While the split of EB1, 2, 3, 4 & 5 does not change (40K each for EBs 1 through 3), for 2012, all but 15% is now open to all countries (6K reserved in each category, so 34K open; increasing to 36K in FY 2013 & FY2014).
c) That 6K (dropping to 4K in 2013 & 2014) is reserved for all countries other than India and China, whereas for the remaining 34K visa numbers, all countries can compete based on PDs (its basically India and China for at least FY2012 and probably most of FY 2013 too since the others are all current right now).
d) There is also a limit of 28K (28,028) per country, that may or may not apply for EB2 India in the first few years. I wasn't able to tell based on the analysis Spec & Q and others have done what the split is between India and China post July 2007.
e) The biggest winners will be EB3 India (should move to Sep 2004), EB2 I & China (should move to Sep 2009) and to a lesser extent EB3 China, Mexico and Phillipines (should catch up with EB3 ROW and move to around Sep 2005) all by the end of FY 2012. The biggest losers would be EB2 ROW which will retrogress to around Sep 2009.

Here's the fundamentals of my analysis for EB2. EB2 I & C will now have 34K of available visa numbers + 20K of estimated spillover falls down (will be lower than previous estimates because there will no longer be EB2 ROW FA; Q estimates in the first post of this thread that 22.6K of EB1 + EB5 FD came to EB2 I & C last year, i assumed a slight discount to that in FY 2012) to provide 54K visa numbers for EB2 I & C.
Using Spec's sheet (http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?172-Cut-Off-Dates-in-FY2012-for-Levels-of-SOFAD-amp-Porting-Cases-Not-Approved-in-FY2011) and his assumptions of 8.1K backlog, 1.5K left over applicants from FY 2011 (pre April 2007) and 3K porters (midway of his range), we get to the bottom of his chart (Jan 2009) having used up only 49.5K visa numbers. It looks from the bottom of that chart that we are looking at roughly 500 applicants per month, so the remaining 4.5K available visa numbers (54 - 49.5) should move us another 9 months to Sep/Oct 2009.

Even without spillover, this bill would permit 8.5K of movement per quarter, allowing movement to Sep 07 by Q2, Jan 08 in Q3, and May 08 by Q4. Nothing but good news if this bill becomes law. Something to keep our eye on.

Kanmani, i'm nominating you our legislative process coordinator. Please keep us informed as and when you find out more.

[manubhai]

... Still, sure you agree that it is nowhere near as unfair as per country limits, which discriminate based on nationality, while this tries to discriminate based on qualifications...


Completely agree. It makes no sense to delay interim benefits to EB folks. The need for the GC job is right now, not 5 years later on. EB should be more about the need for the job being filled, not about diversity. There is GC lottery for diversity where India and China can't apply, as well as FB is always there for diversity.

Pedro, Nishant - I agree.

Based on your statements, I ask you to show your support and spread the word for HR 3012's petition here... http://wh.gov/4d1

Just started... and I am getting as many others as I can to join in. Please sign the petition.

[manubhai]

Kanmani... you too...

http://wh.gov/4d1

A bill under consideration already in the house is the best shot we have of getting attention to our cause.

[iamdeb]

How long will it take for the bill to pass?
Since its mentioning starting fiscal year 2012 (which starts next week) I believe it should pass within next 3-4 months.

[nishant2200]

How long will it take for the bill to pass?
Since its mentioning starting fiscal year 2012 (which starts next week) I believe it should pass within next 3-4 months.

I hope this one is clubbed with economic recovery, how this will help economic recovery. That is the main catalyst that would help the bill, not because the system is unfair or any sympathy for legal immigration.

[Kanmani]

How long will it take for the bill to pass?
Since its mentioning starting fiscal year 2012 (which starts next week) I believe it should pass within next 3-4 months.

Unless it is a bipartisan bill ( Republicans & Democrats both agree unanimously) it takes atleast 6 months to pass.

actual process of the bill is getting passed in both House and Senate before presented for signature to President (H & S are like Rajya sabha and Lokh sabha in India but here unlike RS, house members are also elected by people)

The drawback is after got passed in House, around 400 Bills are sleeping in the Senate as of 2010 without consideration.

So we cannot celebrate even if it gets passed in the House .

Various news agencies report that Republicans are very keen to pass atleast one legal immigration bill to raise their election fund from IT companies.

Thats why I am hoping for the best with fingers crossed

[immitime]

How long will it take for the bill to pass?
Since its mentioning starting fiscal year 2012 (which starts next week) I believe it should pass within next 3-4 months.

How a Bill becomes a law

http://www.usconstitution.net/consttop_law.html

[qesehmk]

RMS, I think you have made your point clear about online petitions' futility in bringing any change in immigration system.

However, this forum has certain decorum that people generally maintain. I will appreciate if you could maintain it. I hate to put any restrictions on anyone. And we have done it only on one user in the last 1 year of our existence. So I request you to calm down and engage in meaningful dialogue. Disagreements are ok. Attacks are not ok.


immitime: what do you stand for?
You lobby for removal of per country visa cap and support EB3 I. Now for convenience you pity EB3 ROW just so that EB2 I does not get spillover. Don't flip flop. Take a stand and stick to it please
I don't buy the fact that an immi forum can change rules please...shows your maturity level

[stillanoptimist]

fyi,Here is the press release last week from the congressman who introduced this bill

http://chaffetz.house.gov/press-releases/2011/09/chaffetz-introduces-immigration-bill.shtml

[Spectator]

Here's a quick summary of the bill.

a) It eliminates per country limits for EB by FY 2015, but it drastically increases it right away.
b) While the split of EB1, 2, 3, 4 & 5 does not change (40K each for EBs 1 through 3), for 2012, all but 15% is now open to all countries (6K reserved in each category, so 34K open; increasing to 36K in FY 2013 & FY2014).
c) That 6K (dropping to 4K in 2013 & 2014) is reserved for all countries other than India and China, whereas for the remaining 34K visa numbers, all countries can compete based on PDs (its basically India and China for at least FY2012 and probably most of FY 2013 too since the others are all current right now).
d) There is also a limit of 28K (28,028) per country, that may or may not apply for EB2 India in the first few years. I wasn't able to tell based on the analysis Spec & Q and others have done what the split is between India and China post July 2007.
e) The biggest winners will be EB3 India (should move to Sep 2004), EB2 I & China (should move to Sep 2009) and to a lesser extent EB3 China, Mexico and Phillipines (should catch up with EB3 ROW and move to around Sep 2005) all by the end of FY 2012. The biggest losers would be EB2 ROW which will retrogress to around Sep 2009.

Here's the fundamentals of my analysis for EB2. EB2 I & C will now have 34K of available visa numbers + 20K of estimated spillover falls down (will be lower than previous estimates because there will no longer be EB2 ROW FA; Q estimates in the first post of this thread that 22.6K of EB1 + EB5 FD came to EB2 I & C last year, i assumed a slight discount to that in FY 2012) to provide 54K visa numbers for EB2 I & C.
Using Spec's sheet (http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?172-Cut-Off-Dates-in-FY2012-for-Levels-of-SOFAD-amp-Porting-Cases-Not-Approved-in-FY2011) and his assumptions of 8.1K backlog, 1.5K left over applicants from FY 2011 (pre April 2007) and 3K porters (midway of his range), we get to the bottom of his chart (Jan 2009) having used up only 49.5K visa numbers. It looks from the bottom of that chart that we are looking at roughly 500 applicants per month, so the remaining 4.5K available visa numbers (54 - 49.5) should move us another 9 months to Sep/Oct 2009.

Even without spillover, this bill would permit 8.5K of movement per quarter, allowing movement to Sep 07 by Q2, Jan 08 in Q3, and May 08 by Q4. Nothing but good news if this bill becomes law. Something to keep our eye on.

Kanmani, i'm nominating you our legislative process coordinator. Please keep us informed as and when you find out more.Pedro,

Just to add to your post.

For Unreserved visas (those for IC initially), no Country may use more than 70% of that total.

For Reserved visas (to be split between Mexico, Philippines & ROW), no Country may use more than 25% of that total.

The limits would be:

-------------- FY2012 -- FY2013 -- FY2014 -- FY2015 on
Reserved ------ 15% ----- 10% ---- 10% ---------- 0%
Total Visas -- 40,040 -- 40,040 -- 40,040 -- 40,040

Reserved ------ 6,006 --- 4,004 --- 4,004 ------- 0
25% ----------- 1,502 --- 1,001 --- 1,001 ------- 0

Unreserved --- 34,034 -- 36,036 -- 36,036 -- 40,040
70% ---------- 23,824 -- 25,225 -- 25,225 -- 28,028

Effectively, for FY2012 that would initially be :

China ------- 10,210 (34,034 minus 23,824)
India ------- 23,824 (70% limit)
Mexico ------- 1,502 (25% limit)
Philippines -- 1,502 (25% limit)
ROW ---------- 3,002 (Remainder)
Total ------- 40,040

In reality, for EB2, Mexico doesn't use 1,502 visas, so some would be shared between Philippines and ROW.

The same Reserved/Unreserved splits and maximums of 70%/25% also seems to be applied to Spillover, although the language is not entirely clear.

The EB2-C Cut Off Date would accelerate rapidly, probably catching EB2-ROW-MP in FY2013.

Assuming continued high demand from EB2-I beyond FY2010 PDs and the 70% limit, the Cut Off Dates for EB2-I would not equal EB2-C-MP-ROW until around FY2019/FY2020.

At this point, all Countries would be retrogressed by around 2.5 years by my rough calculation.

EB3 is much more difficult to calculate. China doesn't have the demand, but Philippines does for the period CY2006 onwards and Mexico demand is always a mystery.

EB3-I might catch up to ROW Cut Off date fairly quickly, but all Countries would end up around 8 years retrogressed and increasing.

[gcseeker]

Manubhai ,Kanmani,Immitime,Pedro and others

Really good effort to spread the word about petitions and other actions which will help post 2008 applicants down the lane in cutting short the green card wait time.

I fully support the petitioning process and desire to act instead of letting the system take its toll.However just want to voice some thoughts which might not be popular but might help people understand the process better.Also it might help temper the expectations of some of the new forum members who might get carried away with the emotion and plan accordingly that something will get passed this year or the next.

The emotion behind the petitions is great.Signing and forwarding them and spending the time for them is great. Let me just add the reality part of it too so that people can get the entire picture.

1.Bills will not pass if they are good for the USA .The high priority jobs bill of the president is an good example..with the country on the verge of an double dip recession and with unemployment as high as 12% in some states.You would think this bill would pass in a heartbeat and nobody can even deny it is good for the Usa.

Bills will only pass if you can pitch it properly to the Dem and Repub bases.You will always need a strong senator who can get behind the bill to get it passed.

Targetting senators like Rubio(R) of Florida and Daryl Issa (R) of Sandiego would be examples.

2.Gc stapling to Master's bill will be shot down in ten seconds primarily due to the opposition of organizations like IEEE and many others. IEEE primarily catering to semiconductor industry and allied networking/embedded industry has been a strong opponent of increasing gc quota's and work visas even though Organizations like Intel/MSFT/Qualcomm have for years been saying there is an shortage.The ground reality is even within a specialized field like Chip design there is high unemployment. The recession did not hit all sectors the same way. Silicon valley might be booming with hiring in companies like Zynga/Facebook/Google with unheard of salaries. At the same every month one or the other engineering company keeps on laying off people.If you are an 50 yr old electrical engineer out of work ...you will be mighty pissed off at the immigrants who are being given those jobs.

Again various sectors...various stakeholders.

3.Ground political reality. Obama currently has the lowest ratings of his entire term .Even in a deep blue state like California he is way down in his approval ratings. Perry can definetly give him an run for his money if he can win the Repub primaries.Repubs already control the house.It will take only 4 seats to flip the senate which can be done.

So Either you get an Repub President with control of both house and senate or Obama is re-elected and stuck with an Repub controlled house and senate.

Only scenario 1 will be favourable to any Immigration bills (Only high tech no sweeping Comprehensive stuff ) . Scenario 2 will be the worst because it will be essentially an repeat of last two years.


The only bill that will ever get passed will need to have the blessing of the Repub senators in both scenarios.Also honestly and truly speaking next year is an election year.People will be busy campaigning. The bill would have to be voted in by December to have an chance to become Law.If an all important jobs bill can get logjammed ...any other bill will easily get stuck

I would still spread the word around in the hope something happens in 2013 and realistically would plan rest of my career in such a way that promotions and other stuff are maximized before that and would not bank on any of this stuff passing.

Sorry to rain on the parade.Just sharing my opinion.

[skpanda]

good analysis...

However, I doubt if this will kick off in 2012 (Assuming it is passed)

Since FY 2012 starts next week. Approvals will start coming.
USCIS will need some time to change their systems and may advise that right time to do this will be FY2013.


Here's a quick summary of the bill.

a) It eliminates per country limits for EB by FY 2015, but it drastically increases it right away.
b) While the split of EB1, 2, 3, 4 & 5 does not change (40K each for EBs 1 through 3), for 2012, all but 15% is now open to all countries (6K reserved in each category, so 34K open; increasing to 36K in FY 2013 & FY2014).
c) That 6K (dropping to 4K in 2013 & 2014) is reserved for all countries other than India and China, whereas for the remaining 34K visa numbers, all countries can compete based on PDs (its basically India and China for at least FY2012 and probably most of FY 2013 too since the others are all current right now).
d) There is also a limit of 28K (28,028) per country, that may or may not apply for EB2 India in the first few years. I wasn't able to tell based on the analysis Spec & Q and others have done what the split is between India and China post July 2007.
e) The biggest winners will be EB3 India (should move to Sep 2004), EB2 I & China (should move to Sep 2009) and to a lesser extent EB3 China, Mexico and Phillipines (should catch up with EB3 ROW and move to around Sep 2005) all by the end of FY 2012. The biggest losers would be EB2 ROW which will retrogress to around Sep 2009.

Here's the fundamentals of my analysis for EB2. EB2 I & C will now have 34K of available visa numbers + 20K of estimated spillover falls down (will be lower than previous estimates because there will no longer be EB2 ROW FA; Q estimates in the first post of this thread that 22.6K of EB1 + EB5 FD came to EB2 I & C last year, i assumed a slight discount to that in FY 2012) to provide 54K visa numbers for EB2 I & C.
Using Spec's sheet (http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?172-Cut-Off-Dates-in-FY2012-for-Levels-of-SOFAD-amp-Porting-Cases-Not-Approved-in-FY2011) and his assumptions of 8.1K backlog, 1.5K left over applicants from FY 2011 (pre April 2007) and 3K porters (midway of his range), we get to the bottom of his chart (Jan 2009) having used up only 49.5K visa numbers. It looks from the bottom of that chart that we are looking at roughly 500 applicants per month, so the remaining 4.5K available visa numbers (54 - 49.5) should move us another 9 months to Sep/Oct 2009.

Even without spillover, this bill would permit 8.5K of movement per quarter, allowing movement to Sep 07 by Q2, Jan 08 in Q3, and May 08 by Q4. Nothing but good news if this bill becomes law. Something to keep our eye on.

Kanmani, i'm nominating you our legislative process coordinator. Please keep us informed as and when you find out more.

[nishant2200]

good effort and summarization. thank you.


Here's a quick summary of the bill.

a) It eliminates per country limits for EB by FY 2015, but it drastically increases it right away.
b) While the split of EB1, 2, 3, 4 & 5 does not change (40K each for EBs 1 through 3), for 2012, all but 15% is now open to all countries (6K reserved in each category, so 34K open; increasing to 36K in FY 2013 & FY2014).
c) That 6K (dropping to 4K in 2013 & 2014) is reserved for all countries other than India and China, whereas for the remaining 34K visa numbers, all countries can compete based on PDs (its basically India and China for at least FY2012 and probably most of FY 2013 too since the others are all current right now).
d) There is also a limit of 28K (28,028) per country, that may or may not apply for EB2 India in the first few years. I wasn't able to tell based on the analysis Spec & Q and others have done what the split is between India and China post July 2007.
e) The biggest winners will be EB3 India (should move to Sep 2004), EB2 I & China (should move to Sep 2009) and to a lesser extent EB3 China, Mexico and Phillipines (should catch up with EB3 ROW and move to around Sep 2005) all by the end of FY 2012. The biggest losers would be EB2 ROW which will retrogress to around Sep 2009.

Here's the fundamentals of my analysis for EB2. EB2 I & C will now have 34K of available visa numbers + 20K of estimated spillover falls down (will be lower than previous estimates because there will no longer be EB2 ROW FA; Q estimates in the first post of this thread that 22.6K of EB1 + EB5 FD came to EB2 I & C last year, i assumed a slight discount to that in FY 2012) to provide 54K visa numbers for EB2 I & C.
Using Spec's sheet (http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?172-Cut-Off-Dates-in-FY2012-for-Levels-of-SOFAD-amp-Porting-Cases-Not-Approved-in-FY2011) and his assumptions of 8.1K backlog, 1.5K left over applicants from FY 2011 (pre April 2007) and 3K porters (midway of his range), we get to the bottom of his chart (Jan 2009) having used up only 49.5K visa numbers. It looks from the bottom of that chart that we are looking at roughly 500 applicants per month, so the remaining 4.5K available visa numbers (54 - 49.5) should move us another 9 months to Sep/Oct 2009.

Even without spillover, this bill would permit 8.5K of movement per quarter, allowing movement to Sep 07 by Q2, Jan 08 in Q3, and May 08 by Q4. Nothing but good news if this bill becomes law. Something to keep our eye on.

Kanmani, i'm nominating you our legislative process coordinator. Please keep us informed as and when you find out more.

[Kanmani]

The Job Act is opposed even by the fellow democrats, as the net cost to create 1 job = 200K ( as per CNN)

coming back to our bill HR 3012 , Republicans seem to agree for legal immigration reforms, but the democrats disagree to pass them without any additonal provisions for illegals in the bill. They dont want to support stand alone legal immigration .

[Spectator]

good analysis...

However, I doubt if this will kick off in 2012 (Assuming it is passed)

Since FY 2012 starts next week. Approvals will start coming.
USCIS will need some time to change their systems and may advise that right time to do this will be FY2013.skpanda,

From the text of the Bill: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h112-3012


(d) Effective Date- The amendments made by this section shall take effect as if enacted on September 30, 2011, and shall apply to fiscal years beginning with fiscal year 2012.

If at the time of enactment, more than the 15% have been allocated to ROW-MP, they will have to made Unavailable with immediate effect, since DOS cannot fly contrary to Congress.

It would be a complete mess.

[Pedro Gonzales]

For Unreserved visas (those for IC initially), no Country may use more than 70% of that total.

For Reserved visas (to be split between Mexico, Philippines & ROW), no Country may use more than 25% of that total.

The limits would be:

-------------- FY2012 -- FY2013 -- FY2014 -- FY2015 on
Reserved ------ 15% ----- 10% ---- 10% ---------- 0%
Total Visas -- 40,040 -- 40,040 -- 40,040 -- 40,040

Reserved ------ 6,006 --- 4,004 --- 4,004 ------- 0
25% ----------- 1,502 --- 1,001 --- 1,001 ------- 0

Unreserved --- 34,034 -- 36,036 -- 36,036 -- 40,040
70% ---------- 23,824 -- 25,225 -- 25,225 -- 28,028

Effectively, for FY2012 that would initially be :

China ------- 10,210 (34,034 minus 23,824)
India ------- 23,824 (70% limit)
Mexico ------- 1,502 (25% limit)
Philippines -- 1,502 (25% limit)
ROW ---------- 3,002 (Remainder)
Total ------- 40,040


Spec, I am envious of your ability to clearly disseminate information. Truly remarkable.

I disagree on your read of one issue, though.

The bill reads: "The numbers of visas calculated under this clause for a fiscal year is the number that is equal to 70 percent of the total number of immigrant visas made available under
such section 203(b) for such fiscal year."
I believe that is 70% of the entire 40,040 of each category, not 70% of the 34,034. So, 28,028 instead of 23,824.

GCseeker, I think we're too early in the process to be picking winners and losers. Last election at this stage McCain and Obama were both in 3rd place, (per Rachel Maddow, i myself did not confirm this). Secondly, Perry's performance has been spectacularly bad in the debates that he's participated in thusfar, that he's hardly a shoo in for the nomination. Also, I disagree that the Republican's have a sure shot at winning the Senate and holding the House. Even in my hard core Republican district in Arizona, people are fed up with what they see as Republican stonewalling of all proposals. They aren't thrilled with Obama, but they're sufficiently pissed off with the Republican House too that I'd wait and see some reputable polls before making any conclusions.

However I think your advise to take all this talk with a pinch of salt is very prudent. This bill may make it through the House since Lamar Smith appears to have taken a liking to it, and I think President Obama will sign it if it gets to him, but whether it gets taken up in the Senate at all is very debatable, even ignoring timing.

[Spectator]

The Job Act is opposed even by the fellow democrats, as the net cost to create 1 job = 200K ( as per CNN)

coming back to our bill HR 3012 , Republicans seem to agree for legal immigration reforms, but the democrats disagree to pass them without any additonal provisions for illegals in the bill. They dont want to support stand alone legal immigration .Kanmani,

This Bill is no more than political posturing by the Republicans to derail the far better H.R. 2161: IDEA Act of 2011 http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h112-2161 introduced by Rep. Zoe Lofgren (D - CA), which is entirely focussed on EB immigration and includes visas recapture, not counting dependents and much more, as well as removing the 7% per Country limit for EB.

The Immigration Subcommittee on Immigration Policy and Enforcement is led by Republican hawks, who don't really want anything to happen.

Steve King (R - IA) the vice chairman is not much better than Chuck Grassley (R - IA).
Elton Gallegly, the Chairman, (R - CA) isn't much better.

They both have track records.

[Spectator]

Pedro,

Possibly you are correct

[rdsingh79]

I agree that bill won't go anywhere. Democrat led Senate would probably try to modify the bill by adding DREAM acts provisions, which would be not palatable to House and Senate Republicans. So in summary it is not going anywhere....at the best House will pass it and then nothing will happen.

Senate rules seems so screwy to me...need 60 votes to avoid a filibuster.

Another thing I keep wondering is why did Democrats not pass any immigration reform when they had house majority, 60 seats in Senate and a Democrat president:confused:.




However I think your advise to take all this talk with a pinch of salt is very prudent. This bill may make it through the House since Lamar Smith appears to have taken a liking to it, and I think President Obama will sign it if it gets to him, but whether it gets taken up in the Senate at all is very debatable, even ignoring timing.

[gcseeker]

:) The Messiah was fixated on his legacy of being remembered as the one delivering universal health care .He will for sure get that too in a couple of months when the supreme court overturns the entire thing.Also the dem base will not let anything pass without provisions for illegals who are an huge votebank .

(P.S I have nothing against Obama and frankly speaking both parties are paid and financed by the big money and there is very little difference between both of them in reality )



Another thing I keep wondering is why did Democrats not pass any immigration reform when they had house majority, 60 seats in Senate and a Democrat president:confused:.

[July2007PD]

I was the core member of this until last month and moved onto a different company. We got both dems and rep both to support on the bill it is just a matter of time to pass this bill. If you look at the bill carefully the 15% limit in fb is made to make dems happy. Rep are already in favor ... This is the last chance and the only bill which has high probability of passing and should happen pretty soon. All other bills are just for the name sake ... Just thought I would share some titbits

[qesehmk]

Election Season + Bad Economy + Anti Immigration Sentiment Rising = Zero Chance of Immigration Reform

However if people stop making noise about their plight it pushes their issues even back further in the long list of things to do in front of the government.


I agree that bill won't go anywhere. Democrat led Senate would probably try to modify the bill by adding DREAM acts provisions, which would be not palatable to House and Senate Republicans. So in summary it is not going anywhere....at the best House will pass it and then nothing will happen.

Senate rules seems so screwy to me...need 60 votes to avoid a filibuster.

Another thing I keep wondering is why did Democrats not pass any immigration reform when they had house majority, 60 seats in Senate and a Democrat president:confused:.


I cuncur but this one person gets on to me. Kindly unsubscribe my access rights. Thanks!

Stuff happens. Forget it. You are welcome to put forth divergent views!

[Pedro Gonzales]

I was the core member of this until last month and moved onto a different company. We got both dems and rep both to support on the bill it is just a matter of time to pass this bill. If you look at the bill carefully the 15% limit in fb is made to make dems happy. Rep are already in favor ... This is the last chance and the only bill which has high probability of passing and should happen pretty soon. All other bills are just for the name sake ... Just thought I would share some titbits


J07PD, tell us more. Is there democratic support in the senate too? What's your view on timing?

[Pedro Gonzales]

To shed some light on people's motivations on this forum (with the exception of dec2010ped who appears confused at best, and either masochistic or dishonest about his status at worst), here is a summary of my analysis on what this would do to the PDs if this bill becomes law. My analysis itself is available on Qs forum.

As of end of FY 2012 (Sep 2012),
EB1 remains current.
EB2 I & C would have moved to Sep 2009. EB2 ROW would retrogress to early 2011.
EB3 I would move to Sep 2004. EB3 CM&P would meet EB3 ROW at Dec 2005, with the possibility of potential retrogression by a few months.

The winners (& big winners at that, as against claims by horus and others that the benefit will be insignificant) are EB2 I & C, and EB3 I, all of who's dates move by over 2 years. EB3 C will be lesser winners (1 years movement). The clear losers are EB2 ROW (that retrogress 2 years), and to a lesser extent EB3 MP ROW (that don't move or retrogress by a few months).

I think everybody supporting this bill (regardless of which side of the immigration debate we may stand, anti- or pro-immigration) realizes that this doesn't improve immigration on an absolute basis, and just improves relative position of some nations relative to others. However we argue that this is a) fair, b) in the interests of US businesses, and c) far more likely to pass than any bill that increases absolute immigration levels in the current environment.

a) That removing country limits (so that people with the same qualifications receive their green cards based on PDs) is fair should be obvious to any rational person, just as arguments against some of history's greatest evils like slavery, the holocaust, and Jim Crow laws (civil rights) ought to have been obvious in centuries past. Yet just as millions of people could not be convinced of the injustice inherent to those programs, there is nothing we can say to convince the disbelievers against it.
b) US Industry (check out the testimonies in front of congress from this summer by the CEO of NASDAQ and SVP of Microsoft) believes it is losing out on workers they need (from India and China) that are returning to their home countries because of the long wait times. The fact is, the skills they are looking for today are only filled in large numbers by candidates from India and China. Turkey, Brazil, Russia, South Africa and the other 183 countries out there just don't provide sufficient STEM graduates today. They may in the future, but that doesn't solve the job openings today. Don't take my word for it, just read the transcripts of the senate hearings. They would prefer reform that would help everyone's wait times, but if this is all they can get, they'll take it.
c) Congressman Chaffetz and the others are being intellectually honest with this bill. They do not claim to be pro immigration. They (and their constituents) will support a bill that does not ease immigration limits. Given that this bill does not increase the number of immigrants, it will garner Republican support, if it garners their attention, at all. Since Congressman Lamar Smith has lent his support, I believe it will clear the House. Whether it clears the Senate is another issue, but it is as likely to clear the Senate as any immigration bill is in this session. President Obama is an intellectual and will certainly understand issues 'a' and 'b' above, and he will sign the bill into law if it is presented to him. And as to lobbying support, the immigrant communities with the most power (money, numbers and organization) are the Chinese, followed by the Indians, both groups benefited by the bill. You can be sure that we'll be putting all our effort to make this succeed.

I understand people who are disadvantaged by this bill not wanting to support it. Everyone has a right to act in their self interest. However, don't muddle the argument with claims that it is unfair, anti-US business or unlikely to get passed. For those that are worried that this is a divide and rule mechanism that removes support from immigration reform on the whole, I invite you to support the bill so that there are no issues to divide us any more. Remove our pet peeves, level the playing field for all nations, and we'll combine our resources to fight the remaining battles (recapture visa numbers, disregard dependents from EB quota, increase the annual limits, etc). Those who are familiar with Indian history may remember that Ambedkar (a leader of the lowest castes) was quite against independence because he felt his people would fare worse in an independent India. It wasn't until the independence movement embraced equality for the lowest castes of Indian society that his people joined the freedom struggle in numbers. This is quite similar to that. Give us what you have, and we won't be divided any more.

Finally, to address the diversity issue, Indians from Meghalaya, Bihar, Jammu, Maharashtra and Kerala are about as similar as Europeans from Bulgaria, Finland, England, Germany and Italy. Their languages, foods and cultures are different. The fact that we've united under one nation doesn't make us less diverse than them. I can't speak for the Chinese, but I believe they're not all one people either. In any case, 140K of legal employment based immigration accounts for less than 20% of all immigration and less than 0.05% of the U.S population. Increasing our visa numbers from 7% to 70% of 140K will not move the needle.

I don't expect to have won any dissenters over to my side of the argument, but if I have, say 'aye'.

The above was my response to this issue on the Trackitt forum. I posted it here because I think we all need to address the arguments against the bill wherever we come across it.

[manubhai]

Pedro - You are the man. Couldn't have said it better. Never in my life did I think it will take so much to explain the worthiness of the phrase "First Come First Served".

Folks... if explanations like these on a forum full of Chinese and Indian folks cannot get you to push for this bill, I'm not sure what can.

To those who call this a waste of time: Certainly not. Pushing for a bill isn't a failed cause if the bill doesn't pass. We now have the white house petition system noticing us. Will it help? May be not. But having a few thousand people show their concern, not by staging a protest in front of the capitol on a cold winter night, but by pressing a button, isn't something we should be thinking too much about.

Dont get so used to the "Too bad we have to wait for 5 years" syndrome that you don't realize that there's a slight, but real, possibility out there of things changing. Get out of your self-centered rut of coming to this forum to "READ" for support. Instead, "DO" the little, however little it may be.

MY CALL INCLUDES THE MOST ACTIVE MEMBERS OF THIS FORUM, WHO ARE LIKELY TO BECOME CURRENT SOON, AND ARE NOT GOING TO BE DIRECTLY AFFECTED BY THIS BILL.

As Pedro said best...
""
... we argue that this is a) fair, b) in the interests of US businesses, and c) far more likely to pass than any bill that increases absolute immigration levels in the current environment.
""

Note that beneficiaries from EVERY COUNTRY other than IC will oppose this. It is even more important for you to support it. The petition must cross 150 votes for it to be visible to public at large.

************************************************** *********
Here's the DOING PART 1: http://wh.gov/4d1

Here's the DOING PART 2: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show

Here's the DOING PART 3: https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/112/hr3012
************************************************** *********

[July2007PD]

J07PD, tell us more. Is there democratic support in the senate too? What's your view on timing?

Yes we have democratic support in senate as well. The bill got tweaked after a zillion efforts and meetings with them.

[nishant2200]

I am with you guys. I have done all 3 and am going to email all my friends, and even call few of them who I know are lazy. I might even print this out and put on indian store near my home.


Pedro - You are the man. Couldn't have said it better. Never in my life did I think it will take so much to explain the worthiness of the phrase "First Come First Served".

Folks... if explanations like these on a forum full of Chinese and Indian folks cannot get you to push for this bill, I'm not sure what can.

To those who call this a waste of time: Certainly not. Pushing for a bill isn't a failed cause if the bill doesn't pass. We now have the white house petition system noticing us. Will it help? May be not. But having a few thousand people show their concern, not by staging a protest in front of the capitol on a cold winter night, but by pressing a button, isn't something we should be thinking too much about.

Dont get so used to the "Too bad we have to wait for 5 years" syndrome that you don't realize that there's a slight, but real, possibility out there of things changing. Get out of your self-centered rut of coming to this forum to "READ" for support. Instead, "DO" the little, however little it may be.

MY CALL INCLUDES THE MOST ACTIVE MEMBERS OF THIS FORUM, WHO ARE LIKELY TO BECOME CURRENT SOON, AND ARE NOT GOING TO BE DIRECTLY AFFECTED BY THIS BILL.

As Pedro said best...
""
... we argue that this is a) fair, b) in the interests of US businesses, and c) far more likely to pass than any bill that increases absolute immigration levels in the current environment.
""

Note that beneficiaries from EVERY COUNTRY other than IC will oppose this. It is even more important for you to support it. The petition must cross 150 votes for it to be visible to public at large.

************************************************** *********
Here's the DOING PART 1: http://wh.gov/4d1

Here's the DOING PART 2: http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show

Here's the DOING PART 3: https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/112/hr3012
************************************************** *********

[vishnu]

July2007PD - I am confused. I appreciate your comments on this bill, but when you say 'we have democrat support...how do you know? I don't mean to sound rude, but purely asking out of ignorance.

[ssvp22]

For all the jibber jabber that nothing can be done without passing a bill, you have this - http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/info/info_4172.html . While, i can be wrong, but i have not seen a bill come along.

[nishant2200]

For all the jibber jabber that nothing can be done without passing a bill, you have this - http://travel.state.gov/visa/immigrants/info/info_4172.html . While, i can be wrong, but i have not seen a bill come along.

There's 10000 U visas too. There's all sorts of ways.

Frankly speaking, there's just too many of us :D

Entire life waiting in lines!

Let's hope USCIS backlog carries on n we keep getting goodies from our SO sources.

mango dilse milega zaroor. Doston meri dil ki dua aap sabke liye.

From Lord of the rings:

The Road goes ever on and on
Out from the door where it began.
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
Let others follow it who can!
Let them a journey new begin,
But I at last with weary feet
Will turn towards the lighted inn,
My evening-rest and sleep to meet.

Time to enjoy pani-puri waiting for me!

[Pedro Gonzales]

I met Senator Schumer (very briefly) at an (Indian) event this evening. I asked him about HR 3012 (didn't have time to explain but mentioned eliminating country caps). He seemed bemused but his aide seemed to know what I was talking about. He said that the senator supported it. The senator then smiled and said he was a proponent of legal immigration and a friend of the Indian people. I think this thing might actually have legs.

[gcq]

I met Senator Schumer (very briefly) at an (Indian) event this evening. I asked him about HR 3012 (didn't have time to explain but mentioned eliminating country caps). He seemed bemused but his aide seemed to know what I was talking about. He said that the senator supported it. The senator then smiled and said he was a proponent of legal immigration and a friend of the Indian people. I think this thing might actually have legs.
Interesting that Senator is trying to portray himself as "friend of the Indian people" after that chop-shop comment on infosys and funding border security from H1B fees !

[nishant2200]

Interesting that Senator is trying to portray himself as "friend of the Indian people" after that chop-shop comment on infosys and funding border security from H1B fees !

gcq, that's what is a politician. Friend of the circumstance and self!

I have really become very hopeful suddenly for this bill. May God help us.

[immitime]

Thank you! I am trying what I can. I am thoroughly confused why this bill is not getting as much attention as it should in the Indian and Chinese community. Instead of an in-the-air fantasy petition that will have to be "pushed" by the white house, this is a real bill that already exists and has the support of - at least - two heavy weight congressmen (that too Republicans). I hope people take the time to read and recognize what this bill proposes.

Until Oct 3rd.. the petition threshold was 5000 signatures, now from Oct 3rd onwards it is 25000 signatures if we reach that then it become 2 million!


AS OF OCTOBER 3, 2011:
To cross the first threshold and be searchable within WhiteHouse.gov, a petition must reach 150 signatures within 30 days.To cross the second threshold and require a response, a petition must reach 25,000 signatures within 30 days.
https://wwws.whitehouse.gov/petitions#!/how-why/terms-participation

Scroll down till the end.clicking the above link.

[Kanmani]

I dont know how this is going to go ........... Same context diff bill within 15 days .......... why dont they unite and support the Republican bill itself............

Rep. Zoe Lofgren of California introduces yesterday H.R.3119 to remove the per-country limitation on employment-based immigrant visas and to adjust the per-country limitation on family-sponsored immigrant visas. This bill is co-sponsored by Rep. Gutierrez of Illinois.

Source OH LAW Firm www.immigration-law.com

[Kanmani]

Stemcell

Honestly speaking , US govt has no deal even if the affidavit is submitted in a plain paper itself. But most of the NRIs obtain one in a stamp paper because, stamp paper is a noted official document in India.

In my opinion , you can discuss with the notary public, whoever you are approaching , he will guide you with the amount worth according to the substance of the affidavit.

[vishnu]

kanmani - i don't see this new bill at all. Zoe Lofgren introduced her bill a few weeks back that is more comprehensive. Focuses on green cards for STEM, visa recapture and removing per country limits. But given the Republicans have introduced the new bill (Chaffetz bill) to remove per country limits, clearly they are unlikely to lend support to Lofgren's prior bill.

[Kanmani]

Vishnu

here is the link http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h112-3119

[vishnu]

thanks kanmani... very bizarre, same bill different sponsor. at least there is support for the concept on both sides now... question now is which bill goes forward. also interesting that the bill has been referred to the house judiciary committree who's chair is lamar smith (co-sponsor of the republican bill) and has chaffetz has a leading member

[Stemcell]

Kanmani,indiaeb2.
Thank you.




Stemcell

Honestly speaking , US govt has no deal even if the affidavit is submitted in a plain paper itself. But most of the NRIs obtain one in a stamp paper because, stamp paper is a noted official document in India.

In my opinion , you can discuss with the notary public, whoever you are approaching , he will guide you with the amount worth according to the substance of the affidavit.

[immitime]

thanks kanmani... very bizarre, same bill different sponsor. at least there is support for the concept on both sides now... question now is which bill goes forward. also interesting that the bill has been referred to the house judiciary committree who's chair is lamar smith (co-sponsor of the republican bill) and has chaffetz has a leading member

Excellent Analysis by Pedro Gonzales, if any of the bill are able to pass and becomes law what could happen. Scroll down little bit the below thread



http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?175-H.R.3012-Bill-to-eliminate-per-country-numerical-limitation

[imdeng]

Removing (or relaxing) country limits is something that has a better chance than other bills since this provision should also get a lot of support from Latino community and legislators. If you look at FB data, Latin American countries are severely oversubscribed because they run against the per country limit there. Relaxing per country limits helps Latinos in FB and Asians in EB - win win for both. I hope this gets more traction.


I dont know how this is going to go ........... Same context diff bill within 15 days .......... why dont they unite and support the Republican bill itself............

Rep. Zoe Lofgren of California introduces yesterday H.R.3119 to remove the per-country limitation on employment-based immigrant visas and to adjust the per-country limitation on family-sponsored immigrant visas. This bill is co-sponsored by Rep. Gutierrez of Illinois.

Source OH LAW Firm www.immigration-law.com

[Kanmani]

House Judiciary Committee Markup on H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act” Thursday, October 13, 2011 10:15 a.m. and on Friday, October 14, 2011 10:00 a.m. 2141 Rayburn House Office Building

[immitime]

House Judiciary Committee Markup on H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act” Thursday, October 13, 2011 10:15 a.m. and on Friday, October 14, 2011 10:00 a.m. 2141 Rayburn House Office Building

Kanmani,

No use all political exercises, ultimately there will be a tug of war around December and the house will go for recess...as u sual this exercise who make the immigrants fool is going on for past 7 years.. nothing really happens. Expectation gives real tears.

[Kanmani]

As our priority dates are destined to travel a long road, I am posting these legislative proceedings out of curiosity, may it will help somebody who has some hope as I am .

[vishnu]

and to be honest, i haven't see so much rhetoric in support of skilled immigration past few years as we are seeing now. also, all bills in past were trying to be 'comprehensive' rather than piecemeal. so more positive that there could be relief. not going for a 100% chance but just more positive

http://lofgren.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=653&Itemid=125

[manubhai]

Kanmani,

No use all political exercises, ultimately there will be a tug of war around December and the house will go for recess...as u sual this exercise who make the immigrants fool is going on for past 7 years.. nothing really happens. Expectation gives real tears.

immitime,
I say again, just because we have gotten so used to this rut of nothing happening, doesn't mean we should give up all expectations. We aren't being unrealistic about a non-existent fantasy. These are real bills... and as Vishnu pointed some replies after yours, there IS more chatter... in particular about "LEGAL EMPLOYMENT BASED" immigration. Not the typical "comprehensive immigration reform" blah. To the extent that two dems and two republicans have now come out with their own versions, which are close to replicas of each other. Yes... they want votes... and the contributions from the tech firms... but that doesnt mean that they aren't serious enough about it.

As an aside, what will kill any hope for me is if they talk about "increasing" the over all numbers. Even something like the STEM bill, although more helpful, is more unlikely to be acceptable/discussed because it increases the total number of people coming in to "steal american jobs". These two bills, dont do that. And you'll agree that that's a pretty good start.

So hang in there brother... with expectations. As someone once said... stay hungry... stay foolish.

[geterdone]

what is the difference between hr 3119 and hr 2161 ( idea act)? is hr2161 dead? instead of just introducing the same stuff again and again just get it done!


immitime,
I say again, just because we have gotten so used to this rut of nothing happening, doesn't mean we should give up all expectations. We aren't being unrealistic about a non-existent fantasy. These are real bills... and as Vishnu pointed some replies after yours, there IS more chatter... in particular about "LEGAL EMPLOYMENT BASED" immigration. Not the typical "comprehensive immigration reform" blah. To the extent that two dems and two republicans have now come out with their own versions, which are close to replicas of each other. Yes... they want votes... and the contributions from the tech firms... but that doesnt mean that they aren't serious enough about it.

As an aside, what will kill any hope for me is if they talk about "increasing" the over all numbers. Even something like the STEM bill, although more helpful, is more unlikely to be acceptable/discussed because it increases the total number of people coming in to "steal american jobs". These two bills, dont do that. And you'll agree that that's a pretty good start.

So hang in there brother... with expectations. As someone once said... stay hungry... stay foolish.

[immitime]

immitime,
I say again, just because we have gotten so used to this rut of nothing happening, doesn't mean we should give up all expectations. We aren't being unrealistic about a non-existent fantasy. These are real bills... and as Vishnu pointed some replies after yours, there IS more chatter... in particular about "LEGAL EMPLOYMENT BASED" immigration. Not the typical "comprehensive immigration reform" blah. To the extent that two dems and two republicans have now come out with their own versions, which are close to replicas of each other. Yes... they want votes... and the contributions from the tech firms... but that doesnt mean that they aren't serious enough about it.

Sure,, Thank You Manubhai.. You pour some good hope on all of us.. and with enthusiasm and hope waiting for the good news soon
As an aside, what will kill any hope for me is if they talk about "increasing" the over all numbers. Even something like the STEM bill, although more helpful, is more unlikely to be acceptable/discussed because it increases the total number of people coming in to "steal american jobs". These two bills, dont do that. And you'll agree that that's a pretty good start.

So hang in there brother... with expectations. As someone once said... stay hungry... stay foolish.

You are funny .....I would at least take some water or Juice :-) to survive!

[manubhai]

what is the difference between hr 3119 and hr 2161 ( idea act)? is hr2161 dead? instead of just introducing the same stuff again and again just get it done!

HR 2161 proposes to increase/make quicker the immigration path for people with graduate degrees from US in the STEM fields. The inspiration behind the bill is that US is training people at the graduate level and then sending them back home to compete against US companies. The practical difficulty behind this bill is that requires politicians to support a bill that SUPPOSEDLY "steals American jobs and gives it to immigrants when the unemployment is so high". It gets too complicated to convince your voters that these aliens aren't coming in in the future... but that they are already here, educated, working professionals, earning good money, paying taxes and SS, etc., etc.

HR 3012 is very similar to HR 3119 and basically says that employment based immigration should have nothing do with which country the beneficiary is coming from. The guy who's process started first should get his green card first... regardless of whether he's from India or Belgium. The means to do this is proposed via removal of the 7% per country limit. The inspiration behind is that companies don't care about the person's nationality and that you are more likely to find engineers/techies/etc from India than from Belgium, so stop discriminating on a point that serves no benefit for the US economy. The positive is that these don't raise the number of people coming in as immigrants and is thus more palatable as point of discussion. The negative is that non-Indian/Chinese will oppose this vehemently at every opportunity they get, esp. stressing on how these bills will remove the "diversity" element from employment based immigration.

So why were they both introduced: I am not certain but I believe...
1. It is because of the status of these bills. The bills, when introduced by a representative, are introduced to a "committee". The committee can decide in closed rooms what to do with the bill and never give a reason for that decision to anybody. If you are congressman and are not on that committee, you have no say in whether that bill gets a positive nod from the committee or not. Your only option if you fully support the bill is to introduce your own version. (In short: The democrat just gave her official approval to the republican backed bill). Also note that now both these bills are with the House Judiciary Committee. It doesn't mean that it will, but having these two together makes the chances of this issue moving forward for a real vote in congress a LOT higher now.
2. The reps want to support the IT companies that may be funding them.
3. This is one of those pieces of the whole immigration mess that actually stands a chance of moving forward in the partisan congress. Every body wants to be able to say months/years down the line that "we actually did something" and "got that immigration law changed" whereas the opposing party only talks about it.

Links:
HR 2161 (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h2161/show) - Immigration Driving Entrepreneurship in America Act of 2011
HR 3012 (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show) - Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act (Republican sponsored)
HR 3119 (http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3119/show) - To amend the Immigration and Nationality Act to remove the per-country limitation on employment-based immigrant visas... (Democrat sponsored)

[Pedro Gonzales]

[B][COLOR="red"]HR 3012 is very similar to HR 3119 and basically says that employment based immigration should have nothing do with which country the beneficiary is coming from. The guy who's process started first should get his green card first... regardless of whether he's from India or Belgium. The means to do this is proposed via removal of the 7% per country limit. The inspiration behind is that companies don't care about the person's nationality and that you are more likely to find engineers/techies/etc from India than from Belgium, so stop discriminating on a point that serves no benefit for the US economy. The positive is that these don't raise the number of people coming in as immigrants and is thus more palatable as point of discussion. The negative is that non-Indian/Chinese will oppose this vehemently at every opportunity they get, esp. stressing on how these bills will remove the "diversity" element from employment based immigration.


manubhai, from my read 3119 also permits recapture of lost visa numbers and provides a new 'W' visa that would be very relevant to Indian men in particular. Those of us who are single and looking to get married to women in India (old girlfriends or arranged marriages), often push out our GC applications until after we get married (or at least until we set the date - I did that myself, although I could have applied for my GC in 2006, I waited until 2008 until after I got married) because we can't apply for a visa for our wives if we already have our GC. Lofgren's bill introduces the W visa for spouses and minor children of green card holders. Very sensible issue.

As to the recapture of lost visas, while it is a very impactful move, it is effectively a one-time increase in the number of GCs given out, so it may be unpalatable to most politicians in this environment and may be seen as 'legislative creep' by the anti-immigrants when compared to Chafetz. I don't expect any of these bills to pass in this environment, but I think the Lofgren bill is the lesser likely of the two to pass, and may derail the Chaffetz bill too.

[Pedro Gonzales]

manubhai, from my read 3119 also permits recapture of lost visa numbers and provides a new 'W' visa that would be very relevant to Indian men in particular. Those of us who are single and looking to get married to women in India (old girlfriends or arranged marriages), often push out our GC applications until after we get married (or at least until we set the date - I did that myself, although I could have applied for my GC in 2006, I waited until 2008 until after I got married) because we can't apply for a visa for our wives if we already have our GC. Lofgren's bill introduces the W visa for spouses and minor children of green card holders. Very sensible issue.

As to the recapture of lost visas, while it is a very impactful move, it is effectively a one-time increase in the number of GCs given out, so it may be unpalatable to most politicians in this environment and may be seen as 'legislative creep' by the anti-immigrants when compared to Chafetz. I don't expect any of these bills to pass in this environment, but I think the Lofgren bill is the lesser likely of the two to pass, and may derail the Chaffetz bill too.

Does it make sense to move the legislative posts to another thread?

[Spectator]

HR 2161 proposes to increase/make quicker the immigration path for people with graduate degrees from US in the STEM fields. The inspiration behind the bill is that US is training people at the graduate level and then sending them back home to compete against US companies. The practical difficulty behind this bill is that requires politicians to support a bill that SUPPOSEDLY "steals American jobs and gives it to immigrants when the unemployment is so high". It gets too complicated to convince your voters that these aliens aren't coming in in the future... but that they are already here, educated, working professionals, earning good money, paying taxes and SS, etc., etc.manubhai,

It is a lot more than that:

i) Exempts holders of STEM Advanced Degrees from designated US Universities AND ALL EB1B approvals from the numerical limits.

ii) Provides Dual Intent to F-1.

iii) Extension of stay to F-1 if a PERM or I-140 has been pending 365 days as well as giving Employment Authorization to F, H & L under these circumstances.

iv) There is a whole section about Entrepreneur visas.

v) Visas recature and fall over of unused EB visas to EB the next year.

vi) Dependents are not counted against numerical limitations.

vii) Eliminating Employment-Based Per Country Levels

viii) Investing in STEM education.

ix) Speeding up PERM processing and introducing a Premium Process, including for Appeals.

x) Allowing Premium Processing for I-140 appeals.

xi) Strengthening the Prevailing Wage system.

xii) Reforming the H1B system, including higher wages.

xiii) Introducing a grace period of 60 days for an H1B to find new work if laid off or terminated.

xiv) Allowing Promotions.

xv) Similar reforms for L1, including Requiring Prevailing Wage for Certain L-1B Nonimmigrants.

xvi) Some tweaks to the EB5 program to create an EB6 Category.

xvii) Allowing H4 to work.

I think that is a little more than you stated. There are some FB related parts, but not much.

[imdeng]

Thanks Spec - Very Informative.


manubhai,

It is a lot more than that:
<deleted for conciseness>
I think that is a little more than you stated. There are some FB related parts, but not much.

[manubhai]

manubhai,

It is a lot more than that: ...

Spec, Pedro: You both are correct. Thanks for adding the remaining parts.

Apart from my ignorance with the details, my intent was not to be comprehensive. I was trying to answer the question on their main differences based on what we keep harping about on this thread.... priority dates, movements, how long GC takes, esp. in the India+China context.

Aside: Seeing the details from Spec, although these bills can change drastically by the time they reach the floor, I think HR 2161 is even more unlikely to get any traction. Its too big and wide. Though I'd love H4s being able to work... but in today's environment...seriously???? May be that's why she introduced a second bill... something smaller and a tad bit more realistic!!

[skpanda]

I am guessing, if Mr. CO came to know about possible passing of bill HR3012 (which seems to have bipartisan support) effective 1st Oct 2011. And Mr. CO is taking some proactive steps to meet the requirements of HR3012 (If HR3012 does not get approved, he may still be safe since there would be spill over).

Just a theory!


guys, I saw a huge number of approvals of EB2-C on mitbbs, at least 20-30. I think Mr.Co is planning to approve all the old cases before this end of year. I don't know what kind of visa numbers he is using, and I don't understand how he can assign so many visa numbers in the first month of this FY. It looks werid, but I hope all the old cases can be approved and the VB continues to move forward!

[Nishant_imt]

so now we have a bill for lifting the per country limit. My question to all the gurus is ... if the bill gets passed, were would EB2 stand.. would it be current immediately? Would EB3 cases take up all the visas and EB2 will be looking at everything helplessly?

[skpanda]

After the HR3012 bill is passed:

EB2I will get around 40K+ green cards each year (Regular quota + Spillover). EB2 will get current in 2 to 3 years in real sense (no backlog). However EB2I may get current in 1 or 2 years to capture demand and then retrogess.

EB3I will get around 25K green cards for the next 3 years (Regular Quota). After that it will get 40K green cards untill EB3I is current in real sense (no backlog).



so now we have a bill for lifting the per country limit. My question to all the gurus is ... if the bill gets passed, were would EB2 stand.. would it be current immediately? Would EB3 cases take up all the visas and EB2 will be looking at everything helplessly?

[Spectator]

so now we have a bill for lifting the per country limit. My question to all the gurus is ... if the bill gets passed, were would EB2 stand.. would it be current immediately? Would EB3 cases take up all the visas and EB2 will be looking at everything helplessly?No and No. Category numbers still exist and limits exist on maximums.

It was discussed earlier in the thread.

Read the bill http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h112-3012

EB2 would eventually settle around 2-3 years retrogressed for everybody as long as spillover remains at current (or slightly reduced) levels, while retrogression in EB3 would be 8-9 years for everybody and slowly getting worse.

[Nishant_imt]

Isn't that already happening... we received a spillover this year and that's how the dates have moved to Nov 07. Am I missing something here?


After the HR3012 bill is passed:

EB2I will get around 40K+ green cards each year (Regular quota + Spillover)

[Pedro Gonzales]

so now we have a bill for lifting the per country limit. My question to all the gurus is ... if the bill gets passed, were would EB2 stand.. would it be current immediately? Would EB3 cases take up all the visas and EB2 will be looking at everything helplessly?

Not at all. The bill would permit EB2IC to get 34,000 visa numbers + EB1 & EB5 spill over, while EB3 I would get 28,000 visa numbers for FY2012. Both would move forward tremendously, while EB2ROW would retrogress several years, and EB3 ROW M & P would stand still. EB3 C would stall at early 2006 along with EB3 ROW M & P.

[skpanda]

Spillover is not taken for granted. out of the 36K available for India and China (next 3 years), a single country cannot take more than 70%. So around 28K Regular quota and add 12K+ spillover. If spillover is more then even better.

So the number will between 40K to 50K.



Isn't that already happening... we received a spillover this year and that's how the dates have moved to Nov 07. Am I missing something here?

[qblogfan]

They have been working on so many activites and I lost track.

I think it's very difficult to pass new bills and they have been talking about reform since 2007 and nothing happened.

For EB2, the only hope is to get more spillover in this FY and move PD faster.

I hope CO can move PD into 2008 in the next VB.



Sounds good. We should keep an eye out for any pleas to call , email, contact congressmen senators etc.

qblogfan, are the Chinese on to it too.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Isn't that already happening... we received a spillover this year and that's how the dates have moved to Nov 07. Am I missing something here?

Spillover is a transient phenomenon. You may not get any once the economy improves (or if EB3ROW to EB2ROW porting increases). This would set it in stone, so to speak. Also the numbers available through this bill would exceed the spillover received from EB2ROW.

[kd2008]

so now we have a bill for lifting the per country limit. My question to all the gurus is ... if the bill gets passed, were would EB2 stand.. would it be current immediately? Would EB3 cases take up all the visas and EB2 will be looking at everything helplessly?

Please read this post for your answers:

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?4-EB2-Predictions-(Rather-Calculations)-2011&p=9544#post9544

[immitime]

Pedro,

If they recapture the Visas as per Zoe Lofgrens bill, at least there is chances of all the categories becoming current is that right?


Not at all. The bill would permit EB2IC to get 34,000 visa numbers + EB1 & EB5 spill over, while EB3 I would get 28,000 visa numbers for FY2012. Both would move forward tremendously, while EB2ROW would retrogress several years, and EB3 ROW M & P would stand still. EB3 C would stall at early 2006 along with EB3 ROW M & P.

[shaumack]

No and No. Category numbers still exist and limits exist on maximums.

It was discussed earlier in the thread.

Read the bill http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h112-3012

EB2 would eventually settle around 2-3 years retrogressed for everybody as long as spillover remains at current (or slightly reduced) levels, while retrogression in EB3 would be 8-9 years for everybody and slowly getting worse.

I know we are excited about HR 3012 bill that will eliminate per country cap, but there is some ambiguity in the proposition which still needs to be corrected. Bill proposes to strike out Section 202 (a) (5) which I believe governs the use of spillover visas. For e.g if there are any unused visa numbers left in EB1 then it cannot flow to EB2 without existence of such rule. So what will happen to such visas? I understand that there is 70% per country cap on reserved visas but it is also unclear to me if this will override the maximum a category-country can get after spillover in case Section 202 (a) (5) is covered in any other way.

Bill will help EB2 in some way with guaranteed 70% visas but how will fall across and fall down can happen is unclear. In such case 40k+ visas may not be possible for EB2. Bill will help EB3 for sure. I might be missing something here, and may be Spec or others can correct me.

[snathan]

I know we are excited about HR 3012 bill that will eliminate per country cap, but there is some ambiguity in the proposition which still needs to be corrected. Bill proposes to strike out Section 202 (a) (5) which I believe governs the use of spillover visas. For e.g if there are any unused visa numbers left in EB1 then it cannot flow to EB2 without existence of such rule. So what will happen to such visas? I understand that there is 70% per country cap on reserved visas but it is also unclear to me if this will override the maximum a category-country can get after spillover in case Section 202 (a) (5) is covered in any other way.

Bill will help EB2 in some way with guaranteed 70% visas but how will fall across and fall down can happen is unclear. In such case 40k+ visas may not be possible for EB2. Bill will help EB3 for sure. I might be missing something here, and may be Spec or others can correct me.

The bill will just remove the country cap...and gives the visa based only PD FIFO for that category. So there will be only EB1/2/3 and PD. Nothing else.

[gcdedo]

So this will move the EB2 dates for China and India while rest of the country EB2 will get delayed.

[shaumack]

The bill will just remove the country cap...and gives the visa based only PD FIFO for that category. So there will be only EB1/2/3 and PD. Nothing else.

I understand that but without spillover rule (if Sec202 (a) (5) governs it ) what if category (e.g. EB1) still have visas left. What will happen to them if there is no FA /FD rule. My only point is are we missing striking Section 202 (a) (5) part should this need to be amended? Nothing else.

[skpanda]

Yes... Please refer to spec's post above.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?148-EB2-Predictions-(Rather-Calculations)-2012&p=10640#post10640



So this will move the EB2 dates for China and India while rest of the country EB2 will get delayed.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Pedro,

If they recapture the Visas as per Zoe Lofgrens bill, at least there is chances of all the categories becoming current is that right?

Of course, recapture would be awesome news for all immigrants, which is precisely why I think it is difficult for it to pass. I like the fact the two bills out there right now, Lofgren's including recapture, the W2 visa for spouses and minor children of GC holders, and AC21 to L & F visas, along with country cap removals and Chaffetz with just the country cap removals. I think we'll gauge how much appetite legislators have for recapture.

Is the 218,000 number right? Is that how many visa numbers would be recaptured?

[snathan]

so now we have a bill for lifting the per country limit. My question to all the gurus is ... if the bill gets passed, were would EB2 stand.. would it be current immediately? Would EB3 cases take up all the visas and EB2 will be looking at everything helplessly?

It may become current or move couple of years...based on the visa availability. But the bill will be implemented in a phased manner

[snathan]

I understand that but without spillover rule (if Sec202 (a) (5) governs it ) what if category (e.g. EB1) still have visas left. What will happen to them if there is no FA /FD rule. My only point is are we missing striking Section 202 (a) (5) part should this need to be amended? Nothing else.

Spill over rule will remain the same like EB1->Eb2->Eb3.

[Spectator]

Pedro,

If they recapture the Visas as per Zoe Lofgrens bill, at least there is chances of all the categories becoming current is that right?immitime,

None whatsoever IMO, although the dates might be quite late.

Let's be optimistic and say there are 300k visas max to recapture (I think the Ombudsman mentioned 218,000, Pedro, so that is probably a better figure), and the backlog to today is almost certainly far bigger than that (it is 100k for EB2-IC alone).

The text doesn't talk about how recaptured visas should be allocated.

In a fair world, they would go first to the most retrogressed applicants, especially since no visas have been wasted since 2007 and all EB2 Countries have reached Cut Off Dates in 2007 already.

[jackbrown_890]

Pedro,

If they recapture the Visas as per Zoe Lofgrens bill, at least there is chances of all the categories becoming current is that right?

This bill is no-where close to becoming a law.
It is still Immigration subcommittee under house judiciary.
it has to go thru the subcommittees and thn to the house floor.
3012 has some chance of making it to the house floor for voting. because of the co-sponsor Smith who is chairman of judiciary committee and majority of the members are republicans and this bill also proposed by republican.
3119 or 2162 by Zoe has very little chance of moving out of subcommittee.

The passage of 3012 without any amendments is good for C/I but bad for ROW.
The best thing can happen for everyone is that: Zoe is also on that subcommittee and she proposes amendments to 3012 (Add recapture). If they do that, they will get some Democrates' support. If not chances are no democrat will support it. But republicans can still pass this bill in the house. But without any house democrat support, senate probably will not consider or pass this bill.

So the best scenario for everyone for now:
1: Bill 3012 (proposed by republican and supported by Judiciary chairman and its republican majority in the house)
2: with visa recapture amendment (by Zoe- a democrat)
3: effective date : Fiscal year 2012 (this would be great with recapture - lot of work for the agencies for next 2 years but good for all EB immigrants
4: Passed by House Judicial in 2 weeks
5: go for house vote by the end of this month
6: go to senate in November (if there is any democrat support since senate is controlled by democrats)
7: passed in senate by November end
8: become a law by December or early

[shaumack]

Spill over rule will remain the same like EB1->Eb2->Eb3.

Can you tell me what Section of INA Act guide spillover rule? If not then please let Spec clarify this. No offense to you.

[Pedro Gonzales]

I know we are excited about HR 3012 bill that will eliminate per country cap, but there is some ambiguity in the proposition which still needs to be corrected. Bill proposes to strike out Section 202 (a) (5) which I believe governs the use of spillover visas. For e.g if there are any unused visa numbers left in EB1 then it cannot flow to EB2 without existence of such rule. So what will happen to such visas? I understand that there is 70% per country cap on reserved visas but it is also unclear to me if this will override the maximum a category-country can get after spillover in case Section 202 (a) (5) is covered in any other way.

Bill will help EB2 in some way with guaranteed 70% visas but how will fall across and fall down can happen is unclear. In such case 40k+ visas may not be possible for EB2. Bill will help EB3 for sure. I might be missing something here, and may be Spec or others can correct me.

Looks like a good catch, schaumack. I only took a quick look just now but I'll put my contract review hat on this evening and look at it again after work. I'd be surprised if IV's lawyers missed something as big as this.

PS:- I guess my review is no longer required, as Spec true to form has provided the answer.

[Spectator]

Can you tell me what Section of INA Act guide spillover rule? If not then please let Spec clarify this. No offense to you.I think that is a little unkind to snathan.

INA 202 (a) (5) dealt with otherwise unused visas and Countries who had reached the 7% per Country limit.

If there is no per Country limit, it is not required and must be removed.

A by-product of this is that it removes reference to Quarterly spillover, but that wouldn't be an issue.

Spillover is dealt with by INA: ACT 203 - ALLOCATION OF IMMIGRANT VISAS, specifically 203(b)(1), 203(b)(A) and 203(b)(3)(A).

There has always been a certain ambiguity to it, but the current interpretation is EB4/5 --> EB1 --> EB2 --> EB3 and that is how it must operate if per Country limits were removed. I can envisage a very limited scenario where spillover to EB3 was possible before EB2 became Current, but practically, that will never happen.

[shaumack]

I think that is a little unkind to snathan.

INA 202 (a) (5) dealt with otherwise unused visas and Countries who had reached the 7% per Country limit.

If there is no per Country limit, it is not required and must be removed.

A by-product of this is that it removes reference to Quarterly spillover, but that wouldn't be an issue.

Spillover is dealt with by INA: ACT 203 - ALLOCATION OF IMMIGRANT VISAS, specifically 203(b)(1), 203(b)(A) and 203(b)(3)(A).

There has always been a certain ambiguity to it, but the current interpretation is EB4/5 --> EB1 --> EB2 --> EB3 and that is how it must operate if per Country limits were removed.

I did not meant to offend him but was irked by his reply. Apologies to him.

Anyways, ALLOCATION OF IMMIGRANT VISAS, specifically 203(b)(1), 203(b)(A) and 203(b)(3)(A) (http://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB/HTML/SLB/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-29/0-0-0-1083.html#0-0-0-182) - I do not see anything that covers spillover there. Only thing I see about this is in Section 202. Can you please point the excerpts if you do not mind?

Excerpt from May 2011 VB "As mentioned in the May Visa Bulletin, Section 202(a)(5) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) prescribes rules for the use of potentially “otherwise unused” Employment numbers. During May the India Employment Second preference cut-off date is governing the use of such numbers, because India had reached its Employment Second annual limit. "

I think we should be careful that bill is passed keeping everyone's interest and something like this important is not lost, although I have nothing to lose with this. I will close my argument over here.

[qesehmk]

shaumack,

What piqued my interest in that statement is the word "potentially".I really don't know what that means. I believe INA doesn't have that word. They simply say "Otherwise unused".




Excerpt from May 2011 VB "As mentioned in the May Visa Bulletin, Section 202(a)(5) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) prescribes rules for the use of potentially “otherwise unused” Employment numbers. During May the India Employment Second preference cut-off date is governing the use of such numbers, because India had reached its Employment Second annual limit. "

[Pedro Gonzales]

I did not meant to offend him but was irked by his reply. Apologies to him.

Anyways, ALLOCATION OF IMMIGRANT VISAS, specifically 203(b)(1), 203(b)(A) and 203(b)(3)(A) (http://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB/HTML/SLB/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-29/0-0-0-1083.html#0-0-0-182) - I do not see anything that covers spillover there. Only thing I see about this is in Section 202. Can you please point the excerpts if you do not mind?


On your link, look at paragraph 203(b)(2)(A), which address FD from EB1 to EB2.

It reads,
"Aliens who are members of the professions holding advanced degrees or aliens of exceptional ability. -
(A) In general. - Visas shall be made available, in a number not to exceed 28.6 percent of such worldwide level, plus any visas not required for the classes specified in paragraph (1), to qualified immigrants who are members of the professions holding advanced degrees ... "

Similarly, 203(b)(1)(A) address Fall Up from EB4 & EB5 to EB1.

[shaumack]

shaumack,

What piqued my interest in that statement is the word "potentially". I really don't know what that means. I believe INA doesn't have that word. They simply say "Otherwise unused".

I would think 'potentially' may mean 'prorated' or so. I really do not know how extensively they would calculate spillover although they did some advance movements in 2011 on pro-rated basis.

[Spectator]

I did not meant to offend him but was irked by his reply. Apologies to him.

Anyways, ALLOCATION OF IMMIGRANT VISAS, specifically 203(b)(1), 203(b)(A) and 203(b)(3)(A) (http://www.uscis.gov/ilink/docView/SLB/HTML/SLB/0-0-0-1/0-0-0-29/0-0-0-1083.html#0-0-0-182) - I do not see anything that covers spillover there. Only thing I see about this is in Section 202. Can you please point the excerpts if you do not mind?

Excerpt from May 2011 VB "As mentioned in the May Visa Bulletin, Section 202(a)(5) of the Immigration and Nationality Act (INA) prescribes rules for the use of potentially “otherwise unused” Employment numbers. During May the India Employment Second preference cut-off date is governing the use of such numbers, because India had reached its Employment Second annual limit. "

I think we should be careful that bill is passed keeping everyone's interest and something like this important is not lost, although I have nothing to lose with this. I will close my argument over here.Pedro has covered it really.

Here are all the relevant extracts from the law I quoted:


203(b)(1) Priority workers. - Visas shall first be made available in a number not to exceed 28.6 percent of such worldwide level, plus any visas not required for the classes specified in paragraphs (4) and (5), to qualified immigrants who are aliens described in any of the following subparagraphs (A) through (C):That covers Fall Up from EB4/5 to EB1.


203(b)(2)(A) In general. - Visas shall be made available, in a number not to exceed 28.6 percent of such worldwide level, plus any visas not required for the classes specified in paragraph (1), .....That covers Fall Down from EB1 to EB2.


203((b)(3)(A) (A) In general. - Visas shall be made available, in a number not to exceed 28.6 percent of such worldwide level, plus any visas not required for the classes specified in paragraphs (1) and (2), .....That covers Fall Down from EB1 and EB2 to EB3

[qesehmk]

Q Please check your PM
Thanks immitime, appreciate it. Reproducing for everybody's benefit. Red emphasis mine.


This is what Pappu posted on IV as their great acheivement to be....sharing with you

After 6 years of hard work, patience & persistence, we are at the doorstep of success

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Dear Members,

We are excited and pleased to announce that after 6 years of our hard work, your hard work, we finally have a bill that has a very good chance of actually passing in the Congress in next 6-8 weeks.

For over 6 months, members of Immigration Voice have been working behind the scenes to bridge the gap between various sides, coordinating between different groups, our employers and petitioning the Members of Congress. On the 4th anniversary of Immigration Voice rally, members from across the country organized over 160 meetings with the key decision makers in the Congress. To prevent any unnecessary attention we coordinated and organized these meetings with energetic and highly motivated group of Immigration Voice members and leaders.

On 22nd September, Congressman Chaffetz and Smith sponsored H.R. 3012 in the US House of Representatives. We applaud Congressman Chaffetz and Judiciary committee Chairman Lamar Smith for leading the effort for removing per country limits. Here is the press release from Congressman Chaffetz website. H.R. 3012 is scheduled for mark-up in the House Judiciary Committee for this Thursday and Friday. See details here on Judiciary committee website. Here is the bill summary. This is a big deal given the fact that not one bill for high skills immigration has passed Congress since AC21 Act in Oct 2000. This will be the first one in 11 years.

The proposed bill H.R. 3012 removes per-country limits in employment based green card category. If enacted, this bill will drastically reduce the wait times of everyone in the current backlogs. A similar bill was sponsored by Congresswoman Lofgren in August, 2008. So the idea of this bill has bi-partisan support in the Congress. Immigration Voice applauds Congresswoman Lofgren's leadership on fixing high skilled immigration system.

The most important thing now is to give this effort a final and consequential push. Although this bill has wide support, it is not a done deal yet. We all need to actively get involved in making phone calls and sending emails/faxes to the Congress in order to give this bill a grassroots voice and also to out-number, outlast and out-weigh any push from either people opposed to immigration in general or opposed to removal of per-country limits. Now is not a time to take a break and risk 6 years of effort that went into reaching this phase.

We all agree that high skills immigration should allocate and distribute green cards to the skilled immigrant workforce based on principle of first-come-first-serve-basis. Members of Congress have listened and now they agree with this principle. Our employers whom we wrote letters and petitions internally in large high-tech companies also agreed with us. And even when our case has lots of merit, merits alone do not drive the legislative activity in Congress. There are many bills in Congress that have a lot of merits and can do a lot of good but are never voted in Congress because a small faction holds it up. We cannot let that happen to us, not this time.

You are successful in your job and in your career trajectory. You either like your job, or, you like where your career is headed. However, in order to protect our accomplishments and our position in life and career, working really hard at our jobs is not enough. We have to protect what we have and what we aspire by making sure that we will be around in this country for the foreseeable future. If you have contributed time, money or effort so far to Immigration Voice, that’s great. But that is needed again for next 6-8 weeks. If you have never done this, now is the time to do this. If this bill fails, there will not be another bill in 2012 because that’s an election year where legislation do not happen easily. In 2013, the chances are slim again and depend on election outcomes. So this is it.

If you recently received your green card then you can easily relate to the problems your friends continue to go through. If you are only 1-2 years away from being current in your case, a lot can happen in next 1-2 years. You may face a worse economy, be laid off, be in a company that gets acquired by another company or merges with another company. All this is not good for green card process. So let us do all we can to protect our accomplishments, our future and our families’ future.

We will be shortly announcing concrete action items for making phone calls, emails and faxes, both on forums and via newsletters. So please stay tuned, pay attention to this bill and do your part. Because if this bill fails this year, it will be a failure that likely sticks with all of us for next 2-3 years.

Thank you!

Team IV



So here is some big news with a good disclaimer at the bottom and a pathetic attempt to take credit for. Yes their secrecy does help themselves because they can make any tall claims.

Nathan why don't you educate us on who the core team is - which companies they met - which senators etc. If you are concerned about secrecy - obviously - then here is a simple thing to do. Just have one fortune 500 tech company or one senator/representative make a public statement before or after passing of this bill that they worked with IV and it provided them valuable insights. Just try raising this as a topic internal to the IV masters and see the reaction.

My best wishes for this bill though. I refuse to believe IV had any substantial part in formulating it though.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Thanks Q,

there are two bills in congress one Rep. Jason Chaffetz from Utah and Rep. Lamar Smith introduced H.R.3012 and one Rep Zoe Lofgrens H.R. 2161.. if both of them passes the house and senate and becomes law, which is a dream and lot of pulling and pushing may occur if at all those comes for the floor votes. but Hypothetically what you have posted are there in those bills. Even though it is a political game by two parties but as election year any thing can happen.

These are the only scope for Eb-3 India who filed before Year 2006.

If anyone have any ohter way for EB-3 India people who are terribly backlogged Please spill some light. and I am sure with the existing laws, EB-3 India will never ever move more than a week or a month each VB!

If the Chaffetz bill passes, EB3I will move to Sep 2004 by FY2012 and EB3ROW will stagnate there. If the Lofgren bill passes, the 218,000 recaptured visas will come to bear. I would hope that it was applied on a pure PD basis (so EB3I first, EB3 ROW next, EB2 I next etc), but realistically, they'll probably apply the spillover order here too (first to EB2 and then to EB3). This would mean, EB2 would become current (using up ~ 100,000 visa numbers) and EB3 (I, C, M, P, ROW) would move to early 2007. There will be some minor differences in EB3 since the country caps are not completely lifted right away (also in Lofgren's bill, they only get lifted starting in FY2013), so ROW could move ahead of I by a few months, but this is probably accurate at a high level.

[Spectator]

I've moved the very interesting discussion about Bills that remove the Per Country Limits to their own thread http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119

I think it deserves that, since it is an important topic in its own right.

Please continue to post about the subject there.

[manubhai]

...
So the best scenario for everyone for now:
1: Bill 3012 (proposed by republican and supported by Judiciary chairman and its republican majority in the house)
2: with visa recapture amendment (by Zoe- a democrat)
3: effective date : Fiscal year 2012 (this would be great with recapture - lot of work for the agencies for next 2 years but good for all EB immigrants
4: Passed by House Judicial in 2 weeks
5: go for house vote by the end of this month
6: go to senate in November (if there is any democrat support since senate is controlled by democrats)
7: passed in senate by November end
8: become a law by December or early

Jackbrown - You rock! I thought I was the optimist here... but you beat me hands down.

May be this is a waste of time but I thought I'll ask anyways... Does any one (including jackbrown) know any typical time frames for these bills in the subcommittees? Or is there nothing as a "typical" time frame?

In other words, why is the above jackbrown's "best case scenario"? Is that a typical best-case timeline?

"become a law by December"... woooow... I never looked at it that way!

Thanks!

[Pedro Gonzales]

Here is a link to IV's grassroot recommendations. xxxxxx

[jackbrown_890]

Jackbrown - You rock! I thought I was the optimist here... but you beat me hands down.

May be this is a waste of time but I thought I'll ask anyways... Does any one (including jackbrown) know any typical time frames for these bills in the subcommittees? Or is there nothing as a "typical" time frame?

In other words, why is the above jackbrown's "best case scenario"? Is that a typical best-case timeline?

"become a law by December"... woooow... I never looked at it that way!

Thanks!

You are right, this is the most optimistic (dream) scenario. In my understanding, it happens usually when the bills are rushed thru congress. Plus there is no typical best-case timeline in congress. Some bills takes days to pass and some bills takes years to pass and some never make it out of subcommittee. It is all political power game. in reality in recent history around only 4% of the total bills introduced in congress (senate or house) have become a law.I am definitely being optimistic here.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Alright, there are just two things you need to do:

Step 1: Write to your representatives supporting the bill through either of these sites
http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3012/show
https://www.popvox.com/bills/us/112/hr3012

Feel free to use my letter, which read as follows:

I support H.R. 3012: Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act.

This bill tackles a very small portion of the immigration debate, but a significant one for over a 100,000 people like me who are affected by it. It tackles unfair country caps that allow me to apply for my green card 5 years after colleagues of mine who have the same qualifications as I do just because I was born in India and they were not.

It does not increase the number of green cards given out each year and it does not affect American jobs (people that are affected by this are already in the US legally working at jobs that there are currently not enough qualified Americans to fill). This bill just eliminates a source of unfairness in the current immigration system.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Step 2: A call to the members of the judiciary committee asking them to support the bill. Numbers are on the next post.

I have 'borrowed' heavily from another organization. However, to my knowledge they have no copyright on this material, so I will lose no sleep on it. I have myself made 4 phone calls so far, with moderate success (3 went to voice mails, and the 4th staffer already had received several calls today and knew exactly what I was talking about and couldn't wait to be done).

a) Call each office number listed in the next post below. Say that – “I am calling to request support for H.R 3012 and would like to speak with the staffer who handles Immigration.”

b) Talk to the staffer or leave a Voice Mail using the specific text below.

Use the following text for all offices EXCEPT Rep.Lamar Smith,Rep. Jason Chaffetz and Rep. Zoe Lofgren

"My name is ___ and I am a legal immigrant to the U.S.

I would like Representative "Representative Name" to support H.R - 3012 - Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act. As you may know, this bill already has wide bipartisan support.

H.R. 3012 will boost job creation and innovation in the U.S. through a technical fix that will remove per-country limits for high-skilled applicants in the employment-based green card system.

At the same time, this fix will also drastically reduce the wait times for highly skilled applicants like me who are currently looking at wait times of anywhere between 6 to 15 years to get my green card. I am counting on Congressman’s/Congresswoman’s support for H.R 3012."

For Congressman Lamar Smith and Congressman Chaffetz Office, say the following

“My name is ___ and I am a legal immigrant to the U.S.

I am calling to thank Representative Smith / Representative Chaffetz for introducing H.R-3012 which will bring fairness to the employment-based green card system by removing per-country limitations. I thank Rep.Smith/Rep.Chaffetz for his outstanding leadership on this issue and for being a champion of legal, high-skilled immigrants like me. I am also calling offices of other House Judiciary Committee members to request support for H.R 3012.”


For Rep.Lofgren’s office, say the following

“My name is ___ and I am a legal immigrant to the U.S.

I am calling to thank Rep. Lofgren for being a champion of legal, high-skilled immigrants and for her long-standing leadership on the issue of reducing green card backlogs. I am aware that Rep. Lofgren has introduced several bills in the past to reduce the backlogs including the recent H.R-3119 - Protecting American Families and Businesses Act of 2011.

I am calling to request the Congresswoman to co-sponsor H.R-3012, which is a similar bill and is a great first step to reducing green card backlogs. H.R 3012 will remove per-country limits in allotment of high-skilled green cards and will help up to a million applicants like me who are stuck in queue for close to a decade. I will deeply appreciate Rep. Lofgren’s support and look forward to her co-sponsorship of this bill.”

Additional Notes to keep in mind:

Note 1 - If asked that do you represent any organization? Tell to the aide that you do not.

Note 2 - To Democratic offices only, please make sure you add this line in the end
"The bill also increases the per-country limits in the family-based system in order to reduce wait times for family-based green card applicants who have also been facing huge application backlogs"

Note 3 - Please speak slowly and clearly and focus only on the above message. DO NOT mention CIR, undocumented immigrants or H1B/I-485/EAD/AP/PD etc since those are completely separate topics or the lawmakers offices are not familiar with these acronyms. If the aide is confused with any of those topics, be sure to clarify that you are calling to seek support for HR-3012 dealing with green cards for the highly skilled legal immigrants.

Note 4 - IF the aide asks whether you belong to the district or not, tell them NO if you don't. Add the following -
"I have already spoken with my representative but, in addition, would like the support of the Congressman/Congresswoman. The Congressman/Congresswoman is a prominent member of House Judiciary Committee which makes him/her a national figure of great importance. The Congressman's/Congresswoman’s decision and support for H.R 3012 is therefore very important for high-skilled immigrants across the U.S "

Note 5 - In case you are asked any other questions, if you are not sure how to answer a particular question, mention that you will be happy to circle back with that office with the answer asap.

Congressmen's contact details follow:

[Pedro Gonzales]

Here are the Phone numbers of the Members of Congress in House Judiciary Committee. I am working my way down the list of democrats.

Republican
Rep.Lamar Smith [TX, 21st District] - 202-225-4236
Rep.Jason Chaffetz [UT, 3rd District] - 202-225-7751
Rep.Bob Goodlatte [VA, 6th District] - 202-225-5431
Rep. Elton Gallegly [CA – 24th District] - 202-225-5811
Rep.Steve Chabot [OH, 1st District]- 202-225-2216
Rep.Darrell Issa [CA, 49th District] - 202-225-3906
Rep.James Sensenbrenner [WI, 5th District] - 202-225-5101
Rep. Howard Coble [NC, 6th District] - 202-225-3065
Rep.Daniel Lungren [CA, 3rd District] - 202-225-5716
Rep.Mike Pence [IN, 6th District] - 202-225-3021
Rep.Randy Forbes [VA, 4th District]- 202-225-6365
Rep.Steve King [IA, 5th District] - 202-225-4426
Rep.Trent Franks [AZ-2nd District] - 202-225-4576
Rep.Louie Gohmert [TX, 1st District] - 202-225-3035
Rep.Jim Jordan [OH, 4th District] - 202-225-2676
Rep.Ted Poe [TX, 2nd District] - 202-225-6565
Rep.Tim Griffin [AR, 2nd District] - 202-225-2506
Rep.Tom Marino [PA, 10th District] - 202-225-3731
Rep.Trey Gowdy [SC, 4th District] - 202-225-6030
Rep.Dennis Ross [FL, 12th District] - 202-225-1252
Rep.Sandy Adams [FL, 24th District] - 202-225-2706
Rep.Ben Quayle [AZ, 3rd District] - 202-225-3361
Rep. Mark Amodei [NV, 2nd District] - 202-225-6155

Democrat
Rep.Zoe Lofgren [CA, 16th District] - 202-225-3072
Rep.Pedro Pierluisi [Puerto Rico] - 202-225-2615
Rep.John Conyers [MI, 14th District] - 202-225-5126
Rep.Howard Berman [CA, 28th District] - 202-225-4695
Rep.Jerold Nadler [NY, 8th District] - 202-225-5635
Rep.Robert Scott [VA, 3rd District] - 202-225-8351
Rep.Mel Watt [NC, 12th District] - 202-225-1510
Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee [TX, 18th District] - 202-225-3816
Rep.Maxine Waters [CA, 25th District] - 202-225-2201
Rep.Steve Cohen [TN, 9th District] - 202-225-3265
Rep.Henry Johnson [GA, 4th District] - 202-225-1605
Rep.Mike Quigley [IL, 5th District] - 202-225-4061
Rep. Judy Chu [CA, 32nd District] - 202-225-5464
Rep.Ted Deutch [FL, 19th District] - 202-225-3001
Rep.Linda Sanchez [CA, 39th District] - 202-225-6676

[anukris]

Guys... there is a huge grass roots effort going on on this bill in *********** ***** (**)..

Please visit immigration voice .org (you can see the link on the home page h.r. 3012) and see the activities that you can do to support this bill. this is of utmost importance to all the people who want to get out of this green card mess.. Please spread this word as soon as you can to your friends and family. We should get as much support as we can to push this through..

[immitime]

Might be true, this bills may pass but very narrow hope on this bills. because I am seeing this kind of bills coming to the Congress/Senate floor every year and nothing happens. eventhough I support and doing needful.

NEVER EVER BELIEVE A POLITICIAN IN LIFE! that is the lesson learned from this bill dramas, and again, the organisation ** which claims to be sponsoring this also is a multi million business, for the already GC holders who claims that they sacrifice their life for all EB community. that too in USA. in this bad economy, they must be kidding and making money. So the soon each EB immigrants realise this TRUTH, they wont loose their hard earned money in the name of advocacy and monthly donor collection.

All the prayers to pass this bill. I had past 5 years experience with thi ** that as soon as the bill fails they comes out and says this is unfortunate we will keep our advocacy alive and keep on paying money to support EB community. if you question the account and the balance sheet then you will know the clear picture. So Please don't believe ** not an advice but otherwise you will come to know soon.! especially if the bill fails.

But I wish this bill should pass and should become law as soon as possible! which is a great relief but no credit for **.


Guys... there is a huge grass roots effort going on on this bill in immigration voice (**)..

Please visit immigration voice .org (you can see the link on the home page h.r. 3012) and see the activities that you can do to support this bill. this is of utmost importance to all the people who want to get out of this green card mess.. Please spread this word as soon as you can to your friends and family. We should get as much support as we can to push this through..

[Pedro Gonzales]

We have suffered too much from this long wait while the ROW EB2 can get GC in several months.

It's a f*** unfair system!

QBF,

This is precisely why you need to support HR 3012.

Please check this post (and the two posts below it) to see what you can do to help. Also, please feel free to repost it on the Chinese forums too (just change the "India" on my letter to "China"). It's time to get the big guns out.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10886#post10886

I just got done calling all the senators on the judiciary committee (took me about an hour and 15 minutes) and while they appear to be receiving more calls in support of the bill, they are certainly receiving some calls against the bill.

Sorry if I sound like a broken record guys, but my last post on this thread brought about a 100 views to the other thread, so I was sufficiently encouraged to try again. However, I'm not sure if any are resulting in emails or phone calls.

[qblogfan]

Yes, I do support HR 3012. That's why I said it's an unfair system!

Yesterday I read this bill and I completely agree with you guys! I have emailed and called congressman for many times.

I think Indian and Chinese nationals are unfairly treated and there is no reason for us to wait 5 times more than the ROW EB2.



QBF,

This is precisely why you need to support HR 3012.

Please check this post (and the two posts below it) to see what you can do to help. Also, please feel free to repost it on the Chinese forums too (just change the "India" on my letter to "China"). It's time to get the big guns out.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10886#post10886

I just got done calling all the senators on the judiciary committee (took me about an hour and 15 minutes) and while they appear to be receiving more calls in support of the bill, they are certainly receiving some calls against the bill.

Sorry if I sound like a broken record guys, but my last post on this thread brought about a 100 views to the other thread, so I was sufficiently encouraged to try again. However, I'm not sure if any are resulting in emails or phone calls.

[manubhai]

QBF,

This is precisely why you need to support HR 3012.

Please check this post (and the two posts below it) to see what you can do to help. Also, please feel free to repost it on the Chinese forums too (just change the "India" on my letter to "China"). It's time to get the big guns out.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10886#post10886

I just got done calling all the senators on the judiciary committee (took me about an hour and 15 minutes) and while they appear to be receiving more calls in support of the bill, they are certainly receiving some calls against the bill.

Sorry if I sound like a broken record guys, but my last post on this thread brought about a 100 views to the other thread, so I was sufficiently encouraged to try again. However, I'm not sure if any are resulting in emails or phone calls.

All,
If you are an Indian or Chinese, you have to be out of your mind to not do the best you can to support HR 3012. And you don't have weeks or months to show your support. The bill gets consideration in the committee this Thursday and Friday. This is the bill's last chance to succeed and go to the house floor for a vote, or just die in the committee with no chance of ever becoming a law.

Please see Pedro's posts for how to take about 3 minutes to make a call to tell your representatives that you support it and request them to support it, ESPECIALLY THE ONES ON THE HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE. (All numbers available in Pedro's post quoted above)

Again, you only have Wednesday, October 12 (and a little bit of Thursday) to make the calls. You can send an email, but since emails get read days later, they will not help as much as a call for the purposes of the house judiciary committee hearing/markup.

And seriously, get off your butt and make the call. Enough talking, enough harping, enough saying how miserable our lives are despite our education, hard work, sacrifice, etc etc... NOW IS THE TIME TO "DO" something about it because NOW IS THE TIME when it will have the maximum impact.

MAKE THE CALL. THIS IS THE CLOSEST WE HAVE EVER BEEN FOR A REAL CHANGE IN THE LAW FOR EMPLOYMENT BASED IMMIGRATION.

[Pedro Gonzales]

I'm posting this here again (to drive traffic to the HR3012 thread) since I noticed the other post got moved to the other thread. I'm guessing that was done in error.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10886#post10886

Check this post out guys. It lists what you can do to help further the HR3012, the bill to eliminate country caps. Send emails to your reps and make calls to the judiciary committee tomorrow and lend your support for the bill. Remember, that there are parties calling in to register their opinion against the bill. To change the status quo we'll need far more calls for the bill than against it. A simple majority won't suffice.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Good to know QBF, but we need you to propagate this on the Chinese forums too. If there ever was a time for Hindi-Chini Bhai Bhai ('Indian, Chinese, Brother Brother', old Indian saying) it is now.

[manubhai]

QBF,

This is precisely why you need to support HR 3012.

Please check this post (and the two posts below it) to see what you can do to help. Also, please feel free to repost it on the Chinese forums too (just change the "India" on my letter to "China"). It's time to get the big guns out.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10886#post10886

I just got done calling all the senators on the judiciary committee (took me about an hour and 15 minutes) and while they appear to be receiving more calls in support of the bill, they are certainly receiving some calls against the bill.

Sorry if I sound like a broken record guys, but my last post on this thread brought about a 100 views to the other thread, so I was sufficiently encouraged to try again. However, I'm not sure if any are resulting in emails or phone calls.

All,
If you are an Indian or Chinese, you have to be out of your mind to not do the best you can to support HR 3012. And you don't have weeks or months to show your support. The bill gets consideration in the committee this Thursday and Friday. This is the bill's last chance to succeed and go to the house floor for a vote, or just die in the committee with no chance of ever becoming a law.

Please see Pedro's posts for how to take about 3 minutes to make a call to tell your representatives that you support it and request them to support it, ESPECIALLY THE ONES ON THE HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE. (All numbers available in Pedro's post quoted above)

Again, you only have Wednesday, October 12 (and a little bit of Thursday) to make the calls. You can send an email, but since emails get read days later, they will not help as much as a call for the purposes of the house judiciary committee hearing/markup.

And seriously, get off your butt and make the call. Enough talking, enough harping, enough saying how miserable our lives are despite our education, hard work, sacrifice, etc etc... NOW IS THE TIME TO "DO" something about it because NOW IS THE TIME when it will have the maximum impact.

MAKE THE CALL. THIS IS THE CLOSEST WE HAVE EVER BEEN FOR A REAL CHANGE IN THE LAW FOR EMPLOYMENT BASED IMMIGRATION.

[immi2910]

Actions I took:
- e-mailed Congressman for my district to support the petition, will be sending a letter today by post
- e-mailed Senators
- Called all 38 people listed on the message. Left voice mails for bunch of them and spoke to a few staffers
- e-mailed all 38 people
- signed WH petition to support this law
- sent e-mails to reporters to cover this story

[jackbrown_890]

there is some more news from sciencemag today,,
"Representative Lamar Smith (R-TX), who is chair of the House Judiciary Committee, has been the main stumbli block to any major reform affecting STEM............blah blah,,,,,(also talks about democrates,,Obama..etc and last weeks hearing).... And those in attendance are guessing that the answers Smith received will eventually be folded into legislation.
Smith won't disclose his plans. But a committee staff member says that he "is considering a few proposals. Last week's hearing by the Judiciary Committee's immigration panel, the staffer adds, "shows that [the topic] is on his radar." Advocates expect him to either introduce his own bill or throw his considerable weight behind one of several pieces of legislation with similar goals.

"He has expressed support for a STEM bill, and told us that it could happen this year," says Russell Harrison, a lobbyist for IEEE-USA, the public policy arm of the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers. "If he introduces his own bill, the odds of its passage would be very good."

One of those proposals, expected to be introduced as soon as today, comes from Representative Raúl Labrador (R-ID). A former immigration attorney who grew up in Puerto Rico, Labrador is not a member of the Judiciary Committee, which has jurisdiction over the topic. But Labrador has been working with another freshman legislator, Representative Tim Griffin (R-AR), who chaired last week's hearing and is preparing his own bill.

[qesehmk]

Friends and Other Gurus,

Will you please allow visibility to these petitions that Pedro and Manubhai are trying to drive? Lets leave it to Manubhai and Pedro to clear these postings on their own.

Pedro and Manubhai, please limit to 1 posting per day to this high visibility thread and then next day please clear these postings to keep the threads clean for other users.

thank you.
Q


Let's try one more time.

Check this link out folks on what you can do to support HR3012 that will end country caps, and push EB2IC and EB3I ahead by 2 years. I called all 38 congressmen on this list today. While most calls they are getting support the bill, there is a concerted effort being waged against the bill too. To change the status quo, we will need an overwhelming majority of calls to be for the bill, a simple majority will not do. We need all of you to call in this week (either tomorrow or Thursday) while the bill is in committee.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10886#post10886

Guys, if there's a reason this post is being deleting, please PM me so we can discuss it.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Good job immi2910. That's two things more that you did than i did.

Looks like we're starting to get some traction. To the extent there are others that made calls, feel free to post it here.

This thread got about 300 clicks today, assuming that's only 150 unique visitors, and assuming a 3% conversion rate, there ought to be at least 5 others who made calls. Let us know if it was you.

Also, to those who post on the main 'calculations' thread, if you could paste a link to post 122 on this thread into your signature (basically copy my signature), it will hopefully drive more people to this thread. We need that extra attention for the next two days.

Double check if the link works, sometimes copy pasting it doesn't. You may need to go to the post and right click and select copy link and then paste it into your signature (settings > edit my signature).

[kwho32]

"But I wish this bill should pass and should become law as soon as possible! which is a great relief but no credit for **."

But it seems even the congressman who sponsored this bill gave credit to **....not sure you are aware of it....

http://chaffetz.house.gov/press-releases/2011/09/chaffetz-introduces-immigration-bill.shtml

some spinets from the link

"This legislation is pro-growth, pro-jobs, and pro-innovation. It is supported by the US Chamber of Commerce, Compete America (a coalition of high tech companies (Microsoft, Google, Oracle, etc.) and various trade groups (BSA, SIA, ITIC, etc.), and * * (the leading coalition of highly skilled foreign professionals)."

Is this because you had disagreement with them you decided to discredit them???


Anyway lets all work on this bill gets passed instead of fight on who gets credit for this....that fight will anyway will come when it really become law... :-)


Might be true, this bills may pass but very narrow hope on this bills. because I am seeing this kind of bills coming to the Congress/Senate floor every year and nothing happens. eventhough I support and doing needful.

NEVER EVER BELIEVE A POLITICIAN IN LIFE! that is the lesson learned from this bill dramas, and again, the organisation ** which claims to be sponsoring this also is a multi million business, for the already GC holders who claims that they sacrifice their life for all EB community. that too in USA. in this bad economy, they must be kidding and making money. So the soon each EB immigrants realise this TRUTH, they wont loose their hard earned money in the name of advocacy and monthly donor collection.

All the prayers to pass this bill. I had past 5 years experience with thi ** that as soon as the bill fails they comes out and says this is unfortunate we will keep our advocacy alive and keep on paying money to support EB community. if you question the account and the balance sheet then you will know the clear picture. So Please don't believe ** not an advice but otherwise you will come to know soon.! especially if the bill fails.

But I wish this bill should pass and should become law as soon as possible! which is a great relief but no credit for **.

[nishant2200]

Apart from Chaftez and smith, it seems that Tim Griffin is also sponsor now.

[jackbrown_890]

there is some more news from sciencemag today,,
"Representative Lamar Smith (R-TX), who is chair of the House Judiciary Committee, has been the main stumbli block to any major reform affecting STEM............blah blah,,,,,(also talks about democrates,,Obama..etc and last weeks hearing).... And those in attendance are guessing that the answers Smith received will eventually be folded into legislation.
Smith won't disclose his plans. But a committee staff member says that he "is considering a few proposals. Last week's hearing by the Judiciary Committee's immigration panel, the staffer adds, "shows that [the topic] is on his radar." Advocates expect him to either introduce his own bill or throw his considerable weight behind one of several pieces of legislation with similar goals.

"He has expressed support for a STEM bill, and told us that it could happen this year," says Russell Harrison, a lobbyist for IEEE-USA, the public policy arm of the Institute of Electrical and Electronics Engineers. "If he introduces his own bill, the odds of its passage would be very good."

One of those proposals, expected to be introduced as soon as today, comes from Representative Raúl Labrador (R-ID). A former immigration attorney who grew up in Puerto Rico, Labrador is not a member of the Judiciary Committee, which has jurisdiction over the topic. But Labrador has been working with another freshman legislator, Representative Tim Griffin (R-AR), who chaired last week's hearing and is preparing his own bill.



Here we go: Another EB related bill: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c112:H.R.3146:#

[Pedro Gonzales]

Hi Q,
Before you delete this post, can you tell me where is the projection that you guys made based on PD', Spillover etc. Also,have you done analysis if country limit is removed? thanks.

Not a full fledged analysis, but a summary is available on the legislation thread. Check out this post.

http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=9532#post9532

Also look at posts 42 and 48 for some more analysis.

[immi2910]

I remember seeing a timeline for HR 3012 in one of the posts that said it could become a law by end of this year. It basically outlined the steps after Thursday hearing. Does anyone remember where that is?

EDIT: Found it - http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10662#post10662

[Pedro Gonzales]

I made another round of calls on behalf of my wife today. The offices are a lot better prepared for the deluge today, almost none put me through to the immigration staffer, and all just wanted to know where I was from, some wanted my name, and then the position on the bill. Most didn't want me to go into my spiel at all.

Bottom line, finished all 38 calls in 30 minutes. I think it's getting to be a rat race now. Keep the phones manned, everybody.

[immitime]

As per www.immigration-law.com


10/12/2011: Another Employment-Based Immigration Reform Bill Introduced in the House on 10/11/2011Rep. Raul Labrador of Idaho introduced yesterday in the House H.R.3146 to promote innovation, investment, and research in the United States. This bill is cosponsored by: Rep Robert Dold of IL, Rep Tim Griffin of Arkansas, Rep Dennis Ross of Florida, Rep James Sensenbrenner of Wisconsin, and Rep Kevin Yoder of Kansas. For the full text of the bill, please revisit this posting later.

There are lot of Bills.. for EB immigration this time, just wait and see the high drama and where all it ends up.

to immi2010, The bill becoming law is only more optimistic view, we should anticipate atleast 6 months from now. or within 4 months minimum

Thanks

[immi2910]

to immi2010, The bill becoming law is only more optimistic view, we should anticipate atleast 6 months from now. or within 4 months minimum

Thanks

Can someone explain what is actually happening on Thursday (and why am I making these calls :) )? When will we know that whatever happened on Thursday was successful?

EDIT: If it is 6 months that takes us to April - May of 2012. I doubt anything will happen at that time with elections just around the corner.

[immitime]

As per my understanding.. After the Judiciary committee meeting, if everyone agrees this can go for a vote in the congress, ( we are calling reps/senators for voting "YES" and getting more support for this bill if there is a vote, and calling Judiciary committe members to make this bill towards the floor for a vote) there can be lot of push pull, bargains, inclusion/exclusion. before it is voted, and if it is passed the congress, it will go for a vote in the senate,(60 dems and 40 republicans) and if it passes senate, it will go to The President for signature, and it becomes Law. And we can expect the dates jump at that time.!!!



Can someone explain what is actually happening on Thursday (and why am I making these calls :) )? When will we know that whatever happened on Thursday was successful?

EDIT: If it is 6 months that takes us to April - May of 2012. I doubt anything will happen at that time with elections just around the corner.

[immi2910]

As per my understanding.. After the Judiciary committee meeting, if everyone agrees this can go for a vote in the congress, ( we are calling reps/senators for voting "YES" and getting more support for this bill if there is a vote, and calling Judiciary committe members to make this bill towards the floor for a vote) there can be lot of push pull, bargains, inclusion/exclusion. before it is voted, and if it is passed the congress, it will go for a vote in the senate,(60 dems and 40 republicans) and if it passes senate, it will go to The President for signature, and it becomes Law. And we can expect the dates jump at that time.!!!

Thanks immitime. However, what I would like to know is what happens on Thursday. Will the Judiciary committee vote on it on Thursday? If yes then what happens if it passes? Do they immediately table it in the house?

[manubhai]

I wanted to let every one know that on average, my calls have taken me about 45 seconds per call. The folks who pick the phones get such calls regularly so know what to expect. They just ask for your name and note down the bill and thank you for the call.

FINAL HOUR POINTS:
1. FIRST CALL THE DEMOCRATS, THEN GET TO THE REPUBLICANS.
2. MAKE SURE YOU MENTION HR 3012 TWICE.
3. DO UTTER THE STATEMENT: THIS BILL IS BEING CONSIDERED IN THE HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE TOMORROW AND THAT IS THE REASON WHY I AM CALLING RIGHT NOW.

Phone numbers are in Pedro's quote below.

Thank you!!

Here are the Phone numbers of the Members of Congress in House Judiciary Committee. I am working my way down the list of democrats.

Republican
Rep.Lamar Smith [TX, 21st District] - 202-225-4236
Rep.Jason Chaffetz [UT, 3rd District] - 202-225-7751
Rep.Bob Goodlatte [VA, 6th District] - 202-225-5431
Rep. Elton Gallegly [CA – 24th District] - 202-225-5811
Rep.Steve Chabot [OH, 1st District]- 202-225-2216
Rep.Darrell Issa [CA, 49th District] - 202-225-3906
Rep.James Sensenbrenner [WI, 5th District] - 202-225-5101
Rep. Howard Coble [NC, 6th District] - 202-225-3065
Rep.Daniel Lungren [CA, 3rd District] - 202-225-5716
Rep.Mike Pence [IN, 6th District] - 202-225-3021
Rep.Randy Forbes [VA, 4th District]- 202-225-6365
Rep.Steve King [IA, 5th District] - 202-225-4426
Rep.Trent Franks [AZ-2nd District] - 202-225-4576
Rep.Louie Gohmert [TX, 1st District] - 202-225-3035
Rep.Jim Jordan [OH, 4th District] - 202-225-2676
Rep.Ted Poe [TX, 2nd District] - 202-225-6565
Rep.Tim Griffin [AR, 2nd District] - 202-225-2506
Rep.Tom Marino [PA, 10th District] - 202-225-3731
Rep.Trey Gowdy [SC, 4th District] - 202-225-6030
Rep.Dennis Ross [FL, 12th District] - 202-225-1252
Rep.Sandy Adams [FL, 24th District] - 202-225-2706
Rep.Ben Quayle [AZ, 3rd District] - 202-225-3361
Rep. Mark Amodei [NV, 2nd District] - 202-225-6155

Democrat
Rep.Zoe Lofgren [CA, 16th District] - 202-225-3072
Rep.Pedro Pierluisi [Puerto Rico] - 202-225-2615
Rep.John Conyers [MI, 14th District] - 202-225-5126
Rep.Howard Berman [CA, 28th District] - 202-225-4695
Rep.Jerold Nadler [NY, 8th District] - 202-225-5635
Rep.Robert Scott [VA, 3rd District] - 202-225-8351
Rep.Mel Watt [NC, 12th District] - 202-225-1510
Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee [TX, 18th District] - 202-225-3816
Rep.Maxine Waters [CA, 25th District] - 202-225-2201
Rep.Steve Cohen [TN, 9th District] - 202-225-3265
Rep.Henry Johnson [GA, 4th District] - 202-225-1605
Rep.Mike Quigley [IL, 5th District] - 202-225-4061
Rep. Judy Chu [CA, 32nd District] - 202-225-5464
Rep.Ted Deutch [FL, 19th District] - 202-225-3001
Rep.Linda Sanchez [CA, 39th District] - 202-225-6676

[immitime]

The folllowing link may answer your questions elborately.. I gain insist never ever believe 100 % in any POLITICAL bills or process anywhere in the world. donot expect too much. But Hope keep up our work powerful and enthusiastic. Please call your congressmen and Senators office and ask them to vote "YES" for this bill.and keep the Prayers alive!

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0101183.html



Thanks immitime. However, what I would like to know is what happens on Thursday. Will the Judiciary committee vote on it on Thursday? If yes then what happens if it passes? Do they immediately table it in the house?

[immi2910]

The folllowing link may answer your questions elborately.. I gain insist never ever believe 100 % in any POLITICAL bills or process anywhere in the world. donot expect too much. But Hope keep up our work powerful and enthusiastic. Please call your congressmen and Senators office and ask them to vote "YES" for this bill.and keep the Prayers alive!

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0101183.html

So Judiciary committee may not even vote on it tomorrow. And they may not vote for some time. In that case why is it important to call before tomorrow. Shouldn't we call when they are ready to vote?

[Pedro Gonzales]

So Judiciary committee may not even vote on it tomorrow. And they may not vote for some time. In that case why is it important to call before tomorrow. Shouldn't we call when they are ready to vote?

The bill is being marked up tomorrow and FrIday. From my understanding, that's the beat time to push for a recommendation from the judicial committee, that'll get the bill to the house floor for a debate / vote. Not making these calls will result in the bill getting stuck in committee limbo. Your call will help the committee members take a position that'll get this bill to the floor.

The next step will be mobilizing support among the rest of the congress so calls to over 500 representatives to get their yea vote on the bill.

[manubhai]

The bill is being marked up tomorrow and FrIday.... Not making these calls will result in the bill getting stuck in committee limbo....

I want to point out about what Pedro calls "limbo" - Its actually "dead".

If the committees don't get to a "Yes...we'll send this to the house for a vote"... the chance of this bill being reconsidered in the committee itself is negligible. They have a truck load of bills to look at... and most of them usually end up dead...and that too if at all they are ever considered in a markup.

So yes... its more important to call those democrats and republicans of the House Judiciary committee now than when it'll be in the house. At that time, we'll just have to call as many as we can, esp. those who oppose it or don't have a stated "for" position on it.

[jackbrown_890]

So Judiciary committee may not even vote on it tomorrow. And they may not vote for some time. In that case why is it important to call before tomorrow. Shouldn't we call when they are ready to vote?

It will be as important to call them again when/if it will considered for voting in Judiciary Committee. And again it will be as important to call them when it actually goes for a vote in the main House. And if it passes the house we will have to call senate members to consider the bill in Senate. if they consider it, there will be a mark up and we will have to call again and thn once/if it makes it to senate for vote we will ahve to call senate members to pass it.
I think our major block will be senate because this bill is proposed by a republican house rep. and senate is controlled by democrats.
SO now back to why we need to call them right now: because if the see lot of people are calling about this bill, may be some democrats will support this bill like Zoe Logfren. And if we have some support of House democrats for this bill, it will become little easy for us to push this bill in Democrat controlled senate.
I am not trying scare anyone but just telling the reality. Keep in mind it is not going to be easy. We all need to do some hard work.
From my side, I see - calling house reps from my area is not hard work since it will take me only few mins. and same for you or Q or Spec or V..but the hard work for us is to convince 1000s of people call at every major step of this bill and keep doing it till we get it passed.
So i hope this explains why you need to call. But don't stop there, tell people you know to call too and tell them to tell other people to make a phone call.

also i want to be clear on something here. Some of you questioning why is this bill important, and why do we support this bill now even though you have supported many bills in the past and they did not pass...
i may have mentioned it in the past:
the main reasons
1: this is proposed by House Republican
2: house is controlled by republicans
3: it is similar to Zoe's bill and she has been trying to get similar bill passed but she belongs to minority party right now so the best she can do is make ammendments to this bill to match her bill
4: thus we can get bipartisan supprt
5: Co-Sponsor Lamar Smith: BIG THING - Smith is supporting this bill, he is usually against immigration,,his support makes this bill really important to make it thru Sub-committee since he is a chairman of Judiciary
6: lot of other organziations supporting it

Hope this makes some sense
good luck

[gcq]

I read in one post that Lofgren had offered to co-sponsor it, but Lamar Smith turned it down as Lofgren didn't support his E-Verify bill.
Still Lofgren may support it.

http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2011/10/house-prepares-to-move-stem-immigration.html?ref=ra


According to those who follow the STEM immigration debate closely, Lofgren wanted to co-sponsor a much narrower bill introduced last month by Representative Jason Chaffetz (R-UT) that would lift the current ceiling limiting the number of immigrants according to their country of origin. The Chaffetz bill, HR 3012, would benefit information technology companies trying to retain Indian software engineers who now face a 70-year wait for a green card. But Smith nixed the offer as payback for Lofgren's opposition to Smith's attempt to toughen E-Verify, a system for employers to weed out illegal aliens.)

[immitime]

Politics, Politricks, Politics... ultimate people suffering in this case EB immigrants.

Watch the live Judiciary committe hearing WEBCAST for Oct 13th 2011 started from 10:00 am, I think H.R. 3012 will be taken tomorrow.

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10132011.html

Good luck to all. I have called all the republicans congressman and Democrat congressman as per the list, and will call again today and tomorrow.


I read in one post that Lofgren had offered to co-sponsor it, but Lamar Smith turned it down as Lofgren didn't support his E-Verify bill.
Still Lofgren may support it.

[geterdone]

The 3012 bill is under- Full Committee Markup. Does that mean they are taking it seriously? Many other hearings in the past was under sub-committee.

[immitime]

Never keep too much expectations. we can only Hope and with the backing of prayers.


The 3012 bill is under- Full Committee Markup. Does that mean they are taking it seriously? Many other hearings in the past was under sub-committee.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Never keep too much expectations. we can only Hope and with the backing of prayers.

The problem with a 'hope for the best, expect the worst' attitude is that it is a little fatalistic. In this case, there is some benefit in tempered optimism, because we have the ability to drive the fate of this bill. If people are excited about the prospects of its becoming law, they are more motivated to put in some effort.

We've managed to get over 1,000 clicks to this thread in just the last 3 days (i noticed a surge two nights ago when Q temporarily shut down the main thread). I'm hoping that's at least 500 unique visitors, and that we achieved a 3% conversion rate, so about 15 of us called all the congressmen on the list (I know at least 4 of us did and three of us more than once). I think that makes a difference.

Geterdone, Not a legislative expert, but from my research, I think you're right. The fact that it didn't get bumped to a subcommittee is encouraging. It's one deathtrap that's been avoided. There are many others.

[immitime]

Pedro,

Why I am saying this is last to last year there was a similar bill, it was voted down on congress, that is the end of it. so this year if there is support from both parties and there is no carpet pulling by antiimmigrants, then it could pass congress for sure but in "Senate" we need to cross our fingers and wait. There is going to be lot of arguments even in Congress, there will be lot of exclusion or inclusion according to various hidden interest. but you might know very will that is what POLITICS IS. Even president can do an executive order without congress or senate, but this one does not have the back bone for that. He wants everything comprehensive! My True wish is this bill should pass and become law ASAP!


The problem with a 'hope for the best, expect the worst' attitude is that it is a little fatalistic. In this case, there is some benefit in tempered optimism, because we have the ability to drive the fate of this bill. If people are excited about the prospects of its becoming law, they are more motivated to put in some effort.

We've managed to get over 1,000 clicks to this thread in just the last 3 days (i noticed a surge two nights ago when Q temporarily shut down the main thread). I'm hoping that's at least 500 unique visitors, and that we achieved a 3% conversion rate, so about 15 of us called all the congressmen on the list (I know at least 4 of us did and three of us more than once). I think that makes a difference.

Geterdone, Not a legislative expert, but from my research, I think you're right. The fact that it didn't get bumped to a subcommittee is encouraging. It's one deathtrap that's been avoided. There are many others.

[skpanda]

i do not see any video (windows media player opens but then says, it cannot play)? is the hearing complete?


Politics, Politricks, Politics... ultimate people suffering in this case EB immigrants.

Watch the live Judiciary committe hearing WEBCAST for Oct 13th 2011 started from 10:00 am, I think H.R. 3012 will be taken tomorrow.

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10132011.html

Good luck to all. I have called all the republicans congressman and Democrat congressman as per the list, and will call again today and tomorrow.

[immi2910]

Thank you for explaining it clearly. So best case scenario they vote on it tomorrow. Most likely they debate on it. Worst case they table it.


It will be as important to call them again when/if it will considered for voting in Judiciary Committee. And again it will be as important to call them when it actually goes for a vote in the main House. And if it passes the house we will have to call senate members to consider the bill in Senate. if they consider it, there will be a mark up and we will have to call again and thn once/if it makes it to senate for vote we will ahve to call senate members to pass it.
I think our major block will be senate because this bill is proposed by a republican house rep. and senate is controlled by democrats.
SO now back to why we need to call them right now: because if the see lot of people are calling about this bill, may be some democrats will support this bill like Zoe Logfren. And if we have some support of House democrats for this bill, it will become little easy for us to push this bill in Democrat controlled senate.
I am not trying scare anyone but just telling the reality. Keep in mind it is not going to be easy. We all need to do some hard work.
From my side, I see - calling house reps from my area is not hard work since it will take me only few mins. and same for you or Q or Spec or V..but the hard work for us is to convince 1000s of people call at every major step of this bill and keep doing it till we get it passed.
So i hope this explains why you need to call. But don't stop there, tell people you know to call too and tell them to tell other people to make a phone call.

also i want to be clear on something here. Some of you questioning why is this bill important, and why do we support this bill now even though you have supported many bills in the past and they did not pass...
i may have mentioned it in the past:
the main reasons
1: this is proposed by House Republican
2: house is controlled by republicans
3: it is similar to Zoe's bill and she has been trying to get similar bill passed but she belongs to minority party right now so the best she can do is make ammendments to this bill to match her bill
4: thus we can get bipartisan supprt
5: Co-Sponsor Lamar Smith: BIG THING - Smith is supporting this bill, he is usually against immigration,,his support makes this bill really important to make it thru Sub-committee since he is a chairman of Judiciary
6: lot of other organziations supporting it

Hope this makes some sense
good luck

[nishant2200]

great effort guys. This is it. This is the last chance I feel for until after election. I sent letter and now going to call in lunchtime.

right now they are talking about the right to carry guns on the webcast! It seems we shall be discussed after this, looking at the order of bills on the webpage immitime put.

[skpanda]

how are you able to see the webcast? when i click on it... windows media player opens and then after a while tells it cannot play the video.



great effort guys. This is it. This is the last chance I feel for until after election. I sent letter and now going to call in lunchtime.

right now they are talking about the right to carry guns on the webcast! It seems we shall be discussed after this, looking at the order of bills on the webpage immitime put.

[immi2910]

Ron Gotcher says (http://www.immigration-information.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15383&p=63726&viewfull=1#post63726) that bill would only worsen the situation as it is time limited. Is that true? I don't remember reading that this is a time limited bill.

[nishant2200]

how are you able to see the webcast? when i click on it... windows media player opens and then after a while tells it cannot play the video.

it worked for me. i am using chrome. when i click it download some asx file, and then when i click on the asx, it opens in windows media player.

I am having windows 7 professional.

[skpanda]

I am guessing he is very busy and did not have time to read the complete bill.


Ron Gotcher says (http://www.immigration-information.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15383&p=63726&viewfull=1#post63726) that bill would only worsen the situation as it is time limited. Is that true? I don't remember reading that this is a time limited bill.

[geterdone]

i'm using xp and firefox 7.0.1 and it is working. everything works with xp. if this bill does not pass they should introduce a bill to give GC to eveyone on EB2 who uses xp.


it worked for me. i am using chrome. when i click it download some asx file, and then when i click on the asx, it opens in windows media player.

I am having windows 7 professional.

[Pedro Gonzales]

great effort guys. This is it. This is the last chance I feel for until after election. I sent letter and now going to call in lunchtime.

right now they are talking about the right to carry guns on the webcast! It seems we shall be discussed after this, looking at the order of bills on the webpage immitime put.

Have you been watching for a while? So, they haven't discussed it yet? I'm asking because i just heard from a congressman's staffer that he 'voted' in favor of the bill. Not sure if he misspoke.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Ron Gotcher says (http://www.immigration-information.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15383&p=63726&viewfull=1#post63726) that bill would only worsen the situation as it is time limited. Is that true? I don't remember reading that this is a time limited bill.

I see you've got an account on that site and you are logged in. Can you ask him where he sees that? I just reread the bill and see no time limitation at all.

[nishant2200]

Have you been watching for a while? So, they haven't discussed it yet? I'm asking because i just heard from a congressman's staffer that he 'voted' in favor of the bill. Not sure if he misspoke.

Pedro, few minutes back was first time I watched. so maybe I have missed the discussion. I was just assuming they are talking about the bills in the order in which they are listed on http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10132011.html

that may not be true.

[nishant2200]

reflector-39480.asx

guys, this should be exact file name which you download. if you download again, the browser puts a (1), (2) etc on it, and it doesn't open on those. it will only open on file named above originally. this is from my experience.

I wished I had seen this thread in the morning, so would have at least kept the audio on in one ear since morning.

[geterdone]

a lawyer is giving his opinion on a bill introduced by a politician. you see the problem!

if interested in lawyer jokes:

http://www.bullyonline.org/successunlimited/humour/lawyer.htm

i hope i'm not wasting valubale time and space of Q



I am guessing he is very busy and did not have time to read the complete bill.

[immitime]

Depends on the browser you use and the video settings on the browser. just do some google, you will be alright, as what I can see they might take the bill
only by tomorrow it is a 2 day hearing. so only by tomorrow afternoon we can expect H..R.3012

H.R. 2870, the “Adam Walsh Reauthorization Act of 2011”;
H.R. 1254, the “Synthetic Drug Control Act of 2011”;
H.R. 10, the “Regulations From the Executive in Need of Scrutiny Act of 2011”;
H.R. 822, the “National Right-to-Carry Reciprocity Act of 2011”; and,
H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act”

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10132011.html


H.R.3012 is last in the row.!!

i do not see any video (windows media player opens but then says, it cannot play)? is the hearing complete?

[Pedro Gonzales]

Pedro, few minutes back was first time I watched. so maybe I have missed the discussion. I was just assuming they are talking about the bills in the order in which they are listed on http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10132011.html

that may not be true.

i'm hearing on another forum too that it hasn't been discussed yet, so the staffer was possibly mistaken. He either misheard the bill I told him or just told me that he intends to vote in favor of the bill.

[skpanda]

i tried firefox/chrome - Windowx XP, Windows 7 etc does not work...Windows Media Player says, it cannot play.

I gave up trying... can somebody please update here at the end of day as to whats going on!

Thanks!


reflector-39480.asx

guys, this should be exact file name which you download. if you download again, the browser puts a (1), (2) etc on it, and it doesn't open on those. it will only open on file named above originally. this is from my experience.

I wished I had seen this thread in the morning, so would have at least kept the audio on in one ear since morning.

[gcq]

Ron is concerned about ROW folks. He himself being from a ROW country, it is just natural. He is referring to "time-limit" in terms of ROW. Once the 3 year transition phase is over, ROW won't have any visas reserved. That is what he is concerned about.

Another reason could be, he would be losing lot of porting revenue from I/C folks.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Ron is concerned about ROW folks. He himself being from a ROW country, it is just natural. He is referring to "time-limit" in terms of ROW. Once the 3 year transition phase is over, ROW won't have any visas reserved. That is what he is concerned about.

Another reason could be, he would be losing lot of porting revenue from I/C folks.

I also have issue with his earlier comment:
"As I wrote in another thread, I think that this is very bad legislation. If passed, I doubt that it would do anything positive for India/China EB2 applicants. Indeed, it might even result in fewer visas being available in a few years. EB3 applicants from India and China would be able to get more visas, but it would be at the expense of worldwide EB3 applicants."

The first sentence is subjective, I'll let it go.
For want of a better word i'm going to call the second sentence is a lie. It will benefit EB2 I/C applicants tremendously. If his point is that we're getting the spillover anyway, then he is implicitly claiming that there will be atleast 29,000 spillover from EB2ROW this year (on top of whatever spillover comes in from EB1 and EB5) and 31,000 for the next 2 years. It's a ridiculous claim and one that no one can know for sure.
The third sentence is as bad as the second. Except, I can't even think of a ridiculous argument that would justify it.
The fourth sentence captures the essence of the bill beautifully, but betrays a tone of gentle disappointment. That's the whole point Ron!

I never had an opinion on this guy, earlier. Now I do and its not one of approval.

[manubhai]

i do not see any video (windows media player opens but then says, it cannot play)? is the hearing complete?

Download the asf file from the bottom of this page: (NiceDay.asf)
http://www.jhepple.com/support/sample_movies1.htm

Open and play the file directly in Windows Media Player.

If it works, it means you have the codecs and all you need is to tell Firefox that the file needs to be played by WMP. For this:
Firefox > Tools > Options > Applications tab
In the search box, type "asf", and then from the right column select Use Other > Windows Media Player (or directly select WMP if its visible).

If it doesn't work, download and install VLC Player. That will get you the codecs. Repeat all the steps starting from running the above file in Windows Media Player and then make Firefox point to WMP for playing the file (All programs use the same codec)

Worst case: You can direct the streaming URL in VLC player and watch the video there.

If the above doesn't work, chill... we'll tell you what happens anyways!!!

[Pedro Gonzales]

Guys,

One more day to go. I encourage everyone who reads this thread and is from either EB2IC or EB3IC to call all the representatives tomorrow. Multiple times if you can. I have been scouring the web to see how things are going, and the opposition to the bill, though not well organized are putting up a strong fight to defend the advantage that they have (and who can blame them for it). One person put his 10 employees on the phone all day calling all the congressmen multiple times. If they each called all representatives ten times (at even 30 minutes each that's 5 hours), that's the equivalent of a 110 people. My argument is that to change the status quo, we need 10 times as many folk calling in support of the bill as against it. That's a 1000 people calling once.

We need more of you to call. If you have made calls, please post here to let us know that you have. Remember, if this dies tomorrow, nothing will change for 2 years at least.

[skpanda]

I have called all the reps. Tomorrow me and my better half are planning to call everyone once again! Hope for the best..

atleast 7 reps' assistants told me that they support the bill.



Guys,

One more day to go. I encourage everyone who reads this thread and is from either EB2IC or EB3IC to call all the representatives tomorrow. Multiple times if you can. I have been scouring the web to see how things are going, and the opposition to the bill, though not well organized are putting up a strong fight to defend the advantage that they have (and who can blame them for it). One person put his 10 employees on the phone all day calling all the congressmen multiple times. If they each called all representatives ten times (at even 30 minutes each that's 5 hours), that's the equivalent of a 110 people. My argument is that to change the status quo, we need 10 times as many folk calling in support of the bill as against it. That's a 1000 people calling once.

We need more of you to call. If you have made calls, please post here to let us know that you have. Remember, if this dies tomorrow, nothing will change for 2 years at least.

[skpanda]

Thanks.. its working now...

The sample movie played well.. no issues...
Checked Firefox Tools-options-App tab ---> asf is already set to WMP.

For whatever reason it was acting up on me.. yesterday..

Also if possible... can somebody plz record the hearing?

thx...




Download the asf file from the bottom of this page: (NiceDay.asf)
http://www.jhepple.com/support/sample_movies1.htm

Open and play the file directly in Windows Media Player.

If it works, it means you have the codecs and all you need is to tell Firefox that the file needs to be played by WMP. For this:
Firefox > Tools > Options > Applications tab
In the search box, type "asf", and then from the right column select Use Other > Windows Media Player (or directly select WMP if its visible).

If it doesn't work, download and install VLC Player. That will get you the codecs. Repeat all the steps starting from running the above file in Windows Media Player and then make Firefox point to WMP for playing the file (All programs use the same codec)

Worst case: You can direct the streaming URL in VLC player and watch the video there.

If the above doesn't work, chill... we'll tell you what happens anyways!!!

[Pedro Gonzales]

One person here (I'll leave it to him to identify himself) has convinced 10 undergrad students to man the phones all day today to make multiple rounds of calls. He has also posted a message on his school's Indian grad school student email list asking them to get up to speed on the issue and make calls.

These future EB2Is are the guys who this will benefit the most, and are the ones we should be targeting. They don't know anything about the bill, but they sure as hell know it'll take them over 5 years to get their GCs while their compatriots from other countries will get them immediately.

I encourage all of you to try and do the same. Try to remember/find out your grad school Indian student association email lists and email them the list of numbers, and ask them to call multiple times today.

[Pedro Gonzales]

does anyone know what happened to the mark up session for hr 3012... i see no updates anywhere. only those who've been watching the session live would know i guess

Still on gun proliferation. I always knew which side of that debate I was on but the single minded devotion of the Repubs to the NRA has been a revelation. Just watching the Dems bring up amendment after amendment to slow down the eventual passage of this bill through the committee helps put things in perspective.

[skpanda]

wt*... i had the session live.. whole day (did not see but had the audio on) and all they talked about was amendments on gun stuff. And finally the comitee was adjourned...

did they already talk about it yesterday? if yes.. what was the outcome?

[jackbrown_890]

does anyone know what happened to the mark up session for hr 3012... i see no updates anywhere. only those who've been watching the session live would know i guess

It looks like they used most of the time discussing 822. I don't know if 3012 mark up was done in the morning or not. but I think it did not happen today. So not sure when it will happen now. depends on Lamar Smith. Hopefully sometime next week.

[kd2008]

I may be wrong. But I think they are done for the day. Who knows when they will schedule the next mark up.

[gcq]

They didn't pick our bill today. They have recessed. Our bill was last on the list.

[gcq]

I was looking at the bills that were on Judiciary calender. Our bill was the last
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Bill Status
------------------------------------------------------------------------
H.R. 2471 Reported by Committee Oct 13, 2011 -- Done
H.R. 2870 Referred to Committee -- Not Done
H.R. 1254 Reported by Committee Jul 28, 2011 -- Done
H.R. 10 Referred to Committee -- Not Done
H.R. 822 Referred to Committee --Currently discussing
H.R. 3012 Referred to Committee -- Not Done

As per this list only 2 bills were "reported" ( meaning done). That means our bill is not even the next one to be considered. Am I reading this right ?

[immitime]

May be time constraint this can be rescheduled for next week.. but Hey.. who knows.

to my knowledge Congress Judiciary committee is on recess whole week,next week and we can expect something only on 10/24/2011..but no guarantee.

As I always believe through experience never ever believe a Politician... they lie tactfully, and show the carrot to us and give the stick finally.

Still there could be hope. but WHEN ???? that is a big question mark

[Pedro Gonzales]

I've heard conflicting views through the grapevine. One rumor said its due for early next week, and the other that it's due for the next session which would be the week after next at the earliest. Will let you know if I hear any updates. If anyone has any credible source of info, please send us the link.

[Pedro Gonzales]

The word is that this bill is 'likely' to be taken up again mid next week. Apparently, the support has been overwhelmingly for it, but the opposition to the bill is beginning to organize impressively. I would suggest that everybody take 30 minutes each day to make calls all 38 members of the judiciary committee. I just made my set of calls for today.

My recommendation is that you keep your message short on one subject (rather than all the talking points that have been circulating). Examples of things you can touch upon are:

a) Diversity while a noble goal on its own, is not appropriate in the high-skilled employment based immigration category; the US ought to be able to allow the people to immigrate based on what labor needs it has. If that need is overwhelmingly filled by people of one nation, people from that nation ought not to have special obstacles placed in their immigration path. The 140,000 employment based immigration green cards given out each year represents only about 15% (can someone confirm this figure?) of the total immigration into this country; All immigration is significantly less (again, does someone have figures they can put in here?) than the organic population growth of the US.

b) Some ask that the rules not be changed 'in the middle of the game', and that any change in rules ought to be made after the current back log is cleared. That will take several years. I believe that a system that is both unfair and contrary to US interests, ought to be rectified right away, and not several years from now.

c) People claim that Indian and Chinese immigrants on the whole already receive more than the 7% cap for employment based visas each year. This has been true in the last few years, but this is only because fewer non-Indian & non-Chinese applications have been received in the highest skills categories. Even taking into account this 'spillover' of green cards to Indian and Chinese immigrants, someone born in India or China still takes 5 years longer to get their green cards than someone born elsewhere.

And the message I've been focused on:

d) Some people think of the immigration issue in terms of groups of people from different countries competing to immigrate to the US, and that each country ought to have the same number of high-skilled immigrants permitted to immigrate. But the fact is that India did not send me here. I have chosen to come here on my own, and it seems unclear to me that I ought to wait 5 more years than someone from another country just because more people from India possess the skills that the US requires at this time.

If you have any other myths that you want to debunk, feel free to add them here. Keep the effort on.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Guys, Another thing sportsfan33 has been doing is to keep a tally of who has taken a position on the bill, and I can tell you that so far, of 14 identified positions (including the cosponsors), 13 are in support of and 1 against the bill. The 13 include some big names from both sides of the aisle. If anyone knows of the positions of any congressmen, send either sportsfan33 or me a PM and we'll add it to our tally. We should not publicize the names for obvious reasons.

In any case, this shouldn't mean by any means that we stop calling. They are politicians we're talking about, after all, and their aides continue to tally the calls, so I believe a concerted effort against the bill could still change positions. A set of calls every day continues to be my recommendation.

[gcq]

One thing to be noted, we are nowhere near the majority. Unless we get a 20+ affirmative "Yea", we are not there yet. We need to call daily without fail.
Somehow momentum seems to have died down on I V site.

[immitime]

Attorney Ron gotcher's opinion about H.R. 3012, so what he means is this legislation should not pass and EB-3 India people waiting for 11 years should continue to wait and this is the best way to make money for attorneys----------of course by renewing EAD and H1Bs...??? what a selfish mentality

http://www.immigration-information.com/forums/pending-immigration-legislation-32/bill-to-lift-country-caps-15383/index4.html

[Pedro Gonzales]

Attorney Ron gotcher's opinion about H.R. 3012, so what he means is this legislation should not pass and EB-3 India people waiting for 11 years should continue to wait and this is the best way to make money for attorneys----------of course by renewing EAD and H1Bs...??? what a selfish mentality

http://www.immigration-information.com/forums/pending-immigration-legislation-32/bill-to-lift-country-caps-15383/index4.html

Ron is grossly incorrect. We have covered this earlier on this thread. Check out this post:
http://www.qesehmk.org/forums/showthread.php?211-Discussion-of-Bills-that-remove-the-Per-Country-Limits-H.R.2161-H.R.3012-H.R.3119&p=10668#post10668
and some other responses until post #117 that covers this.

Rest assured, if this bill passes, India and China will be significantly benefited, unfortunately at the benefit of ROW.

[vishnu]

Ron and other lawyers benefit so much from the complexity in the process and also the EB3-EB2 upgrades. Naturally, they would not want it to pass. Not blaming them - each group will advocate the policy that favors their own interests.

[immitime]

Pedro,

Thanks for the link.

Vishnu

You said it man.......the complexity is money for the Attorneys.

[Sunnyznj]

Keep a look out for the voting on the website below...This is lacking supporters...

http://www.washingtonwatch.com/bills/show/112_HR_3012.html

[skpanda]

This bill is not marked up for next two hearings. Not sure if this will come back again!!

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/calendar.html

Good Luck to all!

[desiman]

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203752604576641421449460968.html?m od=googlenews_wsj

The reeling housing market has come to this: To shore it up, two Senators are preparing to introduce a bipartisan bill Thursday that would give residence visas to foreigners who spend at least $500,000 to buy houses in the U.S.

The provision is part of a larger package of immigration measures, co-authored by Sens. Charles Schumer (D., N.Y.) and Mike Lee (R., Utah), designed to spur more foreign investment in the U.S.

The provision would create visas that are separate from current programs so as to not displace anyone waiting for other visas. There would be no cap on the home-buyer visa program.

[vishnu]

desiman - this visa does not allow employement - so its not the same as the EB5 program or the regular greencard. it is a bit bizarre - not sure what purpose it serves.

On a different note, the fact that HR 3012 is not the ont the revised mark ups does not mean it has been abandoned. The fact that there are only single items for the 10/26 and 27th mark up sessions could they want to look at prior bills that were not examined.

[qesehmk]

Originally this was the idea from an Indian professor from Harvard. Forgot the name.

This particular bill may get passed but will hardly help EB2IC because the price range starts at half million dollars and secondly - hold your breath - it must be in CASH!!!

For most EB2ICs that are backlogged - both conditions - especially the second one- make this bill difficult to feel good about.


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203752604576641421449460968.html?m od=googlenews_wsj

The reeling housing market has come to this: To shore it up, two Senators are preparing to introduce a bipartisan bill Thursday that would give residence visas to foreigners who spend at least $500,000 to buy houses in the U.S.

The provision is part of a larger package of immigration measures, co-authored by Sens. Charles Schumer (D., N.Y.) and Mike Lee (R., Utah), designed to spur more foreign investment in the U.S.

The provision would create visas that are separate from current programs so as to not displace anyone waiting for other visas. There would be no cap on the home-buyer visa program.

[Pedro Gonzales]

This is a question for Pedro. Pedro, do you have any inside information?

Perhaps we can call Chaffetz and ask him when this bill is gonna be marked up.

No inside info. Haven't heard anything other than this will definitely get back on the mark up queue, probably for next week, and that the phone calls need to be sustained. I haven't made them in the last couple of days but i'm going to make another round today.

[immitime]

Originally this was the idea from an Indian professor from Harvard. Forgot the name.

This particular bill may get passed but will hardly help EB2IC because the price range starts at half million dollars and secondly - hold your breath - it must be in CASH!!!

For most EB2ICs that are backlogged - both conditions - especially the second one- make this bill difficult to feel good about.


They can clear the EB-3 India china backlogs by making the dates at least as good as EB-2 IC date at present that is Dec 2007. Result: Housing will improve, auto sales will improve, this will help economy, then they do not require any out of mind bills like this. all politics and politricks. Again regarding the H.R. 3012...is it not a Carrot and later changed into a Stick!

[immi2910]

This bill is not marked up for next two hearings. Not sure if this will come back again!!

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/calendar.html

Good Luck to all!

It has been added to the calendar for 10/27. It is again the last bill so am not sure if they will get to it.

[immitime]

It has been added to the calendar for 10/27. It is again the last bill so am not sure if they will get to it.

Really wish that this bill will pass both Congress and Senate and becomes law... by whatever way and doing whatever is in our control!

[kd2008]

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10252011.html

It is on the markup calendar for Oct. 25th and 27th.

Keep calling and keep pushing!

[immi2910]

From ** Forum:

We need one simple action item from you for Thursday and Friday this week -- make calls the offices listed below and say one simple thing :

"My name is _______. I would like Congressman/Congresswoman ______ to support H.R. 3012 that removes the per-country quota from employment based immigration. Thank you".

Below are the phone numbers and names of Congressman and Congresswomen in House Judiciary Committee that really matter this week and next week for this bill. Spare 15 minutes of time to do this and just do it if you have not already. If you called earlier this week, call again. Numbers matter. Call volume matters. Democracy works only for those who show up. It's time to do your part.



Rep.Lamar Smith [TX, 21st District] - 202-225-4236
Rep.Jason Chaffetz [UT, 3rd District] - 202-225-7751
Rep.Bob Goodlatte [VA, 6th District] - 202-225-5431
Rep.Zoe Lofgren [CA, 16th District] - 202-225-3072
Rep.Pedro Pierluisi [Puerto Rico] - 202-225-2615
Rep.John Conyers [MI, 14th District] - 202-225-5126
Rep.Howard Berman [CA, 28th District] - 202-225-4695
Rep. Elton Gallegly [CA – 24th District] - 202-225-5811
Rep.Steve Chabot [OH, 1st District]- 202-225-2216
Rep.Darrell Issa [CA, 49th District] - 202-225-3906
Rep.James Sensenbrenner [WI, 5th District] - 202-225-5101
Rep. Howard Coble [NC, 6th District] - 202-225-3065
Rep.Daniel Lungren [CA, 3rd District] - 202-225-5716
Rep.Mike Pence [IN, 6th District] - 202-225-3021
Rep.Randy Forbes [VA, 4th District]- 202-225-6365
Rep.Trent Franks [AZ-2nd District] - 202-225-4576
Rep.Louie Gohmert [TX, 1st District] - 202-225-3035
Rep.Jim Jordan [OH, 4th District] - 202-225-2676
Rep.Ted Poe [TX, 2nd District] - 202-225-6565
Rep.Tim Griffin [AR, 2nd District] - 202-225-2506
Rep.Tom Marino [PA, 10th District] - 202-225-3731
Rep.Trey Gowdy [SC, 4th District] - 202-225-6030
Rep.Dennis Ross [FL, 12th District] - 202-225-1252
Rep.Sandy Adams [FL, 24th District] - 202-225-2706
Rep.Ben Quayle [AZ, 3rd District] - 202-225-3361
Rep. Mark Amodei [NV, 2nd District] - 202-225-6155
Rep.Jerold Nadler [NY, 8th District] - 202-225-5635
Rep.Robert Scott [VA, 3rd District] - 202-225-8351
Rep.Mel Watt [NC, 12th District] - 202-225-1510
Rep. Sheila Jackson Lee [TX, 18th District] - 202-225-3816
Rep.Maxine Waters [CA, 25th District] - 202-225-2201
Rep.Steve Cohen [TN, 9th District] - 202-225-3265
Rep.Henry Johnson [GA, 4th District] - 202-225-1605
Rep.Mike Quigley [IL, 5th District] - 202-225-4061
Rep. Judy Chu [CA, 32nd District] - 202-225-5464
Rep.Ted Deutch [FL, 19th District] - 202-225-3001
Rep.Linda Sanchez [CA, 39th District] - 202-225-6676

[Pedro Gonzales]

Finally, something official out of Sheila Murthy's office on HR3012. I'd emailed their offices a few times to get them to put something official on their legislative page, but they've done one better.
http://www.murthy.com/bulletin.html
This bulletin will get 1000s of eyeballs. I just hope all the folks that read it realize that these calls have to be made immediately. I've posted on their forum but i'm not sure if it'll be approved.

[suninphx]

Finally, something official out of Sheila Murthy's office on HR3012. I'd emailed their offices a few times to get them to put something official on their legislative page, but they've done one better.
http://www.murthy.com/bulletin.html
This bulletin will get 1000s of eyeballs. I just hope all the folks that read it realize that these calls have to be made immediately. I've posted on their forum but i'm not sure if it'll be approved.

This is awesome!!

[immitime]

This is great, more people will be aware, and I personally like the following from Murthy site.

Without our input, senators and representatives will act in the way they personally think best. Due to the high volume of issues, they may not know much about a particular issue unless we have taken the time to inform them. By participating in the democratic process and sharing our views on the issues, we are ensuring that our elected officials are making informed decisions. Otherwise, senators and representatives may base their positions

http://www.murthy.com/ccongres.html

[smuggymba]

NO MORE CALLS NEEDED. PLEASE **DO NOT** call anymore. This is an action item from **.

Yes, I'm meeting with one staffer here in TX this week. We need to keep the momentum going even after is passes the committee.

[qesehmk]

Dude - the award for "patience of the millenium" goes to you!!

As per post 2012 - as long as the economy is like this, things will move 25-30K per year. An improving economy is going to hurt EB2IC. 25-30K is just about right annual rate for EB2IC. So we are talking a 1 Yr movement per year. Please understand this is very rough estimate.


Gurus - how will the predictions/dates move after 3012? Thanks a lot.

[Kanmani]

Dude - the award for "patience of the millenium" goes to you!!

As per post 2012 - as long as the economy is like this, things will move 25-30K per year. An improving economy is going to hurt EB2IC. 25-30K is just about right annual rate for EB2IC. So we are talking a 1 Yr movement per year. Please understand this is very rough estimate.

Q

smuggymba is referring to H.R.3012

[smuggymba]

Dude - the award for "patience of the millenium" goes to you!!

As per post 2012 - as long as the economy is like this, things will move 25-30K per year. An improving economy is going to hurt EB2IC. 25-30K is just about right annual rate for EB2IC. So we are talking a 1 Yr movement per year. Please understand this is very rough estimate.

I accept the award with humility.

I was referring to HR 3012...how would the predictions change..maybe this has been discussed - just point me to the right thread. Thanks.

[qesehmk]

Totally my bad! Sorry smugymba!


Q

smuggymba is referring to H.R.3012

[imdeng]

I think Spec or some other Guru did post a summary of how dates will move if HR3012 is passed and implemented in its current form. IIRC - both EB2I and EB3I benefit greatly with wait times down to almost current for EB2 and just a few months for EB3. Although, I don't have much confidence that the bill will become law anything soon.

Gurus - how will the predictions/dates move after 3012? Thanks a lot.

[qesehmk]

I haven't read 3012 in detail. Analyis below is based on my understanding that 3012 is basically 1) removal of country cap from EB 2) increase ofcountry cap to 15% in FB.

If my understanding above is correct - here is what will happen to EB category post 3012 is passed.
1) USCIS will no longer publish dates by country. The dates will be strictly for an entire category.
2) EB1 5 4 will stay current
3) EB2 will jump by 1.5 years (from where EB2IC are. of course this means retrogression for EB2ROW)
4) EB3 will jump by 1.5-2 years (from where EB3IC are. of course this would mean dates going back for EB3ROW)
5) EB2ROW will not see a single approval for 2-3 years (take it with grain ofsalt in case there are EB2ROW cases from 2007-8-9 etc)
6) EB3 ROW's wait time will jump.
7) EB category will continue to be backlogged since overall EB demand is more than 140K when looked over past 7-8 years. Although in near future 3012 will result in signficant backlog reduction.
8) Most importantly 3012 will result in extremely well run DOS and USCIS since the schackles of per country are removed and tehy are only left to deal with categories. So 3012 will pave way for next round of reform where the overall cap needs to be increased sufficiently.



no problemo. Can you update the thread and post you views once HR3012 is passed. Thanks as always.

[suninphx]

I haven't read 3012 in detail. Analyis below is based on my understanding that 3012 is basically 1) removal of country cap from EB 2) increase ofcountry cap to 15% in FB.

If my understanding above is correct - here is what will happen to EB category post 3012 is passed.
1) USCIS will no longer publish dates by country. The dates will be strictly for an entire category.
2) EB1 5 4 will stay current
3) EB2 will jump by 1.5 years (from where EB2IC are. of course this means retrogression for EB2ROW)
4) EB3 will jump by 1.5-2 years (from where EB2IC are. of course this would mean dates going back for EB3ROW)
5) EB2ROW will not see a single approval for 2-3 years (take it with grain ofsalt in case there are EB2ROW cases from 2007-8-9 etc)
6) EB3 ROW's wait time will jump.
7) EB category will continue to be backlogged since overall EB demand is more than 140K when looked over past 7-8 years. Although in near future 3012 will result in signficant backlog reduction.
8) Most importantly 3012 will result in extremely well run DOS and USCIS since the schackles of per country are removed and tehy are only left to deal with categories. So 3012 will pave way for next round of reform where the overall cap needs to be increased sufficiently.

There is a provision on 15-10-10 till 2014 for 'transition' ..so EB2-ROW who are currently in the system will have better chance.

[vizcard]

I haven't read 3012 in detail. Analyis below is based on my understanding that 3012 is basically 1) removal of country cap from EB 2) increase ofcountry cap to 15% in FB.

If my understanding above is correct - here is what will happen to EB category post 3012 is passed.
1) USCIS will no longer publish dates by country. The dates will be strictly for an entire category.
2) EB1 5 4 will stay current
3) EB2 will jump by 1.5 years (from where EB2IC are. of course this means retrogression for EB2ROW)
4) EB3 will jump by 1.5-2 years (from where EB2IC are. of course this would mean dates going back for EB3ROW)
5) EB2ROW will not see a single approval for 2-3 years (take it with grain ofsalt in case there are EB2ROW cases from 2007-8-9 etc)
6) EB3 ROW's wait time will jump.
7) EB category will continue to be backlogged since overall EB demand is more than 140K when looked over past 7-8 years. Although in near future 3012 will result in signficant backlog reduction.
8) Most importantly 3012 will result in extremely well run DOS and USCIS since the schackles of per country are removed and tehy are only left to deal with categories. So 3012 will pave way for next round of reform where the overall cap needs to be increased sufficiently.

This post falls squarely in the "Predictions" category as opposed to "Calculations :D

the odds of HR3012 getting passed before the Presidential elections at the end of 2012 are slim to none (and slim is losing!)

[nishant2200]

dude I noticed that bulletin, this is awesome. Let's hope somehow ppl slip this one up through. I have seen the judiciary hearings of other bills last time I was waiting for this one to come up but it got postponed, and man people do attack ideas with ferocity. I sincerely hope the politicians support this and understand our plea. If the House wants they can make some changes some cuts but still do something.

I firmly always believe in life that a chance is a chance, slim or fat, even a 0.01 probability is worth fighting for than just sitting. This is democracy and opportunity provided to us.


Finally, something official out of Sheila Murthy's office on HR3012. I'd emailed their offices a few times to get them to put something official on their legislative page, but they've done one better.
http://www.murthy.com/bulletin.html
This bulletin will get 1000s of eyeballs. I just hope all the folks that read it realize that these calls have to be made immediately. I've posted on their forum but i'm not sure if it'll be approved.

[immi2910]

I firmly always believe in life that a chance is a chance, slim or fat, even a 0.01 probability is worth fighting for than just sitting. This is democracy and opportunity provided to us.

Well said.

[Pedro Gonzales]

I sincerely think the Murthy bulletin had a direct role in causing the Congressmen offices call lines to get jammed. It came out on Thursday so Friday must have seen unprecedented call volumes, hence the plea to stop calling. If this gets out of the committee, the next set of calls will be to the whole congress (less important i think since the GOP Reps vote in unison, but important nevertheless), and then the important step of calls to the senate.

Tomorrow and Thursday are the first steps. I'm on the road, so I won't be able to access the live recording like i did the last time. Keep giving the rest of us hourly updates, nishant2200 and others.

[Pedro Gonzales]

Just noticed manubhai's disappearance from this thread......

Kyon yaar, baaki sab ko bhadkake patli gali?

[manubhai]

Just noticed manubhai's disappearance from this thread......

Kyon yaar, baaki sab ko bhadkake patli gali?

Pedro bhai... missing me?? I've been busy implanting clones of those committee members. Tomorrow and day after, they will behave exactly as programmed. Godspeed!

[shaumack]

Calender quarter just means 3months. It does not mean it starts in Jan. Fiscal quarter is 13 weeks (52 weeks/4). What the rule states is that SO can happen every 3 calendar months rather than every 13 weeks (which could be mid calendar month)
Bottom line is that it is still unclear as to where the visas for these approvals are coming from. He could just be assuming a certain SO for Q1 and correct it later if it's too high or too low.

All I can tell you is that this explanation come’s from horse's mouth.

Calendar quarter or fiscal quarter both means 3 months with difference being one relies on calendar year which starts in January and other is fiscal/financial year which for US government starts in October. Conundrum to the statement in the law is that it never stated "fiscal quarter" explicitly but rather "calendar quarter". Since for visa allocation in current system, fiscal year precedes eligible calendar year, DOS need to wait upto second fiscal quarter or first calendar quarter to start thinking about spillover.

The law is stated so vaguely that HR 3012 calls for removing quarterly spillover altogether. Although removing it does not affect FA in FIFO model but will affect FD on quarterly basis.


"A) EMPLOYMENT-BASED IMMIGRANTS NOT SUBJECT TO PER COUNTRY LIMITATION IF ADDITIONAL VISAS AVAILABLE- If the total number of visas available under paragraph (1), (2), (3), (4), or (5) of section 203(b) for a calendar quarter exceeds the number of qualified immigrants who may otherwise be issued such visas, the visas made available under that paragraph shall be issued without regard to the numerical limitation under paragraph (2) of this subsection during the remainder of the calendar quarter."
Its that "during the remainder of" that I have been missing.

That is an interesting point that you noted there about "during remainder of quarter". To use this efficiently onus is on USCIS to provide correct load or demand on monthly basis for a quarter, which I doubt is done efficiently for categories that are current (mostly done on quarterly basis). Based on information that I received, my take is still that in any case quarterly spillover cannot be used until March-April realistically. Anomaly to this is yet to be seen.

[skpanda]

i do not see any video options for today's hearing - at the below link..

http://judiciary.house.gov/hearings/mark_10252011.html

is there a different location that its available? or the video option is not available at all?


Edit: Never mind..i found it at home page

http://judiciary.house.gov/index.html (Click on the picture of Video casts).
Thx,
SKPANDA

[gcq]

Will this bill be picked up for markup this week ?

Right now committee is discussing REINS act ( HR 10). There are 3 bills before it can reach to HR 3012. Will it happen this week ?

H.R. 10, the “Regulations From the Executive in Need of Scrutiny Act of 2011”;
H.R. 2870, the “Adam Walsh Reauthorization Act of 2011”;
H.R. 1254, the “Synthetic Drug Control Act of 2011”; and,
H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act”

[nishant2200]

honestly dude, it's very frustrating. they keep punting ours to the end.


Will this bill be picked up for markup this week ?

Right now committee is discussing REINS act ( HR 10). There are 3 bills before it can reach to HR 3012. Will it happen this week ?

H.R. 10, the “Regulations From the Executive in Need of Scrutiny Act of 2011”;
H.R. 2870, the “Adam Walsh Reauthorization Act of 2011”;
H.R. 1254, the “Synthetic Drug Control Act of 2011”; and,
H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act”

[immitime]

Even this bills are FIFO, but unfortunately immigration is not... mark my words obviously this bill may come up by next week Nov 3rd Thursday!.

[immitime]

www.immigration-law.com reports the following The OH law firm

10/26/2011: Out of Six Markup Bills, Two Bills Out of Way, in House Judiciary Full Committee Yesterday

The Full Committee has been in markups of the following six bills, out of which two of the first bills were taken care of yesterday by passing the bills and ordering to report the decision to the full House floor. H.R. 3012 is listed the last and it is hoped that the Full Committee takes up this bill on Thursday's continuing markups for the remaining four bills. H.R. 420, the “Veterans' Heritage Firearms Act of 2011”; H.R. 2870, the “Adam Walsh Reauthorization Act of 2011”; H.R. 1254, the “Synthetic Drug Control Act of 2011”; and, H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act.” Please stay tuned for the 10/27/2011 markups of the Full Committee.

So let us all do our part and wait for the good news! Happy Diwali to all.

[skpanda]

It also states:

10/25/2011: H.R. 3012 Bill Reaches Hottest Potato for the Employment-Based Employers and Immigrants

Congressional legislation monitoring website indicates that at this time the H.R. 3012 bill is the second highest hit site. As the House Judiciary Full Committee starts to take up debate of this bill beginning today, it is likely getting hotter and hotter hereon. Please stay tuned.



www.immigration-law.com reports the following The OH law firm

10/26/2011: Out of Six Markup Bills, Two Bills Out of Way, in House Judiciary Full Committee Yesterday

The Full Committee has been in markups of the following six bills, out of which two of the first bills were taken care of yesterday by passing the bills and ordering to report the decision to the full House floor. H.R. 3012 is listed the last and it is hoped that the Full Committee takes up this bill on Thursday's continuing markups for the remaining four bills. H.R. 420, the “Veterans' Heritage Firearms Act of 2011”; H.R. 2870, the “Adam Walsh Reauthorization Act of 2011”; H.R. 1254, the “Synthetic Drug Control Act of 2011”; and, H.R. 3012, the “Fairness for High-Skilled Immigrants Act.” Please stay tuned for the 10/27/2011 markups of the Full Committee.

So let us all do our part and wait for the good news! Happy Diwali to all.

[vishnu]

VERY importantly - Zoe Lofgren (Democrat) is now a co-sponsor... So the bill now has official bi-partisan support!!!!!!

[Pedro Gonzales]

Good news indeed. I didn't think there was much risk to this passing through the committee and getting to a vote on the floor of the House (although when was always an issue), but this portends well for the bill in senate. The fact that it has a Dem cosponsor may just get it attention from Reid that it wouldn't have otherwise.

Nevada desis, it's time to start making your plans to visit Senator Reid's office.

[manubhai]

VERY importantly - Zoe Lofgren (Democrat) is now a co-sponsor... So the bill now has official bi-partisan support!!!!!!

Vishnu ji - Now THAT is the Diwali gift I was truly expecting from Laxmi ji!!! This IS a pretty big deal indeed! Thanks for putting it up here!

Pedro - You are right... we need to prepare to get to the senators soon. Despite my lack of understanding of the details/politics/etc, having both Lofgren and Smith on this bill, makes it a pretty sure shot to pass the committee at least... whenever they get to it (hopefully soon). I have no clue what games will be played or will need to be played once this reaches the house for a vote. I hope this (presenting a bill to the committee) is not being done by the Reps. purely for making a statement that they understand the issues legal, qualified, employment based immigrants face. I hope they actually stand behind to get it passed in the house. With what I know, these sponsors themselves will need to garner support from other Reps/Senators and convince them of the need to get this into law. Having both sides asking for support for the same thing is indeed much more promising than it was a week ago.

Fingers crossed.

[girish989]

Source: Email from Immigration V****:

On Thursday morning (10/27/11), we are expecting the Judiciary committee in the House to take up our bill H.R. 3012 and vote on it in the first half of tomorrow's session. We expect the bill to pass with big majority in the committee and only 1 or 2 votes may go against this bill in Thursday's vote. This is big news for all of us and most of the credit goes to you for your support in terms of both actions items and contributions.


Hope this passes all the hurdles and becomes a law .....

[jackbrown_890]

This bill is no-where close to becoming a law.
It is still Immigration subcommittee under house judiciary.
it has to go thru the subcommittees and thn to the house floor.
3012 has some chance of making it to the house floor for voting. because of the co-sponsor Smith who is chairman of judiciary committee and majority of the members are republicans and this bill also proposed by republican.
3119 or 2162 by Zoe has very little chance of moving out of subcommittee.

The passage of 3012 without any amendments is good for C/I but bad for ROW.
The best thing can happen for everyone is that: Zoe is also on that subcommittee and she proposes amendments to 3012 (Add recapture). If they do that, they will get some Democrates' support. If not chances are no democrat will support it. But republicans can still pass this bill in the house. But without any house democrat support, senate probably will not consider or pass this bill.

So the best scenario for everyone for now:
1: Bill 3012 (proposed by republican and supported by Judiciary chairman and its republican majority in the house)
2: with visa recapture amendment (by Zoe- a democrat)
3: effective date : Fiscal year 2012 (this would be great with recapture - lot of work for the agencies for next 2 years but good for all EB immigrants
4: Passed by House Judicial in 2 weeks
5: go for house vote by the end of this month
6: go to senate in November (if there is any democrat support since senate is controlled by democrats)
7: passed in senate by November end
8: become a law by December or early


Zoe is co-sponsor now. which is really a great news for passage of this bill.
now the next step would be the passage of this bill from Judiciary unanimously

[vishnu]

jackbrown? have the proceedings started? i am not able to view the video at work. please do keep us posted, if you are able to view.

[Kanmani]

H.R.3012 is up for voting after further amendment discussion ................happening now in the judiciary committee .


Update: Bill is approved by the committee and moving to House floor for consideration

[jackbrown_890]

jackbrown? have the proceedings started? i am not able to view the video at work. please do keep us posted, if you are able to view.

yes, Zoe has proposed an amendment too,,, "dual intent visa fro F1 and L1" plus "W" visa for spouces

[jackbrown_890]

yes, Zoe has proposed an amendment too,,, "dual intent visa fro F1 and L1" plus "W" visa for spouces

RECAPTURE amendment HAS BEEN PROPOSED

[jackbrown_890]

Jack,

Please share the link with live feed, as mine is not working.

Here is the link

http://mfile.akamai.com/65764/live/reflector:39480.asx?bkup=39655&prop=n

[jackbrown_890]

Thanks! It works now.

This is ridiculous,,,
Steve King proposed amendment to remove EB3 category..
hope it won't pass

[jackbrown_890]

This is ridiculous,,,
Steve King proposed amendment to remove EB3 category..
hope it won't pass

i am glad Zoe insisted on point of order,,that amendment is not being considered....

[qesehmk]

Guys this is fascinating to watch the proceedings.

[jackbrown_890]

i am glad Zoe insisted on point of order,,that amendment is not being considered....

great news
It is headed to HOUSE for vote

[qesehmk]

Alright guys i just started following this. But looks like some crazy amendments have been dropped and the bill only has one amendment which increases its chance of passing.
Pedro Jackbrown and other gurus on this matter please educate us what happened here.

[kd2008]

HR 3012 clears Mark up! Goes to House for vote! Time to call your Congressperson for support!

[jackbrown_890]

Alright guys i just started following this. But looks like some crazy amendments have been dropped and the bill only has one amendment which increases its chance of passing.
Pedro Jackbrown and other gurus on this matter please educate us what happened here.
Q
there were few amendments crazy amendments proposed..as i mentioned in my post earlier,,,removing EB3 category (40,000 visas) and making total limit of EB category to 100,000.
Recapture was proposed by Zoe but didn't make it to even vote, "W" visa didnt make it to vote:..i think there was one amendment by Zoe passed, i had to leave my desk when it was being proposed, so i didn't see that amendment,,did Pedro see that amendment?

[suninphx]

HR 3012 clears Mark up! Goes to House for vote! Time to call your Congressperson for support!

KD , great news! Happy Diwali!

[kd2008]

EB1 category was excluded from the removal of per country caps according to Lofgren's amendment. They agreed to this as EB1-ROW would have faced cut off dates if the bill passed as is. That is the only change. Rest of amendments failed including visa recapture. Per country caps for Eb2 and Eb3 will be removed if this becomes a law. MArkup had bipartisan support. Tough road ahead. Please call your Congressperson and demand support for this bill. Please Please do this! Bipartisan support for anything is unheard now in both chambers. So this is very special. We have one God sent chance to better our lot. Take action. Demand support of your Congressperson.